Siyasat Serial Discussions Siyasat 9th June 2015 WU.....Page1 - Page 5

Created

Last reply

Replies

596

Views

65.6k

Users

15

Likes

899

Frequent Posters

jayaks02 thumbnail
11th Anniversary Thumbnail Dazzler Thumbnail
Posted: 10 years ago
#41
😆

Originally posted by: myviewprem

Akbar had 36 main wives out of which 3 were consorts and chief queens but what about his mutta marriage wives they also are mothers to salim right? At last count I only had posted around list of 50 of his wives by the time he was 35 and he had married around 12 princess in 1592 or so the year khurram was born. So adding all that I think he had more than 100-150 legal wives for sure and more(whether people call secondary marriage or mutta marriage) they are all his wives as per society norms. Add to that Akbar's fav cocubbines who were no less powerful than his legal wives. In one history book I read some cocubbines had more power than his legal wives. So in that context I stated that Salim had 300 mothers or more. Now a husband can say legal wife, chief wife, secondary wife or cocubbine a son cannot differentiate like that can he they are all his mothers. Hence I said Salim's 300 mothers(there must have been more).

I read in one book Salim after becoming emperor raised the allowance of all his mothers and after a few months while looking at finance statement review was shocked why? Lakhs were being given as allowance to his moms, he himself had no idea that he had so many moms. He had to then grade and give the allowance like senior wives more others less.



😃😆
ghalibmirza thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Stunner Thumbnail + 4
Posted: 10 years ago
#42
😆...thank you dear for all the info..btw do you know how many episodes siyaasat has? some say 13 and some say 46..how i wish its 46!
ghalibmirza thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Stunner Thumbnail + 4
Posted: 10 years ago
#43
nice to know your name prem..i am mandy and so glad to meet you😊
jerzgirl thumbnail
Posted: 10 years ago
#44
I have read all 3 books from the Taj series of which The 20th Wife was 1st if what i am reading in the synopsis of chap1-3 is what they are showing then it is not accurate ... the book was really good ... I wonder what Indu has to say about it will have to check with her
myviewprem thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 10 years ago
#45

Originally posted by: ghalibmirza

nice to know your name prem..i am mandy and so glad to meet you😊

thanks mandy
there was a mandy in JA forum are you same or different?
myviewprem thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 10 years ago
#46

Originally posted by: jerzgirl

I have read all 3 books from the Taj series of which The 20th Wife was 1st if what i am reading in the synopsis of chap1-3 is what they are showing then it is not accurate ... the book was really good ... I wonder what Indu has to say about it will have to check with her

I have also read
adaptations are always a few notches below books be it movies or serials
Except when its chetan bhagat novels- his movie adaptions are better than his books by miles
I get bored reading his books and skip many parts to reach end fast but movies are better scripted
myviewprem thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 10 years ago
#47

Originally posted by: ghalibmirza

😆...thank you dear for all the info..btw do you know how many episodes siyaasat has? some say 13 and some say 46..how i wish its 46!

no idea hope its 46 only(almost a year long) 13 will be too short to complete story because khurram is key character here, he is not even born so the story ends when khurram becomes king at age of 35-36 years old so it could be 40 episodes

