So much negativity for a positive thought/motive...:( - Page 4

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sunflower52 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#31

Originally posted by: return_to_hades



I disagree strongly.

Why should a woman who does not want kids not get married? Doesn't she have a right to love and commitment? Haven't you read about the growing trend of childless couples. Men and women are collectively choosing not to have kids. This is a matter the couple should discuss before marriage. The only reason not to marry is when you are both on different pages with the matter of kids.

Even if the woman agrees to have kids. It is her body and she should not be used as a baby making machine. It should be her choice how many she wants.

Also the discussion about children should be between the couple. Neither his parents nor her parents have a right to intervene or put pressure because they want grandkids.


I agree about one thing having children or not is a couple decision in that I have never refute.

All I am against is taking unilateral decisions regarding to continue accidental pregnancy while married . That child is also a part of your husband
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Posted: 10 years ago
#32

Originally posted by: starstruckk

The content of the video is pretty controversial and like I said, can be interpreted in so many different ways which defeats the video's purpose.


+1


Now if this was a film the makers decided to make by themselves as a stand alone project away from any initiative, then yes, I totally understand what the TM is saying about it being open to interpretation. But the purpose of the film was to spread a message about woman empowerment. I think this message needed to be executed clearly, to the point and not open to too many interpretations because as starstruckk said, otherwise it ends up defeating the reason of making the film in the first place.

Kudos for the makers for attempting to do something and I do agree with the underlying message about women making their own choices, but let's face it, they failed what they set out to do due to poor execution and I think it's important that they understand why this happened so that the work they do in the future would be more effective in spreading the message.
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Posted: 10 years ago
#33

Originally posted by: sunflower52

All I am against is taking unilateral decisions regarding to continue accidental pregnancy while married . That child is also a part of your husband


Any accidental pregnancy should be discussed by the couple, irrespective of marital status. The woman should not take the decision without the father's knowledge. At the same time, the final decision is hers. It is her body that will be carrying a child to term. So whether she wants to keep or abort should be her decision.

If a man definitely does not want kids there are precautions he can take to prevent accidental pregnancy as well. Always use his own condoms, in case the woman has forgotten birth control. Have a vasectomy which is reversible. Actually many childless couples are choosing vasectomy as their birth control because it has the most certainty and you don't need to worry about remembering birth control or condoms with that.

There are a few situations where unilateral decisions are OK like in the case of rape, abusive/unstable relationships or absentee fathers. For example - in many ghettoes in the US here women are in relationships with thugs and drug dealers. These men get in and out of jail all the time. The woman rarely knows where he is, what he is up to. In such cases I think it is OK for women to make their own decision. Similarly movies like Yuva and Praan Jaye Par Shaan Na Jaaye showed situations in India where women are compelled to make such decisions.

sunflower52 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#34

Originally posted by: return_to_hades


Any accidental pregnancy should be discussed by the couple, irrespective of marital status. The woman should not take the decision without the father's knowledge. At the same time, the final decision is hers. It is her body that will be carrying a child to term. So whether she wants to keep or abort should be her decision.

If a man definitely does not want kids there are precautions he can take to prevent accidental pregnancy as well. Always use his own condoms, in case the woman has forgotten birth control. Have a vasectomy which is reversible. Actually many childless couples are choosing vasectomy as their birth control because it has the most certainty and you don't need to worry about remembering birth control or condoms with that.

There are a few situations where unilateral decisions are OK like in the case of rape, abusive/unstable relationships or absentee fathers. For example - in many ghettoes in the US here women are in relationships with thugs and drug dealers. These men get in and out of jail all the time. The woman rarely knows where he is, what he is up to. In such cases I think it is OK for women to make their own decision. Similarly movies like Yuva and Praan Jaye Par Shaan Na Jaaye showed situations in India where women are compelled to make such decisions.


