Nausena-Pt5-JA not Fiction-AKBAR-a TITLE?.P27+ MAHACHUCHAK BEGUM - P30 - Page 8

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ayushimehra thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#71

In 1850, the diamond was confiscated from the Sikh Empire by the British East India Company and became part of the British Crown Jewels when Queen Victoria was proclaimed Empress of India in 1877. The diamond was traditionally known as "Kuh-e nur" in the 19th century after the British conquest of India. The diamond is currently set into the Crown of Queen Elizabeth and is on display at the Tower of London.
i think Britishers not take the throne with him. they only
went with him;;;;;kohinoor, diamomd.


KDR81 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#72

Originally posted by: preeti.r


Image 3 , the one which depicts women in the windows watching and Akbar receiving the spoils of the war,is it not possible that these women are not the Mughal women but instead are wife's or family of the Uzbeks who lost the fight.


Reason : Akbar himself is still sitting outside the fort of Jaunpur, the spoils are being brought out from the fort gates and the women seem to be inside the fort, why would the Mughal women be inside the fort when Akbar has encamped near the fort and if the Mughals have occupied the fort then why would Akbar be using the make shift tent instead of some solid structure inside the fort.

unless the top portion of the miniature is reflecting Agra, which is also possible as in some miniature they have put together a couple of scenes or sequence of events together .

By this I am not at all contesting that women in the Mughal era were given importance , infact if you go by EK serial Akbar is spending 80% of his time surrounded and advised and bullied ( ok not always ) by them.😆




Hi Preeti,
Abhay is in time crunch hence here is the answer from me...😊
The women in picture is a depiction of Mughal women in all probability...the reasons are as follows:

1.The makeshift tents were treated as daytime Darbars when Kings were out for wars or trips...It was easier and safer for the king to deal with senas and defeated clan people coming every now and then , rather than dealing inside any fort.😳
( If u notice carefully, even in the serial they show such makeshift tents and Shades ..even inside forts and outside...)

2.As we all have come to know that sometimes Royal women did accompany the King on his voyages,so, when they were there ,naturally they used to stay inside the owned forts and palaces...for safety and comfort. Also, their curiosity in peeping out tells us , they cannot be from the defeated clan, as in that case they would be either bundled inside the fort under strict supervision or huddling together out of fear and apprehension..😊

3.Note the attitude of people inside the fort apart from the women...They are in relaxed posture talking and looking out from balconies ...Would a defeated clan behave like this?? No...so these people are in all probability part of Mughal clan only who took the fort .

Regards,
Kamal


preeti.r thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#73

Originally posted by: KDR81



Hi Preeti,
Abhay is in time crunch hence here is the answer from me...😊
The women in picture is a depiction of Mughal women in all probability...the reasons are as follows:

1.The makeshift tents were treated as daytime Darbars when Kings were out for wars or trips...It was easier and safer for the king to deal with senas and defeated clan people coming every now and then , rather than dealing inside any fort.😳
( If u notice carefully, even in the serial they show such makeshift tents and Shades ..even inside forts and outside...)

2.As we all have come to know that sometimes Royal women did accompany the King on his voyages,so, when they were there ,naturally they used to stay inside the owned forts and palaces...for safety and comfort. Also, their curiosity in peeping out tells us , they cannot be from the defeated clan, as in that case they would be either bundled inside the fort under strict supervision or huddling together out of fear and apprehension..😊

3.Note the attitude of people inside the fort apart from the women...They are in relaxed posture talking and looking out from balconies ...Would a defeated clan behave like this?? No...so these people are in all probability part of Mughal clan only who took the fort .

Regards,
Kamal



Thanks for clarifying Kamal, yes you are right that's possible. 😊
sunram thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#74
For what it is worth a link to influence of women in Mughal empire quite interesting read


http://pu.edu.pk/images/journal/uoc/PDF-FILES/%2812%29%20Dr.%20Rukhsana%20Iftakhar_87-3%281%29.pdf
Cleo12345 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#75

Originally posted by: ayushimehra


In 1850, the diamond was confiscated from the Sikh Empire by the British East India Company and became part of the British Crown Jewels when Queen Victoria was proclaimed Empress of India in 1877. The diamond was traditionally known as "Kuh-e nur" in the 19th century after the British conquest of India. The diamond is currently set into the Crown of Queen Elizabeth and is on display at the Tower of London.
i think Britishers not take the throne with him. they only
went with him;;;;;kohinoor, diamomd.




I saw kohinoor diamond at the tower of London many years ago. I was barely 6-7 yrs old but still remember a few things distinctly. It was not displayed as a part of Queen's crown. There was a big round- ovalish white diamond and two smaller diamonds on each each side. If I remember correctly, the guide said that the smaller ones were broken pieces of the original kuh- e-nur. At that age, I was not impressed with its appearance. It was big but no lusture. Almost ' it needs a cleaning' appearance. Hope I am not confusing it with some other diamond but I doubt it. My dad briefly explained the history behind it. Wasn't Maharaja Ranjit Singh the last Indian king to have it?
Edited by Cleo12345 - 11 years ago
history_geek thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#76

Originally posted by: knumnum

1. Does the presence of ladies in the portraits speaks something of women's position in that era?

Abhay, I do think that ladies played a very important role and i dnt think they dedicated their lives to kitchen politics entirely. In fact, I think Ruks and MUZ were powerful ladies to have got such high honor of issuing farmans and after reading ur thread about MUZ, it turns out to be that she is a fine business lady who controlled everything just sitting right in the palace and as for me, she is the first one in the entire history that I have heard to have earned money by herself.

