Dadisa's thinking

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Vidya

@Shinya

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#41

Originally posted by: hooked

My mistake - I didn't remember- she was just expecting and had not had Mannu by then.

But child birth is not always as safe as an appendectomy. More so in a village with not even a decent hospital to call its own. At the time Basant's first wife died - we weren't even shown the circumstances. We don't know what complications were there. Was it sugar or high BP or just a case that required an experienced gyno and the place had just a mid -wife ???

We don't know what happened.
So its not fair to assume DS deliberately went and killed Basant's wife coz she did not have a baby. Sumi did survive both her kids didn't she ?
Even Smita Patil died in childbrith - and I'm sure she cud afford the best care possible and had it too. Sometimes these things happen.

We do know what happened. Yamuna, basant's first wife, had lot of miscarriages in the past and she had grown weak.

Dont know if you saw that episode where the midwife was called after basant's first wife went into labour before term. The midwife said she can save either the child or the mother. Everyone was tensed, but dadisa came forward and said 'I want the child. What is the use of a woman who cannot reproduce? '

Those words still echo in my ears and no matter what I cannot bring myself to respect that woman.

She might not have "killed her" in in its true meaning, but she is responsible for her death.

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SPuja

@SPuja

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#42

Yes DS was responsible for Jamuna's death. But the track itself was strange. How can a midwife say that she can save either child (who was not yet born) or mother? In this serial, this sentence has been repeated again at the time of Gahna and that too by a doctor. CVs do not know that if the mother dies, her unborn child will also die with her in normal circumstances.

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Vidya

@Shinya

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#43

Originally posted by: tinoo

Shinya, the point I'm making is perhaps there is no difference whatsoever.

The singhs never said to ganga "we will be different than ratan's family"... they never made any commitment to her that they would accept Manu as their own child and never want a blood-line heir from Jagya.

The point I'm making is that we cant fault them for behaving in a manner now which they never agreed to behave in to begin with.

The singhs are what they are. I feel that all of us waste too much time debating how people "should be". Everyone just is the way they are and we have to move on and find our own positioning and stance and stick up for our own beliefs and points of view.

Now it remains for Jagya and ganga to stand up for Ganga's health concerns if she were to get pregnant and lose her life in the bargain. (which she already is pregnant secretly)

I do agree with the bold and I myself said in another thread that Singhs are as ordinary as any other in their place.

lose her life in the bargain - that was my point... is it worth risking your life especially when you have the responsibility of a child and when you know that the child has no one other than you?

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Vidya

@Shinya

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#44

Originally posted by: SPuja
Yes DS was responsible for Jamuna's death. But the track itself was strange. How can a midwife say that she can save either child (who was not yet born) or mother? In this serial, this sentence has been repeated again at the time of Gahna and that too by a doctor. CVs do not know that if the mother dies, her unborn child will also die with her in normal circumstances.

Puja, I think its not wrong. In a complicated delivery, doctors always say that it is their duty to first save the mother and then the child.

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SPuja

@SPuja

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#45

Originally posted by: Shinya

Puja, I think its not wrong. In a complicated delivery, doctors always say that it is their duty to first save the mother and then the child.

Then why in serial they always say that they can save either the child or the mother? We all know that when complications arise, the doctors save mother's life first- they do not give option to the family which one they want to save. And the midwife is not even a doctor - she can just deliver the child - nothing else- here they also made her say that she can save either the mother or the child😆

Edited by SPuja - 11 years ago

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tinoo

@tinoo

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#46

Originally posted by: SPuja
Yes DS was responsible for Jamuna's death. But the track itself was strange. How can a midwife say that she can save either child (who was not yet born) or mother? In this serial, this sentence has been repeated again at the time of Gahna and that too by a doctor. CVs do not know that if the mother dies, her unborn child will also die with her in normal circumstances.

Actually, it is not like that. There are many cases where it does come to mother vs. child.

For instance - let us say that the pregnant mother is diagnosed to have cancer. Then doctors may recommend chemotherapy. But chemotherapy (or other cancer drugs) are known to cause abortion because the fetus cannot withstand radiation. So then the doctor will give a choice to the family -- save mother or save child. Because child may be protected from the cancer (inside its placenta) . But not taking chemotherapy can lead mother to die ... yet she can still deliver healthy child.

Also, another example is during delivery, let us say that mother starts having seizures. The only way to stop her seizures is also to stop her contractions. At that time doctor can tell the family "either I abort the child and let her seizures stop... or else she continues with delivery, and then her seizures may kill her"

Also, if the fetus is seven months, even if mother dies, it can survive on its own in an incubator as a premature baby ... many times dead mothers who die in car accidents do have babies which doctors deliver and take out of the dead mother. If the delivery is done within three hours of the mother's death, by cesearean, then the child can still survive in a incubator.

