Discussion Topic - I do or I don't

peaches thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#1

Hi guys!

The following questions relate to the this week's episodes relating to A&J's wedding and misunderstanding.

  • If you were Armaan (put yourself in Armaan's shoes and try to think what he must be thinking), and saw CJ and Jassi in a hotel room, would you require any further justification?
  • Would you ever be able to get these thoughts out of you mind?
  • Would you trust your wife/husband ever?
  • What explanation could there possibly be for being caught in this uncompromising situation would you be wiling to listen?
  • Can Armaan's decision to not marry Jassi be justified (if that happens)?


Please remember what Armaan saw.....he saw CJ naked getting
out from the same bed Jassi was sleeping in.


  • Is Jassi wrong for not saying anything? Maybe she is hurt due to the trust factor and has not idea what Armaan is talking about, but do you feel she should be trying to open up some more with Armaan to clear this misunderstanding.
  • In addition, what kind of impact will this bring into their lives if Armaan and Jassi do go ahead with the marriage without clearing misunderstanding?

(I believe that there are too many things to discuss,
don't feel compelled to answer each question.
Feel free to submit a general response if you'd prefer.)😃

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shiverz thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#2

First of all, nice topic Peaches!

Well, I think that trust is a big key in a successful relationship. If the two people don't completely trust each other, there are bound to be problems ahead. In Armaan and Jassi's case, I agree that the hotel incident was definetely shocking for Armaan, but in my opinion, I feel that he should have realized that Jassi would never even dream of doing such a thing. But yes, it's hard to believe that something you saw with your very own eyes is not true.

Also, this incident is a difficult situation since Jassi doesn't really even know what is going on. And I agree that Jassi is and should be hurt about the "trust factor" and Armaan even thinking that she could do such a thing, however, I don't think this is the time to be hurt and stay silent-- the misunderstanding should be sorted out ASAP!

However, since this show is a serial after all, T&D are probably thinking of the longest possibilities to stretch this misunderstanding. We can only hope that this issue will be resolved soon!

Sharila thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#3
They both are not speaking out openly. As long as this is the case nothing will be solved. Armaan should have confide in her. Then again he is too hurt to even imagine what he saw in the first place. There is lots of if's, and but's how about some how's, and when's. I think they both need to sit down & confront each other rather than having ego thinking when will my future spouse will confide in me, and tell me that one wrong doing has been done by me.
Deepa_iyer thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#4

Peaches, as usual a very relevant and interesting topic.

Now, J is not my fiance, I assure you. And I knew from the update that she had been framed by Creepy.

Yet, when I actually saw Creepy in a Chaddi, (And to add insult to injury, that too in a particularly offensively bright pink chaddi) bending over J, I was rattled. I was disgusted. I was horrified.

All rationale fled from my usually logical and broad minded brain, like spirits would flee from an enchantress and I was in shock for a long time.

I was not sure if I would ever be able to see J without remembering that horrible, cheap and nauseating scene. My first impression was I was witnessing a brothel scene. D*** T n D n G n K.

I have still not got over the shock.

And don't get fooled by the myth of Creepy's chaddi.

Chaddi was wearing chaddi to appease the hypo censor board and to prevent the viewers from dying of shocked disgust or else what will happen to their f****** trps and the so called majority whose sympathy is with Mal!!

That means it was a Creepy in his birthday suit with J, in a compromising position, that A saw.

Now, how would you take that? How would you expect any normal man or woman in their proper senses to take that?

Lying down?

Or just erase it from your mind because you are 'once upon a time playboy'?

One of the reactions that people expected from A in this situation was for him to have entered the room and demanded an explanation from J or at least smashed Creepy's face.

Now, if Deepa Iyer would have been Armaan, she would have just stormed in to the room and kicked Creepy where it mattered and if this would not have woken up her spouse, the poor thing would have been rattled back to her senses and seeing her clothed and Creepy showing off his best asset, there would have been several shocks, counter shocks, curses, counter curses, rona dhona, ruthna manana and in short an interesting and heated showdown but in the end both of us reconciled and back in the Bus to Mumbai, our love made stronger by yet another victory and us eagerly looking forward to our wedding and Creepy probably wising he were dead.

