Episode 447 Discussion: 9th December 2013 - Page 4

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Poluk thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#31

Originally posted by: cardio21


Shruti!! U summed it up in 1 line. But the fa t is that RK is still not a flop.. I wonder where are all the producers who were dying to work with him.. Now the ban is off, so what's stopping them?

And normal people react like this but nobody starts shunning their wives the way RK does. He doesn't even show a whit of affection when she is not watching or asleep..


RK has been made flop to suit ST and Co. They have conceived the most unbelievable track possible.

And regards RK's behaviour he is currently too mired in self pity and may be in sub conscious has started blaming Mb courtesy Babaji, I dont know😕

Anyways nothing is normal in MB land.
leelaa9 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#32
Liked an entire episode after ages - as in liked the first part very much, and the latter part was endurable by dint of hoping that a triangle won't be tried again for irritation quotient.
(The fire-rescue episode was appreciable only for the Rishbala scenes, with every other character an irritant in the episode.)

Charu, Shruti, superb points.

While there was a great deal of clunk at some points in the episode, it was almost nonexistent compared to the level of clunk involved in the nonsensical majbooris that were used to make the entire track possible but have now been conveniently forgotten for motivation and reasoning that might be inconvenient to remember.

One may presume that having used RK's uncharacteristic reactions and abortion-insistence to ensure the pregnancy was conflicted in possible hope that the couple's estrangement would then be accepted by mass-audience after the convenient miscarriage, the CVs have choked on that ploy and are now trying to bounce either occasionally or consistently on RK's more characteristic reactions to his child and the loss thereof.

His sudden bereaved sentiments for his child are rather less clunky than his manager giving him a speech about the wonderful hit 'they' have had and the huge profit, so that we may know that Bittuji is with Madhu in the land of amnesia about the reason they had both originally acknowledged verbally as to why RK had intended that film in the first place.

And if Bittuji did not think it necessary to advise either his stupidly acquiescent 'chief' or his naively enthusiastic 'bhabhiji' against the clobberingly backfiring idea of RK being sidelined out of the remaining 40% of the film instead of the film-story being changed to accommodate his handicap, then Bittuji's advices and opinions may be regarded as very much in the same category as Padmini's track-conveniencing gems of wisdom in the months prior to her disappearance from the series.

Anyway, if they are finally setting aside at least for a while the nonsensical majbooris and the 'unfeeling husband and father' gambit try for separation-permitting, then the Rishbala scenes on the lakeside and in the bedroom were the first time in many weeks that consecutive scenes of theirs didn't have such ludicrously clunky dialogues about helplessness, support and what-not other manufactured stresses as to make muting of the scenes seem a better option.

This series is in rather a unique situation in that separation is not advisable as a mass-viewership alluring worthwhile budget-expense in terms of multiple sets
Separation is a viewership draw as the variety in a couple's conjugally stable and united life.
Here, the couple have been in every variety of separation, estrangement and disunity for nine successive months with not even any five consecutive episodes showing them as a stable couple with understanding and caring demonstrated beyond merely big talk and grand proclamations by each.
If they get physically separated, then there is only the not particularly mass-appealing prospect of their not even being physically together, in addition to their emotional disunity.

The one point of actual concern is that the CVs seem to repeatedly go against mass-audience tastes rather needlessly even when those tastes could be worked with, and when inadequate TRP induces changing of track, they seem to set aside unfortunate points that they had hammered within those tracks, with the very empty hope that inconvenient points would be forgotten by mass-audience after the days or weeks that those points are no longer convenient to keep in mind beyond.