This book if you read it is more about nur jahan and khurram powerplay and nur jahan and jagat Gosain fighting for Jehangir and one up man ship
Its less about Jehangir and nur jahan honestly
Edited by myviewprem - 10 years ago
myviewprem thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 10 years ago
#48
I am waiting for story to take a leap and Nur Jahan becomes big
Nur Jahan is a interesting character in history
She was an inventor like she invented many perfumes, she was a dress designer etc she was a creative person
She was also a very good politician and administrator. From 1616 till 1627 when Jehangir died she literally ruled Mughal empire with an iron fist and ably at that.
But where she truly failed was when she gave more importance to her ambitions of retaining power through her daughter ladli begum over treating all jehangir's children as equal
Jehangir's kids were real heirs of throne be it khusrau, parvez or khurram and shariyar
But Nur Jahan wanted her daughters husband to be the next emperor so she can have prominence and become defacto ruler thru her son in law
Hence she approached first khurram to marry her daughter than khusrau
Khusrau was a good man and husband by 16th century standards he would not marry for benefits of becoming next emperor he was a loyal husband and hence rejected this proposal
Khurram was also not interested as he loved mumtaz and mumtaz influenced her husband to reject this proposal of Nur Jahan as she did not want any power centers in khurram life other than her
Parvez was a soft guy not interested in becoming emperor and involved in power games
So her only option was shariyar who was actually a good for nothing guy not good in war field or administration etc
As a mother instead of marrying off her daughter to a capable guy Nur Jahan to retain power married her only daughter to shariyar
So Nur Jahan may be good politican and administrator but she failed as a mother on all fronts to all kids
Next was Nur Jahan role as a wife where again she truly failed although she was successful in running kingdom
Salim was a great man to have given his wife freedom so much freedom in 16th century at risk of becoming a laughing stock in society and court(even 21st century men will not give so much freedom to wives and daughters in india and asia). Why Salim did that was one he genuinely had trusted Nur Jahan as she was known to him from childhood and second his ill health forced him to do that. Now if a real good woman and wife got that freedom she could use it to do something constructive. But all Nur Jahan was interested was to show that she is equal or superior to her husband. Hence she was only interested to show off her powers by issuing her coins, attention seeking like refusing to climb stairs in malwa till Jehangir bribed her with gold coins etc she was a big show off compared to other Mughal wives.
Why I say Nur Jahan was a show off is that many other Mughal wives and daughters also have done as much or more work than Nur Jahan for Mughal empire.
One such example is Hamida bano she was the mughl empresss and defacto ruler till Akbar became 20 years old and started handling the kingdom correctly she did not show off sitting in DEK, DEA in emperors throne while her husband died and her son was a teenage kid. She could have who would stop her none but she did not.
Second example is jahanara, I think she was best Mughal empress ever better than nur jahan or mumtaz. From age of 17 when her mom died she was defacto ruler cum empress. With a father in mourning and only an elder brother Dara to rely on she handled the Mughal empire single handedly till her father recovered and later too when he had lost interest in ruling and concentrated on building taj mahal. During Aurangzeb rule too she had great power so much only she could overrule his decisions and issue farmans. But not once she misused and abused her powers. Shah jahan always told if my jani is a boy I would make her emperor.
Third is Zebunissa, a man like Aurangzeb who did not give much importance to woman outside or in family consulted her in many political affairs till she fell foul in his eyes by writing poetry and singing them(or was it her love affair with an army major). Her brothers considered her words as a law. Indeed Akbar II took her permission in prison and celebrated Diwali and raksha bandan in agra much to fury of Aurangzeb although it was banned. Akbar II again went against Aurangzeb and questioned his two elder brothers imprisonment on zebunissa request. It is said that all siblings considered her like a mother figure despite her being imprisoned and would consult and obey her in all matters.
Fourth is mumtaz mahal. Mumtaz had tremendous hold on shah jahan so much that she would guide him on all decision matters in court. When Amar Singh killed his minister and Shah Jahan got scared and retreated from court it was mumtaz who had told him not to return to palace till he punish amar singh. In some matters mumtaz did misuse her powers and love her husband had for her but never openly like nur jahan. Mumtaz only fault is she refused to allow shah jahan other wives to get any prominence and Shaha jahan other kids from his other wives(Yes shah jahan had two elder daughters from first two elder wives, mumtaz was his 4th or 5th wife not first) to get their rightful place in family or any prominence. In that matter mumtza was no less bad or insecure as nur jahan as she never allowed her step kids to get any love of father or any rightful inheritance
Then there was Kahnzadha the elder sister of babar whom he adored and gave all powers. Akbar's three wives Ruqaiah, Salima and Jodha also did not misuse their powers. Neither did Akbar's daughters and Salim's sisters who were given powers by them to handle harem, build independent palaces outside forts etc. But none ever abused their powers outside like nur jahan to promote their kids or interests or favourites.
The real seed of destruction and decline of Mughal empire was sown by nur jahan with her divisive and destructive over dominance policy towards jehangir's kids. Till then no major blood bath really took place between siblings in any generation except Humayun blinding his brother and Akbar killing his nephew. After Nur Jahan came into Mughal family the seeds of distrust between brothers, family blood bathe and killing male members on ascending throne etc started. Its roots lie in nur jahan's devisive policy.
Edited by myviewprem - 10 years ago
_zari_ thumbnail
11th Anniversary Thumbnail Visit Streak 30 Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 10 years ago
#49