Unfortunately, Armaan is not Deepa Iyer. He takes things at face value, is gullible and it is in his nature to push things under the carpet and not face them till he is forced to. He has also been known to take a break from his characteristic self but this time the sight that was presented to him, out of the blue, was just too much for him, in fact for anybody in his position and it is unfair that a sensible reaction be expected of him.

One thing I cannot comprehend is why the way he reacted is being used against him?

In such situations, there is no right or wrong reaction.

Each one reacts in a different way, while countering the shock of your life. A usually cool and collected person may react violently and vice versa, especially when absolutely unprepared for it.

Just imagine, after nerve racking suspense, you are finally able to track down your would be, hours before your marriage and you go to meet her with great relief and expectations and the sight that greets you is her, wrapped in a sheet to cover her modesty, entertaining a nude Creepy, who's just arisen from her bed with a satisfying and triumphant look; will you have the guts to barge in, confront the love of your love in that condition?

Most importantly have the guts to confront yourself with what you saw?

The main thing is the fear that she will confirm what you saw. The most natural reaction is to run away.

Hoping it was all a nightmare.

Two drinks and everything will clear.

After such a ghastly shock, a man will need to get out of the shock and only then will he be able to get his balls together and do some meaningful thinking. And he's not a seer. Why would he suspect Creepy?

But yes. He should have thought twice that the woman in there was JASSI. Not any woman. But as I say, eyes and the sight that they show you – pretty dangerous.

Visual effects are more damaging than auditive.

When I heard about this infamous scene, I found it repulsive. When I watched the re-run out of curiosity, I was appalled. My hatred for Creepy was like never before and if he had been before me then, I would have not even hesitated for a second before murdering him. See what I mean?

This time, it was not a mere poster that could be manipulated. This time it was as real for A as the blood that was gushing through his veins. I don't blame him at all for the way he reacted.

In fact, I applaud A for coming out of his shock as quickly as his nature allowed him and decided to follow Emerson in that 'action is God!'

Even after witnessing the most disturbing scene of his life, he is willing to give J a chance and is hoping against hope that somehow she will prove it all wrong, which is remarkable and laudable. Like a child, he hungrily begs her to solve the problem like she always does and is willing to even overlook her offence if only she will not hide the truth from him.

This is love. He believes he has that much right over her that he may demand an explanation for what he saw. He thinks he is right and is being sensitive and giving his love a chance because what he saw cannot be wrong.

For him, there is no question of there being an alternate explanation, but his hearting is subconsciously seeking for it, from the person he still trusts, in his heart of hearts. According to him, he is in fact honoring the 'trust' factor and expects J to seal it.

Another complaint against him is that he was not being vocal enough. He was talking in riddles. Now, do you expect him to describe what he saw to J?

For heavens sake!

After the harrowing experience, isn't it enough that he is seeing that horrid scene every minute of his waking life that he will also have to describe it to his love?

Now, when I accuse my love of infidelity, will I tell him, "Lover, last night at Nainitaal, when I pushed open the chestnut brown door of Room No 739, with an expectant smile, in a Yellow checkered Shirt and Brown slacks, I saw a nude Chaddi in a Bright Pink Chaddi arising from next to you, on the same bed (sleepwell mattress), with a satisfying expression and you were fast asleep, bundled in a golden colored sheet, like you had enjoyed it and were in a bliss and your Yellow colored clothes were all strewn about, on the floor.

So, the apple of my eyes, tell me, did you, in spite of conquering heaven in my arms, the other day, on the dirty floors of the studio, have a virus infest your superior tastes that caused you to indulge in PMS with that repulsive jerk, who resembles a distorted version of the human ancestors, that now are not uncommon in a zoo and sports that unparalleled s*** eating grin? I want to hear from your own mouth."

GIVE ME A BREAK!

I think A's reaction was as natural and as sensible as may be expected from a man in his position.