Showing Madhu as being proactively decisive about ensuring the film was a bad idea if the culmination of the 'film' in the serial was her being glorified above her husband (an intrinsically repelling concept for any track's majority-audience appeal), since it ensured his wealth and her advice resulting in her unintentionally benefitting and his not benefitting in the career benefit that was his reason for making the film. It would have been better that she benefit without her decisions being involved in the process.
But that clunky folly on the part of the CVs might somehow have been glossed over.
The nightmare-point was when they had Madhu lovingly and supportively tell her paralyzed husband that he should step aside and the film-story should be changed completely to focus on her role.
The very fact that he agreed to such a massive change raised the spectre of why not even one person - not even the wife who had considered making the film an urgent matter since it was a matter of preserving her husband's acting stardom - instead suggested the far less drastic change of changing the film-story to accommodate the handicap.
Not even a vamp in a Hindi series is ever shown telling her recently handicapped husband to move aside and let her take the burden of being in centrestage and the mainstay - not unless the marriage is intended to be finished soon.
The CVs should especially never have shown Madhu with that dialogue, considering her proactive actions in the previous track had also been appalling by majority-audience tastes.
Love does not cover everything, especially not for a female lead.
Here, the female lead was willing to go with another man to save her husband's life, and if she had any intent on killing herself afterward, it was pointless not to do it first.
Had she killed either her imprurient pursuer in defence of her wifely fidelity, or if she had killed herself with or without also killing her husband, her decision would have been appreciated and supported in either scenario.
Instead, her decision to stake her prestige (which was also her husband's) to save her husband's life (rather than upholding the more widely mass-supported sentiment that life is less important than dignity and prestige) was not one likely to gain her any approval or supportive sentiment from majority-audience.
For the prolonging of the previous track, the wife was shown deciding to risk her virtue for her husband's life.
For the existence of the heroine track, that same wife was shown deciding to save their house and money by convincing her loving recently handicapped husband and sidelining him and stepping into the centrestage in his place, bizarrely uncomprehending that it would save the wealth but downgrade her husband's prestige.
Yet again, a decision appallingly contravening majority-audience's tastes of acceptable sacrifices.
We have a female lead whose actions are somewhat memorable since no other series has ever dared to make such backfiring moves guaranteed to gain her disapprobation of mass-audience.
Both RK and Madhu have been recklessly characterization-butchered for the plot-convenience of tracks.
But while RK lost on several fronts exponentially in each consecutive track without gaining intent, Madhu's one shield for her mass-disapproved actions in the previous tracks was that she gained nothing herself from any of it, neither expectedly nor unexpectedly.
But in this track she has gained exponentially.
The female lead becoming heroine or model is anyway not luring for majority-audience viewership. And if she becomes heroine and overshadows her husband by her insistences and his wealth, gaining professional approbation and costing him in professional detriment, then it is rather like giving majority-audience a reason to hold her career ever resuming in specific averse opinion and give her husband an even longer extension on his very long rope, encompassing any unappreciable behaviours on his part with the understanding that his losses and detriment were due in considerable part to having been far too acquiescently loving a husband, with perhaps lesser professional detriment had he stuck with his original opinion and rejected his wife's enthusiastic but consistently backfiring advices.
Basically the CVs have messed up on a confounding scale.
If Madhu was to be shown in more than one film, without track-closing due to inadequate viewership, it was essential that she not be shown as more than her husband. Equal, yes. More, no. Instead, they did exactly the added demotivation to hold an already mass-unappreciated glamour career for the female lead in even further aversion and disinterest by mass-audience.
Male leads are generally forgiven even for adultery, depending on their extent of mass-popularity beyond being half of the couple.
So the worry is that if the CVs try to actually go on such a repugnant tangent for RK in the hope of getting Madhu the heroine-continuance mass-viewership support that her miscarriage did not, they may find themselves again at point non plus as regards mass-support for the wife (whose career took off consequent to her advice, at her husband's expense, and ended up professionally overshadowing him) even after having gone to whatever outrageous lengths in the process.
So rather desperately hoping the CVs don't try for such an unrewarding gamble assured of massively flubbing, and avoid trying to get RK mass-disapproval with outrageous actions that may instead be understood and condoned by most of the majority-audience, thanks to the sledgehammeringly appallingly helpless scope of the majbooris, followed by his manager, director, aunt-in-law and the media all crowing about his wife's success and referring as the producer to a man for whom his ego - represented in large part by his stardom - is perhaps dearer than his very life.
Wish the CVs/channel might be prudent at least after such a prolongedly depressing phase of so many months, maybe keep in mind the consistently backfiring outcomes of their unsuccessful gambits in the past nine months, rather than repeat blunders that would add distaste to the story when they consistently end up having to repeatedly backtrack due to inadequate massive viewership and consequently proportionately reined budget.
Edited by leelaa9 - 11 years ago
Krinya thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#33
@Kashish, before passing any judgement, we'll have to consider the character in question too...we're watching a story of 2 flawed people here and what does that mean exactly? ke RK puts up a good fight, be like Madhu, undestand her, shower his love on her, everything is back to normal? he doesn't look at any random girl, goes back to Madhu and act as if nothing happened? there may be a reset button on somebody's life (like super humans like Madhu) but it may not be easy for RK, so what? if he's acting inhuman so be it...he was never a sooraj beend type character n even perfect characters have their flaws, their perfection is their flaw...like Madhu...there is a constant endeavour of making everything perfect around her..tht's her only aim !