Originally posted by: myviewprem

I am waiting for story to take a leap and Nur Jahan becomes big
Nur Jahan is a interesting character in history
She was an inventor like she invented many perfumes, she was a dress designer etc she was a creative person
She was also a very good politician and administrator. From 1616 till 1627 when Jehangir died she literally ruled Mughal empire with an iron fist and ably at that.
But where she truly failed was when she gave more importance to her ambitions of retaining power through her daughter ladli begum over treating all jehangir's children as equal
Jehangir's kids were real heirs of throne be it khusrau, parvez or khurram and shariyar
But Nur Jahan wanted her daughters husband to be the next emperor so she can have prominence and become defacto ruler thru her son in law
Hence she approached first khurram to marry her daughter than khusrau
Khusrau was a good man and husband by 16th century standards he would not marry for benefits of becoming next emperor he was a loyal husband and hence rejected this proposal
Khurram was also not interested as he loved mumtaz and mumtaz influenced her husband to reject this proposal of Nur Jahan as she did not want any power centers in khurram life other than her
Parvez was a soft guy not interested in becoming emperor and involved in power games
So her only option was shariyar who was actually a good for nothing guy not good in war field or administration etc
As a mother instead of marrying off her daughter to a capable guy Nur Jahan to retain power married her only daughter to shariyar
So Nur Jahan may be good politican and administrator but she failed as a mother on all fronts to all kids
Next was Nur Jahan role as a wife where again she truly failed although she was successful in running kingdom
Salim was a great man to have given his wife freedom so much freedom in 16th century at risk of becoming a laughing stock in society and court(even 21st century men will not give so much freedom to wives and daughters in india and asia). Why Salim did that was one he genuinely had trusted Nur Jahan as she was known to him from childhood and second his ill health forced him to do that. Now if a real good woman and wife got that freedom she could use it to do something constructive. But all Nur Jahan was interested was to show that she is equal or superior to her husband. Hence she was only interested to show off her powers by issuing her coins, attention seeking like refusing to climb stairs in malwa till Jehangir bribed her with gold coins etc she was a big show off compared to other Mughal wives.
Why I say Nur Jahan was a show off is that many other Mughal wives and daughters also have done as much or more work than Nur Jahan for Mughal empire.
One such example is Hamida bano she was the mughl empresss and defacto ruler till Akbar became 20 years old and started handling the kingdom correctly she did not show off sitting in DEK, DEA in emperors throne while her husband died and her son was a teenage kid. She could have who would stop her none but she did not.
Second example is jahanara, I think she was best Mughal empress ever better than nur jahan or mumtaz. From age of 17 when her mom died she was defacto ruler cum empress. With a father in mourning and only an elder brother Dara to rely on she handled the Mughal empire single handedly till her father recovered and later too when he had lost interest in ruling and concentrated on building taj mahal. During Aurangzeb rule too she had great power so much only she could overrule his decisions and issue farmans. But not once she misused and abused her powers. Shah jahan always told if my jani is a boy I would make her emperor.
Third is Zebunissa, a man like Aurangzeb who did not give much importance to woman outside or in family consulted her in many political affairs till she fell foul in his eyes by writing poetry and singing them(or was it her love affair with an army major). Her brothers considered her words as a law. Indeed Akbar II took her permission in prison and celebrated Diwali and raksha bandan in agra much to fury of Aurangzeb although it was banned. Akbar II again went against Aurangzeb and questioned his two elder brothers imprisonment on zebunissa request. It is said that all siblings considered her like a mother figure despite her being imprisoned and would consult and obey her in all matters.
Fourth is mumtaz mahal. Mumtaz had tremendous hold on shah jahan so much that she would guide him on all decision matters in court. When Amar Singh killed his minister and Shah Jahan got scared and retreated from court it was mumtaz who had told him not to return to palace till he punish amar singh. In some matters mumtaz did misuse her powers and love her husband had for her but never openly like nur jahan. Mumtaz only fault is she refused to allow shah jahan other wives to get any prominence and Shaha jahan other kids from his other wives(Yes shah jahan had two elder daughters from first two elder wives, mumtaz was his 4th or 5th wife not first) to get their rightful place in family or any prominence. In that matter mumtza was no less bad or insecure as nur jahan as she never allowed her step kids to get any love of father or any rightful inheritance
Then there was Kahnzadha the elder sister of babar whom he adored and gave all powers. Akbar's three wives Ruqaiah, Salima and Jodha also did not misuse their powers. Neither did Akbar's daughters and Salim's sisters who were given powers by them to handle harem, build independent palaces outside forts etc. But none ever abused their powers outside like nur jahan to promote their kids or interests or favourites.
The real seed of destruction and decline of Mughal empire was sown by nur jahan with her divisive and destructive over dominance policy towards jehangir's kids. Till then no major blood bath really took place between siblings in any generation except Humayun blinding his brother and Akbar killing his nephew. After Nur Jahan came into Mughal family the seeds of distrust between brothers, family blood bathe and killing male members on ascending throne etc started. Its roots lie in nur jahan's devisive policy.

Wow prem u seem to know alot about mughal history, anyways thnx for all this info, ok one question the amar singh that u have mentioned is he mp's son.
myviewprem thumbnail
15th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 10 years ago
#50

Originally posted by: _zari_

[

Wow prem u seem to know alot about mughal history, anyways thnx for all this info, ok one question the amar singh that u have mentioned is he mp's son.

No its amar singh rathore of marwar - he was crown prince of marwar but was banished by his father and entered shah jahan service
If you remember jagat Gosain aka jodh bai mom of shah jahan is marwar princess so he is related to shah jahan mom
He killed mumtaz brother in court as he humiliated amar singh
So he was killed by deceit by his own brother as shah jahan promised to give him jagir
In Agra fort a gate is named after him as amar singh gate by shah jahan for his bravery after he realized his grave mistake

Related Topics

Top

Stay Connected with IndiaForums!

Be the first to know about the latest news, updates, and exclusive content.

Add to Home Screen!

Install this web app on your iPhone for the best experience. It's easy, just tap and then "Add to Home Screen".