Usually abortions can be risky and should not be taken lightly. So to avoid pregnancy both man and woman should shoulder responsibility, as condoms are also not 100% fail proof. Only in the marriage a couple should decide. I have also never liked when some aunties go about when will we hear the good news to a girl or guy who has just gotten married.

@bold, I even said in my other post when it comes to cases like rape, abuse and absentee father then the woman has every right to do what she wants.


566912 thumbnail
Posted: 10 years ago
#35

All these videos.. focus on Urban, privileged women.

What about lower middle class.. rural women?

They need women empowerment to stand on their own feet, so they don't have to endure domestic violence, so they can stop their lil girl getting married.


Most of you commenting here probably have never lived a middle class life. So for you all.. may be empowering is about that video.


But Most % of Indian women population have very basic priorities.


Just an online discussion is not changing anything. Try finding ground level reality and if privileged, do something rather than writing essays here.



PS - I know I sound moralistic. But honestly... most discussion here always focus urban living/thinking, which hardly reflects some % of population of India. hardly,I have seen views that reflects a middle class living. Forget rural.


All these celebrities supporting cause is ridiculous. They are biggest hypocrites. Why don't anyone say NO to item numbers? Or may be objectifying women is a new age Feminist way of Women empowerment. 🤔


Edited by NimbuMirchi - 10 years ago
lunza thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#36
The video deserves all the criticism BECAUSE they did a crappy job of taking their idea of representing such an important issue past the "thought" and "motivation" stage.
Even two-hour bollywood films are criticized and thrashed by critics... There some directors can say, "Dont, like it, dont watch it" , "It is just entertainment" , " I dont make movies for critics" , " It is not my responsibility to give some social message"

But this is not some bollywood film.. The makers had a responsibility to be more careful about the words/examples/visuals to use.

If they are not, and people start lapping up whatever they see and hear at face value, they end up "harming" the cause than helping it. And when that happens, who is really going to see or care what the original "thought" or "motive" was?

And what interpretation are we talking about here? The fact that hardly anyone could make sense or interpret the snowfall-snowflake-silk-nylon-polymer-whatever allegory ? Or that majority of the people interpreted the much criticized "sex outside marriage" line as adultery and not the right of a woman to make a choice of being in an open marriage?

If the interpretations are so off-the-mark than what they actually intended to communicate, then I wouldnt really see that as something positive.

And Which are the points you found valid and which are the ones you found absurd..?
No offense, but I feel the examples you have picked arent even part of the main points made by the writer/blogger .

Like the "dumb" comment isnt a "point" made.. it was part of the title of the article ..

And the "9 year old daughter" one was a P.S note added at the end of the article, as an anecdote .. (And interestingly .. she found the video boring AND selfish ... )

(Now, if one found it absurd that she actually showed that video to a 9 year old.. thats another debate..)

Edited by lunza - 10 years ago
Cutiepie_Rani thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#37
I'm at work so can't write long paragraphs explaining my thought process, but I will certainly do so once I get off of work.


And as far as criticism is concerned, it got praised/applauded just as much as it got criticized. That itself means that the video was interpreted differently. But I'll write a more in depth reply later.
lunza thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#38
About Deepika being criticized, I do not buy the argument that she is just an actor who played her part in the film , so she shouldnt be criticized as much.

She isnt some struggling actor who landed some part in a movie that she blindly ended up doing because of limited choices.

She chose to go with the lines given to her in this film.. instead of thinking through more carefully about what she was supposed to be saying and ask for changes. She is one of the leading bollywood actresses and Homi and Anaita are really good friends of hers.. Wouldnt have been that difficult..

Actors are criticized when they select bad scripts and do bad films ..
And praised for good work.

Similarly, Deepika isnt above criticism here ..
And even some of the praises that are coming, more of it is coming towards her, isnt it? Since she is the face of the video?

If the video had worked, she would have garnered most of the appreciation.. It is just that .. it didnt work.

And about the hate Deepika has been getting, I havent really been following all the tweets, but I can guess that some people must have gone overboard with some of the comments and brought up her ex-boyfriends, movies etc..
I have seen a couple of hate tweets against her bringing up rape and all sorts of shit..