at the time of unwedding and whatever he did with Madhu, he was guilty abt it, he knew he was wrong and Madhu was right..but here it's the opposite...Madhu cud forgive him and he always appreciated it but he CANNOT become like her...She tried to mould him into some other person , but woh mitti nahi badal sakti... her expectations from him (and yours also) may be of a normal person in love but this is RK we're talking about...he's the same person who blamed himself for his father's suicide..he's the same person who didn't forgive his mom for remarriage and didn't talk to her for 15 years...was it Radha's fault there? no ! today he has started treating Madhu like Radha , it's important to understand why ! this is the same person who believed tht Madhu is ready to divorce him for dead Sultan so why are we surprised tht he holds Madhu responsible for being careless abt their baby? he's the same RK who humiliated Madhu in the party just to get his point across ...yes, unlike Radha, Madhu is after his life to talk to her, to be normal like her and forget everything...she may succeed..i dun know when..but her approach of solving every problem is ridiculous..bec. she's too self absorbed and trusts her own methods ...


Madhu's pleading eyes, Madhu's loving gestures don't move him...that doesn't mean he doesn't care for her...he went to see her in the chawl didn't he? now if he acts indifferent to her , that does not mean it's all over b/w them...we fight with the ppl. we love, we ignore them, we treat them harshly, it's just a state of mind at tht moment...it's been only 3 days since the death of his baby but his behavior right now is a result of the last six months of frustration..of what he went through...now when he is fighting back, trying to forget everything by distracting his mind, we're calling him characterless..fine, he shouldn't be talking to random girls bec. he's supposed to be totally devoted to Madhu...but you tell me, don't we meet many people in the walk of life and appreciate them? can there be only one type of relationship b/w a man and a woman?



If Madhu forgave him for unwedding, then he also saved her from Sultan...are we making a balance sheet here? who did more , who sacrificed more etc. etc. she was there for him when he needed her but it's not as if he never reciprocated her feelings...



Sorry, i cannot sympathize with Madhu, i know nobody will agree with me but she deserves this kind of treatment from RK..although i'm not sure if , even THIS will set her mind straight. abhi bhi she doesn't understand the severity of the situation n thinks of making gobi parathe to please her husband ! pahleez!
Edited by _charu_ - 11 years ago
cardio21 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#34
@Charu.. I always understood the undercurrents of RK's personality but still some things still leave me bewildered.. How can RK who wanted to kill the baby is crying like a hormonal pig. Suddenly, he lost his bachcha, when we know he wanted to kill the child like <5 days ago..

I never supported madhu or her actions.. But can't help feeling sorry for a girl who is constantly being humiliated by the love of her life. Her husband makes her a laughing stock in front of te women who hate her existence. She is constantly being accused of killing her baby.. Every time she tries to fake a smile, she is moved to tears..

I don't expect RK to shower love on madhu, but she deserves some human treatment.. I understand she is a dumb woman, but she is human too no matter how much God complex she suffers from.

RK who hated his mom because she kinda picked her family over her son, and never put up a fight for her son..

But madhu is trying to do whatever she can to make him happy, only to meet with taunts, and insults hurled at her.

And no matter how mad one is at his spouse, a man like RK would not cross a line.. Why can't he buy a guy friend with his new found money and bond with him for drinks.. Why a woman?
I have already mentioned that I am all for girl guy friendship, but after wedding finding solace in an opposite sex person can border to cheating anytime.. So why play with fire??
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Posted: 11 years ago
#35
Charu,

I was saying the same thing the other day about rk treating mAdhu just like Radha.keep them close but punish them by not showing his love or care.
Both of them are close to his heart but he can not forgive them easily if he feels they have wronged him.
He is still old RK in this aspect.
Poluk thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#36
Kashish I can only empathasize with one of RK's points you said above and that is the child.
Regarding the rest of the points his behaviour is actually crap.

Even if he is one hell frustrated, he should not go around making special friends.

And being frustrated with your wife is one thing, misbehaving or acting moody in private is ok (since he himself is hurting) but humiliating her in front of the world is not condonable.

But regards the child, at the point of his demanding abortion it was just a new pregnancy. Father's don't get attached to the child immediately after its conception.

