Siyasat Serial Discussions Siyasat 9th June 2015 WU.....Page1 - Page 6

Originally posted by: myviewprem

thanks mandy

there was a mandy in JA forum are you same or different?

Originally posted by: myviewprem

I am waiting for story to take a leap and Nur Jahan becomes big

Nur Jahan is a interesting character in history

She was an inventor like she invented many perfumes, she was a dress designer etc she was a creative person

She was also a very good politician and administrator. From 1616 till 1627 when Jehangir died she literally ruled Mughal empire with an iron fist and ably at that.

But where she truly failed was when she gave more importance to her ambitions of retaining power through her daughter ladli begum over treating all jehangir's children as equal

Jehangir's kids were real heirs of throne be it khusrau, parvez or khurram and shariyar

But Nur Jahan wanted her daughters husband to be the next emperor so she can have prominence and become defacto ruler thru her son in law

Hence she approached first khurram to marry her daughter than khusrau

Khusrau was a good man and husband by 16th century standards he would not marry for benefits of becoming next emperor he was a loyal husband and hence rejected this proposal

Khurram was also not interested as he loved mumtaz and mumtaz influenced her husband to reject this proposal of Nur Jahan as she did not want any power centers in khurram life other than her

Parvez was a soft guy not interested in becoming emperor and involved in power games

So her only option was shariyar who was actually a good for nothing guy not good in war field or administration etc

As a mother instead of marrying off her daughter to a capable guy Nur Jahan to retain power married her only daughter to shariyar

So Nur Jahan may be good politican and administrator but she failed as a mother on all fronts to all kids

Next was Nur Jahan role as a wife where again she truly failed although she was successful in running kingdom

Salim was a great man to have given his wife freedom so much freedom in 16th century at risk of becoming a laughing stock in society and court(even 21st century men will not give so much freedom to wives and daughters in india and asia). Why Salim did that was one he genuinely had trusted Nur Jahan as she was known to him from childhood and second his ill health forced him to do that. Now if a real good woman and wife got that freedom she could use it to do something constructive. But all Nur Jahan was interested was to show that she is equal or superior to her husband. Hence she was only interested to show off her powers by issuing her coins, attention seeking like refusing to climb stairs in malwa till Jehangir bribed her with gold coins etc she was a big show off compared to other Mughal wives.

Why I say Nur Jahan was a show off is that many other Mughal wives and daughters also have done as much or more work than Nur Jahan for Mughal empire.

One such example is Hamida bano she was the mughl empresss and defacto ruler till Akbar became 20 years old and started handling the kingdom correctly she did not show off sitting in DEK, DEA in emperors throne while her husband died and her son was a teenage kid. She could have who would stop her none but she did not.

Second example is jahanara, I think she was best Mughal empress ever better than nur jahan or mumtaz. From age of 17 when her mom died she was defacto ruler cum empress. With a father in mourning and only an elder brother Dara to rely on she handled the Mughal empire single handedly till her father recovered and later too when he had lost interest in ruling and concentrated on building taj mahal. During Aurangzeb rule too she had great power so much only she could overrule his decisions and issue farmans. But not once she misused and abused her powers. Shah jahan always told if my jani is a boy I would make her emperor.

Third is Zebunissa, a man like Aurangzeb who did not give much importance to woman outside or in family consulted her in many political affairs till she fell foul in his eyes by writing poetry and singing them(or was it her love affair with an army major). Her brothers considered her words as a law. Indeed Akbar II took her permission in prison and celebrated Diwali and raksha bandan in agra much to fury of Aurangzeb although it was banned. Akbar II again went against Aurangzeb and questioned his two elder brothers imprisonment on zebunissa request. It is said that all siblings considered her like a mother figure despite her being imprisoned and would consult and obey her in all matters.

Fourth is mumtaz mahal. Mumtaz had tremendous hold on shah jahan so much that she would guide him on all decision matters in court. When Amar Singh killed his minister and Shah Jahan got scared and retreated from court it was mumtaz who had told him not to return to palace till he punish amar singh. In some matters mumtaz did misuse her powers and love her husband had for her but never openly like nur jahan. Mumtaz only fault is she refused to allow shah jahan other wives to get any prominence and Shaha jahan other kids from his other wives(Yes shah jahan had two elder daughters from first two elder wives, mumtaz was his 4th or 5th wife not first) to get their rightful place in family or any prominence. In that matter mumtza was no less bad or insecure as nur jahan as she never allowed her step kids to get any love of father or any rightful inheritance

Then there was Kahnzadha the elder sister of babar whom he adored and gave all powers. Akbar's three wives Ruqaiah, Salima and Jodha also did not misuse their powers. Neither did Akbar's daughters and Salim's sisters who were given powers by them to handle harem, build independent palaces outside forts etc. But none ever abused their powers outside like nur jahan to promote their kids or interests or favourites.

The real seed of destruction and decline of Mughal empire was sown by nur jahan with her divisive and destructive over dominance policy towards jehangir's kids. Till then no major blood bath really took place between siblings in any generation except Humayun blinding his brother and Akbar killing his nephew. After Nur Jahan came into Mughal family the seeds of distrust between brothers, family blood bathe and killing male members on ascending throne etc started. Its roots lie in nur jahan's devisive policy.

Originally posted by: _zari_

Prem do u have knowledge abt other historical figures as well, i wanted info abt someone, but this one is not related to siyaasat or mughals...

Originally posted by: ghalibmirza

prem, i am upset at the thought of salim killing akbar i hope its a fiction and nothing of this sort happened in reality😕

Nope salim did not kill his father. He died of dysentery and aggravation of a wound received in hunting few years back

Originally posted by: myviewprem

which person? I just started reading on Mughals when I got a project in school and have been reading since then in library and online.

Originally posted by: _zari_

I was looking for some info abt bindusara, ashoka'father, not much is available ol abt him, more info is abt chandragupt maurya and ashoka,

As for siyaasat I think the last episode pace was abit slow