Of course all that is distasteful.

Cutiepie_Rani thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#39
I feel like no matter what - even if the words were different, even if the sentence structure was different, even if the messages came across more clear, there would still be people who would find faults in a type of video like this. No matter what...I can almost guarantee that. And yes I do believe all of this goes back to that one word -interpretation.

I am a true believer of no sex before marriage. I am also a believer that marriage is a life long commitment, so only take that step if you are ready to be committed for the rest of your life. I come from a culture where there are no divorces (very few if any). I come from a culture where you hardly see cheating after marriage or anything along those lines. And I would obviously want my husband to always be loyal and faithful forever as he would expect from me too. So yeah maybe the video did not portray this in the proper way. But I still believe that no matter how it was portrayed, there still would be individuals who would find faults in the video. No one's perfect, after all. What you actually mean can't always get out in that manner. What you think of to be positive, someone else will think of to be negative. That's just how it is.


As far as kids...that is a mutual decision to make. I don't like the whole abortion idea, the killing of an innocent child. That's just so wrong in my opinion. If you know you don't want kids, well then take precautions. Simple as that. The woman has the right to make a decision of an abortion, but the father has an equal say. But then again it is the woman's body.


And those talking about change - honestly, I don't think its going to ever happen. It is how it is. You can have half the actresses of Bollywood come out and talk about a sensitive issue like this, it won't make a change.


Neither is online discussion going to change anything nor such videos. Bitter fact.


Why can celebrities not support causes? Sure some are hypocrites, but that doesn't make each and every single one of them hypocrites. Before being a celebrity, they are human too - which is something most everyone tends to forget.


People are also forgetting that the amount of criticism this video has received is equivalent to the amount of appreciation it has received. I've seen it all over the social media whether it be on Twitter, Facebook, or another platform. That speaks volumes. I feel like people on IF (not all, but a few) are starting all the criticism AFTER reading all the opinions of the critics. Before those views came out, they didn't say anything. (If your opinion was against the video from the beginning, then I'm not referring to you).


What Deepika thought to be right when she agreed to do this video doesn't necessarily mean that everyone would think of it to be right. And she's smart enough to know that. She did what she believed was right...does that make it right? No, absolutely not. Some phrases weren't phrased well - agree. The video could have been made better - agree. But the intention was a positive one, not a negative one. When everyone behind this video made this video, I'm sure they knew that there will always be two sides. Some will agree, others won't agree. She's a human - she's not perfect. Her initiative was good. She wasn't the director of the movie, was she? Or the one who came up with those lines, right? Or was she? Whoever wrote those lines should be criticized because not all the lines were presented in the manner they should have been. Before all the criticism stirred up, all I saw on websites was positive reviews. The number of 'likes' vs 'dislikes' on YOUTUBE itself say a lot. I am not a fangirl of Deepika at all. Yes, I like her and adore her as an actress and person - but I'm not a fangirl. That's not me - whoever wants to think otherwise may gladly do so. But I think she took a good stance with this video. There were just a few flaws in the video and the words and hence it may not have gotten the exact message out the way it wanted to. I thought it was a powerful video. But a) the words should have been chosen more wisely and b) I doubt it will do any good or bring any change. But still it was a good initiative. That is all.


Thank you for those presenting your views in a civil manner, without bashing my views. You are hardly ever able to talk in a civil manner these days. So I appreciate it. :-)
Meherbaan thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#40

Originally posted by: Fiery-Phoenix

LOL one hand, you say different strokes for different folks, and same instant people not agreeing with the video are "hateful" ? You may think it's a positive concept, others may think it's a negative concept and deserves the criticism. Who made you the judge of deciding whether the video is positive or negative ? As you keep preaching, how about practice for a change and let people have the space to criticize than calling their stand hateful. And if their stand is hateful than yours is nothing more than a blind fanaticism on display.


THANK YOU !

very much need it!

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