But hearing the hearbeat, seeing it on ultrasound, makes a huge difference. Love starts developing. From an unknown abstract quantity the child had become something tangible.

PS: Papaya are pineapple are banned in pregnancy. In some ayurvedic abortion medicines their essence is used. My gynaec told this to me when I was carrying my son. So his point of papaya is not wrong. In fact which pregnant woman diets or runs if she actually cares about the child?


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Posted: 11 years ago
#37

Originally posted by: cardio21


Shruti!! U summed it up in 1 line. But the fa t is that RK is still not a flop.. I wonder where are all the producers who were dying to work with him.. Now the ban is off, so what's stopping them?

And normal people react like this but nobody starts shunning their wives the way RK does. He doesn't even show a whit of affection when she is not watching or asleep..


Sorry to interrupt. I have seen worse men in reality in my own family.Men whose only real problem is a more successful wife than themselves,who believes it is their right to insult and ignore her just for the sake of allowing her to pursue a career.I know couples who vehemently hate and be cruel to each other but stay together out of social compulsions. In each of those cases the woman has a high flying career.
Edited by subashni - 11 years ago
Krinya thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#38

Originally posted by: Poluk

Kashish I can only empathasize with one of RK's points you said above and that is the child.

Regarding the rest of the points his behaviour is actually crap.

Even if he is one hell frustrated, he should not go around making special friends.

And being frustrated with your wife is one thing, misbehaving or acting moody in private is ok (since he himself is hurting) but humiliating her in front of the world is not condonable.

But regards the child, at the point of his demanding abortion it was just a new pregnancy. Father's don't get attached to the child immediately after its conception.

But hearing the hearbeat, seeing it on ultrasound, makes a huge difference. Love starts developing. From an unknown abstract quantity the child had become something tangible.

PS: Papaya are pineapple are banned in pregnancy. In some ayurvedic abortion medicines their essence is used. My gynaec told this to me when I was carrying my son. So his point of papaya is not wrong. In fact which pregnant woman diets or runs if she actually cares about the child?



it's the opposite with me Shruti...I find his bacha jaap unreasonable while in all other cases, he's quite normal...why cry over a dead foetus? he may be shocked but it's not that he's impotent or Madhu cannot carry a baby in the future...miscarriages are very normal and they may not have any particular reason..but this has become a mental roadblock for him so he won't be satisfied till he's convinced tht Madhu was not careless with the baby but his own family was trying to harm them.


Madhu was not having papayas, the papaya talk was ridiculous..


he was not humiliating her on the breakfast table, she pushed him to the edge..she should not be too stubborn or pushy with him, he will snap at her..any disturbed person will...the best option for them wud have been to stay away from each other for a while..he wud have come back running to her and she wud have got a timeout..
subashni thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#39
@Charu. As you wrote I expected this behavior from R.K post Sultan fiasco. because like Radha Madhu decided what is good for R.K. So both were in the same level .But he understood madhu. which I felt a clunk. CV's conveniently mould their larger than life character to suit the track.But still I sympathize with Madhu. she fell madly in love with R.K. Maybe it is her destiny her so called nakshatra dosha😆 Baccha jaap is for the merci of audience.otherwise what he talks won't make an iota of sense to majority of viewers.Not that it is important for him to appear sane but they can't risk too much butchering.He is after all the hero of the series.The heroine would get sympathy only when the hero falsely accuses her of a crime they could connect with as a horrid one.Many would accept if he accuses her of overshadowing him or damaging his career. As Poluk rightly said men who are jealous of their wives are plenty in our country. But a man who accuses a wife of killing her own child is rare and people hate him and naturally pity the wife.this is the secret behind his new found love for the baby he never cared baring a painting.
Edited by subashni - 11 years ago
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Posted: 11 years ago
#40
Firstly I don't get it how Madhu become more successful than RK by giving only one super hit movie (from which RK has also gain the position of a successful producer) Whereas RK has given back to back super hit for the past one year and he is still the superstar. I think more than media his near and dear ones has push his self confidence to zero level by continuous japp of Madhubala Superstar.If new star comes that does not mean old star faded away For example Hrithik Roshan came at that time everyone was comparing him with SRK by saying srk days are gone blah balh but what happen he have not replace srk yet and their comparison was bound to happen as both were male but here how can a heroine take the place of a hero and a superstar consider himself as a flop without giving any flop

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