Coming to J, I always think that woman can make or break a situation.

Because she really is the superior in a man woman relationship and hence shares a greater responsibility, in making it work and ensuring that the man, (who I think is really like a kid and a putty in a woman's hands) does his bit too. And J too could have done better than what she did.

Really?

Let's explore this further.

The reaction that was expected of her was that she gave him a plain "Yes Sir! I did it. What say you to that?" or "No! Mere pati parmeshwar. I am yours only for 7 Janams if not forever. How can you even think of such a thing about your sati savitri?"

But instead, our J, decided to follow her love, become a sphinx and give an answer that could well have been a riddle.

But it was not. She reacted the way any woman, would react when the person she trusted more than herself, who had of late stood by her and had promised her the whole world, charged her with such a heinous crime, of which she was not guilty.

Naturally, her ego will do the talking. Naturally she would like to hurt back the way she was hurt. Ego for ego!

I would have done the same but the way I would have executed this 'ego for ego' business would have been slightly more different.

I would have first of all slapped him and then taken him down memory lane, all the time showing what an angel I have been, enduring every inhumanity from him and how I had been responsible for turning him from a beast to a wonderful human and how he could have ever thought of even imagining such a thing about me.

That should do the trick and that he would try to put in his point and in the process, the truth will dawn on at least one of us and well! Something can he hoped to work out.

But because Jassi jaissi koi Nahin, she chose to deliver Parineeta's dialogue, which was a direct attack on A's male ego, which is always vulnerable and drives the possessor to extreme means and hence the slap.

Also, there is this time factor. A had a lot of time to get out of the shock and then react the way he thought best.

But, J had next to no time. Add to this the fact that Creepy had inflamed her further saying that he had tried explaining things to A in vain and A was in hell bent on mistrusting her.

It was most unfortunate that just as J was coming out of shock and was deciphering what exactly had happened, A came back for their second confrontation. And Miss Ice, gave him what he asked, in his language

As natural as it can be but highly unwise.

I will blame neither A nor J. Each of them reacted true to their characters and like I said, their reactions cannot be termed wrong or right but definitely unwise.

And I wish to God that Chaddi rots in hell, which he will, if the maker of this world, takes pity on us and makes that thick skinned, blind, A** see light, some day. But when he does that, hope he doesn't become J's support systems because w e know what effect support systems have on A, AJ and us, ME, in particular!

I was one of those people who wanted the wedding to take place only after the misunderstandings have been cleared. I am mighty glad that A has taken the first step.

I laud him for taking the most sensible decision of his life in trying to settle matters with J.

There is no point, in allowing a doubt to eat you up from the inside and mar the most beautiful and important relationship of your life by conjecturing god knows what.

Communication, even though it may be faulty initially, always opens up ways for a better future.

Now, that the first step is taken, I want the marriage to happen.

Because what AJ relationship now needs is time spent together.

They need to be together under the same roof, they need to see each other, be near one another so that they may have the opportunity to talk or at least, need to be in immediate vicinity of each other so that their love may rescue them from the world of malice that they have been cruelly thrust in to by a creature from the Planet of Apes, suffering from serious personality disorders.

AJ love each other truly and once they are married, they wouldn't be able to stay from each other for long and clear their differences.

It may look like their relationship can never be the same again even if they reconcile but I think differently.

This has happened with me. I get in to a serious row with somebody I dearly love but when the problem is solved, the bond between us is only strengthened.

Whoever was wrong is chastened in the process and it makes both of you cautious so that the next time something like this threatens to crop up, you will at least think twice before jumping to conclusions.

In the same way, initially AJ might be tongue tied and nursing and probably inflaming their hurt ego but true love always triumphs. One of them at least, (I expect it will be A) will not be able to hold out any longer and initiate an emotional showdown. The result will most likely be reconciliation and understanding things and seeing things in a better light.

Therefore marriage is imperative. In fact a honeymoon trip, far away from the madding crowd is a must. AJ need to be on their own for sometime. I know this sounds perverted but I'd rather they went to Nainitaal. Maybe Bahadur or the hotel fellow might spill some clues or an emotionally high strung A might tell J what he exactly saw. Maybe J will find out clues about Creepy's shareefness.