These cases are rare -- but sometimes internal bleeding and childbirth related complications can only be stopped by killing the baby -- or the drugs to stop the mothers problem may kill the child -- although not done with intent to murder the baby - it may be the fallout of trying to save the mother's life.

Sometimes, during childbirth, a tumour may come to light in the mother's uterus or womb ... which may be highly inflamed or ready to burst. Then it is obvious that delivery will create more agitation and complications. so again, the only way is to kill the child to save the mother, or let the child be born and mother dies.

There are ethical issues surrounding all of these given the preciousness of human life, but the point I am trying to make is that these mother vs. child issues do exist in real life and it is not a figment of the CVs ignorance.

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SPuja

@SPuja

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#47

@tinoo, they did not show anything like you have mentioned in the serial. Mother vs child do exist but in rare cases here it is the routine in Basant's wives. And how can a midwife say those words? she is not equipped to handle complications leave alone cancer etc. There was no incubator or oxygen mask or other such things. And doctors do not ask the family- at least not in India (may be due to low literacy) - they take a decision and ask for family's signature etc. for necessary procedures. Even in Delhi (especially in government hospitals, but in most big private hospitals also) the doctors do not inform the patients the options available for them- some alternate procedures etc. They just inform that operation is required etc. and patients generally do not go for second opinion also (they take second opinion when the situation do not improve).

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tinoo

@tinoo

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#48

sPuja,

I honestly cant get into the technicalities of it because I dont know what happened in basant's first wife's case. so I dont want to get into speculation.

With respect to Balika vadhu -- even if the midwife was not highly trained - we can give credence to the fact that a situation may have arisen where the midwife could only save one. It could just be as simple as if contractions were too painful, then the only way to stop it would be to kill the child. If child is to be saved, then mother would die from stress of childbirth. Particularly in those days where they didn't have painkillers etc. and had to manage with traditional forms of massage and hot water.

As far as why this happens only with basant's wives - both wives of basant were underage girls -- the first one was only 17 or 18, and gehna at the time was portrayed as being only 16. The bodies of both his first wife and his second wife may not have been ready to withstand the strain of pregnancy and childbirth. In addition to which, basant himself was an animal and constantly raping his wives. They also probably did not have mental peace because of basant's aggressive behaviour, and their bodies may have been under stress for this reason as well as dadisa's taunts. Gehna had spunk, but who knows about Jamuna? she may not have had mental stamina to deal with pregnancy, early age, basant and dadisa all at once.

As far as why she asked dadisa which one to save -- I think it is obvious that dadisa was unofficial leader of the whole village - and held a lot of great clout - and the mindset at the time was that more wives could be found for a man, but a male heir was not guaranteed, so they always will give the dadisa types a say as opposed to the midwife making a decision herself which may not be endorsed by dadisa later on. Women were just reproductive vessels and considered useless if not able to bear male children. They were deletable.

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SPuja

@SPuja

Rocker

Posted: 11 years ago

#49

I don't think that a midwife can kill a baby. And Jamuna may be a child bride (like every one else), but when she died, she was not a child - she was older than Sumitra- Jagya- Anandi were already married by then.

edited to add: even gahna was 18 or 19 when she married. Basant's first marriage happened about 21/20 years before his second marriage so Jamuna may be around 30/35 when she died.

Edited by SPuja - 11 years ago

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Missesha

@Missesha

Dazzler

+ 2

Posted: 11 years ago

#50

Singhs are treating this as a matter of urgency when actually Jagya-Ganga marriage is not even two months old. @blue above is true and when Jagya married they expected that one day they will see Jagya's child but did they expected pregnancy so soon? If not why all the family is thinking about Ganga's condition and ways to get Jagya's own child?

Hi Puja,

My previous post was mainly to highlight the difference between Singhs and Rat's family. They cannot be compared as people of same flock.

Regarding bold - JaGan kid was not a matter of urgency to Singhs until they found out the difficulties regarding G's pregnancy. I remember once Ds clearly told Sumi, 'that while she really yearns to see J's child, she understands that this generation is educated and planned, hence she cannot comment if JaGan is ready for their own child yet or not'

The above statement showed there was no such urgency, rather patience even from an orthodox woman like DS

But the dynamics changed after the news. Earlier they thought one day they will see the grand-child and hence were ready to wait for it, but now they know they don't have that possibilty. So instead of accepting the news as fate and giving up hopes, they all have started working on different ways (as per their beliefs) to see, if there is any slightest ray of hope somewhere, that can change fate.

While B & B have more faith on medical science, Sumi - DS have faith in pooja/ prarthna / baba.

Also J never said he does not want a child. When surrogacy matter came up, J indirectly showed that if there was a way to have another baby he would like to take that option. Had he for once and all said that Mannu is all he is contented with and does not want to discuss more on G's pregnancy, then we could say that elder Singhs are interfering in J-G private matters.

But actually they are niether interfering nor pressuring J-G. Singhs are just trying their luck without endangering anyone's life. Totally acceptable behaviour in my POV.

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