If the show depicts atleast 25% of what MUZ actually achieved, then I would think they have succeeded in bringing out the truth.


2. Also, about the expertise of the painters of those times, that in an illustration of a size comparable to 20x30 cms, they could display such fine scenes, with delicate details.??..👏

Akbar really gave India such beautiful artistic works, but we are so damn unfortunate that we could not save them. And even more unfortunate thing is that our govt or people are not even making an attempt to bring them back to our country😕.


3. Would also like to hear about the destruction / losses of historical treasures at the hands of various agencies..?.?..

As said above, i get so pissed off thinking about the careless attitude that our govt or ppl have about the historical buildings or stuff.

In Sep, wen I visited Taj Mahal, the sight was so depressing. The maintenance sucks big time. And let me not even mention the things tat the indian visitors did thr. There are scratches all over the place on marble with the names and wat not.

Even now, I feel so upset thinking about it. We do not even respect the heritage we have. Foreigners who were there visiting were so respectful, but we indians do not even have the decency that pictures should not be taken inside the mausoleum (this is jus one eg for such an instance).

4. Also, regarding the fight on boats.?? This was interesting.

Yes, this is exciting stuff. If Akbar had a heir who was atleast half smart and intelligent as himself, then I cant imagine what else we would have got as treasures and innovations. But sadly, none of his heirs and grand sons have got that kind of intelligence to take Mughal era to new heights.

Regards,

Krishi



Thanx for sharing your interesting views. I have added my observations here.😊

Point 1
Well said..!..
Since, your answer is from perspective of the show. So, i am responding in similar manner. As you mentioned MUZ controlling many affairs, right from palace. Yes, royal ladies need NOT go out and settle/negotiate the deals/business themselves, barring few exceptional events. They ran the trade through a well-developed network of people. Infact, it was a very hierarchical and complicated activity. Not so simple as it sounds.
Also, MUZ did not earned money ONLY for herself. She is reported to have been involved in public welfare works, promoting education, etc. apart from Ship business and managing Haj pilgrims, to name a few. Will add details when i get the references.😊


Point 2
One of the biggest contributions of Akbar to Hindustan was the peculiar artistic flavour which developed in his times. Regarding our government, i feel they are trying(though need to step up the efforts) to get back some of these historical treasures back, but thanx to red-tapism and bottlenecks in our bureaucratic culture, it seems things are moving at a turtle-pace. Though, recent issue of getting some idols back from abroad, which were stolen from South Indian temples has gained prominence. Govt. also formed a team of experts from CBI and other agencies to investigate the matter. Lets see, how this proceeds.!. For a change, issues are progressing..!


Point 3
I agree to this. This is the state of majority here.


Point 4
No doubt on intelligence of Akbar, but if you talk about innovations of his son Jahangir, then he was also a good "innovator". Many remarkable observations are credited to him also, though they are not on political front mainly. Some are mentioned in Tuzuk-i-Jahangiri also. If you want will add some points later, which are very common.😊 All on all, they had achievements but they were NOT Akbar for he was the ONLY one who 'LateR' transformed into the Insan-e-Kamil.

Also, regarding the intelligence of Akbar, i would say it was due to Akbar's policies, that Mughal Empire could flourish for so long. He prepared the ground for the Empire. Abu'l Fazl records that, as Akbar inherited the visionary blood of Hamida Bano Begum's great grandfather, who was a Seer, and so, he had the RARE ability to turn his adversities into his strengths.

About the same vision Abu'l Fazl mentions that Akbar's marriage with the princess of Amer(HK/MUZ), was due to the DIVINE vision, Akbar had in Ajmer Sharif. (Did you notice this in the show.?.)
Edited by history_geek - 11 years ago
rupambika thumbnail
Posted: 11 years ago
#77
  1. Abhay , plz tell us about the palaces owned by mariam uz zamani in mughal empire... and had she any jagirs under her???????? I knw u hav faced questions on Akbar and MUZ's CHILDREN so many times... n I m very much eager to knw about their children...😊.😊..😊.I hope u will post the info sooon.
Edited by rupambika - 11 years ago
rupambika thumbnail
Posted: 11 years ago
#78
  1. Was it a custom to give Nazranas during mughal time to higher authorities by mansabdars or lower ranked officials?????? BESIDES MUZ is there any other queens known to receive jewels and nazranas from noble man???????😉?😉?😉?😉?
Edited by rupambika - 11 years ago
history_geek thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#79

Originally posted by: rupambika

  1. Abhay , plz tell us about the palaces owned by mariam uz zamani in mughal empire... and had she any jagirs under her???????? I knw u hav faced questions on Akbar and MUZ's CHILDREN so many times... n I m very much eager to knw about their children...😊.😊..😊.I hope u will post the info sooon.




Palace: ->
As per present info:
In Agra, Fatehpur Sikri, Allahabad, reported to be in Lahore also.
But Lahore Fort has suffered severe damage.

Jagir: ->
As far as i know, she was given the Jagir of Bayana near Agra. It is said that Bayana was very close to Akbar's heart and also to his grandfather Babur, as Babur had won a very important battle near this place in 1527. Probably, that's why she was given this Jagir.

MUZ-Akbar kids: ->
We'll post soon. Need to compile our info.
Edited by history_geek - 11 years ago
rupambika thumbnail
Posted: 11 years ago
#80
Thanx 4 ur valuable info ABHAY,😊 👏 😊 so MUZ had the jagir BAYANA which was close to the heart of AKBAR, 1------ were there any jagirs given to RUKAIYA and SALIMA ????????? 2-----U hav said in ur prev post that NURJAHAN had more jagirs than MUZ, is it true?????? 3----why mughal queens were given jagirs ?????

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