Or maybe it will become worse!

NO! Better they go away to say Switzerland or the dreamy city of romantic Venice and I am sure their selfless love will bail them out of this tricky situation.

Whew! That was so long and utterly nonsensical, I guess!

Well Kameens, I hope for your sake that you have AJ wedding lined up for us on the morrow.

And we want A to welcome Aashish with welcome hands. Got that? Better get it, Hon! Or you'll regret it for the rest of your life!

And yes. I am PROUD of A and J and am sure that this time too they and their love will honge kaamyaab!

AJ FOREVER!

But, VDD for never!

enigma thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#5

If you were Armaan (put yourself in Armaan's shoes and try to think what he must be thinking), and saw CJ and Jassi in a hotel room, would you require any further justification?

Had been going thru numerous posts critically commenting on armaan's behaviour on not being more vocal about his intentions and feelings. But, if i were in armaan's situation then my reaction too would have been the same. I mean, knowing CJ from close quarters, who incidentally happens to be Jassi's dad's friend, one who finances the company's projects and finding him and jassi in a compromising position and that too just a few hours before the wedding, is plainly too shocking that one would shudder to just think of it. U would surely be stunned beyond extent to react to the situation instantly, collect ur senses, think of the love that u shared et al., all these practical decisions need time and energy..A wide plethora of emotions surge thru u at that moment, that i think it's just not reasonable and kind to expect one to take pragmatic decisions and take stock of the situation instantly.

Afterall, armaan's not a super human being, he is a normal man, with his own weaknesses, frailties and vulnerabilities.Agree that he ran away from the sickeningly depressing scene, but his reaction was of a man in total shock,numbed with disbelief.. But, he did trust and have faith in their love, that he confronted her regarding the entire fiasco, willing her to just,just say and not 'prove' that he was wrong.. The only letdown was that, he did it in his own queer way, but given the circumstances, u just cant help sympathizing armaan and jassi.

Would you ever be able to get these thoughts out of you mind?

I think it would be possible, if the people involved ie., armaan and jassi talk it out more freely and without any reservations. I can understand that it is a painful topic, too distressing to even think of. But then, either of them has to take the initiative to try and understand , afterall it is their life, their future..There's no point in expecting some miracle or some clue to happen to instill a sense of doubt in their preformed conclusions. I just don't think it is possible to relegate these depressing thoughts to the back of ur mind and pretend as though nothing had happened or forget everything, because, eventually, these thoughts would tear u apart, ruthlessly, mentally and emotionally...

Would you trust your wife/husband ever?

Armaan asks jassi,"Did u and Cj stay in the same room? Please tell me that whatever i saw, whatever i understood, everything was just a misonception.."
[he doesn't state clearly what he saw.]
Jassi replies,"If u think it is so, then yes, it is so."
[she doesn't even know what armaan saw.]
At the end of this conversation, i dont think that either of them can trust each other again.
Now, that armaan had had enough time to ponder over things and collect himself, he can be a bit more frank, but not crossing the subltle limits of sensitivity, afterall he considers jassi as his wife... I can understand that he is treading on painful grounds and he is being sensitive about the whole issue, but if armaan and jassi have to regain their trust in each other, they have to clear the air ridden with doubts and misunderstandings(though not of their making..), else the trust is gone forever...

What explanation could there possibly be for being caught in this uncompromising situation would you be wiling to listen?

Love always gives a second chance, it always listens and understands, it may falter at trying situations but it would not breakdown completely.. but only if, love is deep enough, strong enough, true enough, snd selfless enough.

Can Armaan's decision to not marry Jassi be justified (if that happens)?

If they don't understand each other perfectly, if armaan refuses to speak out, if jassi refuses to listen and reason things out, if things are going to remain as they are at the moment, then i won't be surprised if either of them calls of the wedding out of hurt ego and betrayal. You can't blame either of them, though it would be very cruel and unjust if the wedding's off. There is no question of justifying their actions, which i think is normal given the circumatances- it's more along the lines of blaming the cruel and heartless game played by fate with sufficient help from people with bad intentions.

Is Jassi wrong for not saying anything?

Jassi needs time. Too much has been forced on her all at once- the just concluded SH case,the yet to happen wedding, purab's death, armaan's accusation...
her confused state is perfectly understandable.Too may emotional upheavals and she has handled everything single-handedly. Her replies to armaan out of hurt ego are normal- afterall which self respecting woman would be able to handle such an accusation on the day of her wedding. Her initial reactions are acceptable.
But, in my opinion, a woman is stronger mentally and emotionally. So, i think it would augur well for the future if she thinks a bit, and tries to make sense of what armaan is actually trying to say and what is actually happening. I wish she stops being so innocent and gullible. I just can't expect such sensible decisions from armaan, because he has been portrayed all along, as naive and gullible.

what kind of impact will this bring into their lives if Armaan and Jassi do go ahead with the marriage without clearing misunderstanding?

What is the point in getting married if armaan's has his doubts regarding jassi's faithfulness and chastity and jassi is broken and hurt totally, on armaan's lack of trust and belief in her. If they do go ahead with the marriage,it is more like a compromise, more like ridiculing the love they had for each other(and still reluctantly, involuntarily have...)and the wonderful relationship, marriage, which is solely based on love and trust- nothing more, nothing less...


peaches thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#6
Deepa, Sharila, Shiverz, and Enigma this was excellent. I really enjoyed reading all your posts. Excellent!


A very big hand to all of you!!!👏
Edited by peaches - 20 years ago
vasamv thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#7

Deepa has said it all.Totally agree.It was the diabolical plan of CJ that did the damage and any spouse would be flabbergasted to see his beloved in such a compromising position on the eve of wedding.Logic,rationality dont work at such moment.Still Arman had the good sense to ask a clarification.One word "NO" from Jassi would have sufficed.So A is not at fault.seeing is believing and yet he was ready to give a chance to J.

J on the other hand was totally in the dark about the hotel scene and her reply also was appropriate in the circumstances.When she said I was with the other man she did not mean any sexual allignment.

Neither was at fault.Inspite of our disgust for TD we have to admit this was a very clever plan by them.

Jyoti_2006 thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#8

Originally posted by: vasamv

Deepa has said it all.Totally agree.It was the diabolical plan of CJ that did the damage and any spouse would be flabbergasted to see his beloved in such a compromising position on the eve of wedding.Logic,rationality dont work at such moment.Still Arman had the good sense to ask a clarification.One word "NO" from Jassi would have sufficed.So A is not at fault.seeing is believing and yet he was ready to give a chance to J.

J on the other hand was totally in the dark about the hotel scene and her reply also was appropriate in the circumstances.When she said I was with the other man she did not mean any sexual allignment.

Neither was at fault.Inspite of our disgust for TD we have to admit this was a very clever plan by them.

Agree with you Vasamv... TD indeed had a solid plan to start a misunderstanding.....

Shiverz, Sharila, enigma, Deepa excellent views... really enjoyed reading it....they is nothing left to be said...

Edited by Jassidevi - 20 years ago
peaches thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#9
Hi guys!!!

Can I take this futher by asking this...... Is Jassi incriminating herself even more by not saying anything and talk to Armaan in riddles. To armaan this may sound like Jassi is after all guilty and can't exlain herself.
Rumi thumbnail
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Posted: 20 years ago
#10
  • If you were Armaan (put yourself in Armaan's shoes and try to think what he must be thinking), and saw CJ and Jassi in a hotel room, would you require any further justification?

If I were Armaan and saw Jassi and CJ in a hotel room in such a situation , me being a human being would obviously be shocked and i also could not go there in that moment and give CJ some punch, rather , like Armaan i would also silently come out from there.but this would only be the initial reaction,based on that I would not come to the conclusion that there is surely something between jassi and CJ. To clear my confusion and before coming to the conclusion I would definitely require further justification.

  • Would you ever be able to get these thoughts out of you mind?

Before any clear idea about what happened there and before coming to the conclusion that there was nothing between them nobody would be able to get these thoughts out of his mind. That scene was such a dreaded one for a person who is going to marry this girl that it is impossible for him to be free from thinking about that scene.

  • Would you trust your wife/husband ever?

As I said earlier, that the initial reaction of Armaan was quite natural. He canot be blamed fgor thinking in that way about jassi and CJ. But the problem is he is applying only his heart, not his brain. In such cases people have to apply their brains in addition to their hearts. He knows how jassi is. He knows how much she loves him and if jassi was such type of girl then there would definitely be some relation of jassi with purab, not CJ. If jassi could control herself from purab , then what is this CJ? Why should she do it with him all of a sudden? Armaan should apply his brain and ask himself these questions. So, in spite of attacking jassi directly he should ask her what happened in Nainital and how she was in the Hotel with CJ. In this way may be he could find out a clue that CJ was trapping Jassi. It is very easy to find this out, as there was no landslide that night and no cancellation of trains. So it would be very easy to find CJ out. But Armaan is being too much emotional.He should remember how he also was trapped by Rhea and jasi was in his position but jassi applied her brain with her heart and that problem was solved.

The question of trusting or not trusting comes later after finding out the truth. If that was true then this question would arise and then whether he would trust jassi further or not, well, that would be another discussion.

  • What explanation could there possibly be for being caught in this uncompromising situation would you be wiling to listen?

Obviously if I were Armaan I would always want to here that jassi was trapped by CJ and CJ did all these. We know that CJ did not actually do anything with her but if he would do, then also I would be with her if she was only a victim of the situation and did not do anything willingly.

  • Can Armaan's decision to not marry Jassi be justified (if that happens)?

No. I think Armaan's decision of not marrying jassi is not justified. I know being upset in such a situation was very natural. But as I said earlier that armaan should apply his brain not his heart only. He should remember that earlier he was also in such uncomfortable position and jassi did not leave him alone then. May be there is anything wrong with this CJ. May be jassi is innocent, and that is more plausible. Because as far as he knows, jassi loves him only and nobody else. If she did not feel anything for Purab after all these then why would she behave with CJ like that? Armaan should think more and more and apply his brain more and more. He should clearly know from jassi about everything that happened in Nainital. Before knowing everything clearly the decision of canceling the marriage will be highly idiotic and cruel for Armaan.


  • Is Jassi wrong for not saying anything? Maybe she is hurt due to the trust factor and has not idea what Armaan is talking about, but do you feel she should be trying to open up some more with Armaan to clear this misunderstanding.

Yes , jassi is actually hurt due to the trust factor. She has no idea about what Armaan is talking about. But this is also true that Armaan is repeating the words that , he saw everything that happened that night. Here also Jassi is getting too much emotional. She must try to find out how Armaan went there. She must try to know why Armaan is reacting so violently and why did he not meet them if he went there. She must apply her brain that there must be something wrong, otherwise Armaan would not behave in such a way. she must ask what Armaan actually saw. She must try to remember what happened that night, she must try to question herself why she fell asleep suddenly after drinking the coffee.

In short jassi is also not applying her brain, she is being too much upset with that trust factor and the behaviour of Armaan. In this way both of them are not behaving, as they should in such a situation. This is also important for them as they are going to get married and they should be prepared for such incidents after the marriage in their future life also.

  • In addition, what kind of impact will this bring into their lives if Armaan and Jassi do go ahead with the marriage without clearing misunderstanding?

I think clearing this misunderstanding is very urgent before this marriage happens. Otherwise they will never be happy in their future life.. Such confusions destroy beautiful relations. So, at first they should apply their brains and without any quarrel and argument they should solve this mystery at first and then go to marry each other. In this way they should also learn how to handle such situations and this will help to rebuild their trust for each other and in this way they will never leave each other in such situations in their future married life. If that happens, CJ is actually helping them indirectly to create their relationship as solid and a stone.

Edited by Rumi - 20 years ago

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