Why the Shift?? - Page 9

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m09/m09005.htm

While clad in a single raiment and in her season, the princess Krishna was treated cruelly by Duhshasana in the midst of the assembly and before the eyes of all. Those scorchers of foes, the Pandavas, who still remember the naked Draupadi plunged into distress, can never be dissuaded from battle.

"'"Then again, Krishna, the daughter of Drupada, is in sorrow, undergoing the austerest of penances for my destruction and the success of the objects cherished by her husbands, and sleepeth every day on the bare ground, intending to do so till the end of the hostilities is attained. Abandoning honour and pride, the uterine sister of Vasudeva (Subhadra) is always serving Draupadi as veritable waiting woman.

From Suyodhana. He mentions disrobing.

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m09/m09059.htm

Having attained to the other shores of those fierce hostilities, Vrikodara once more laughingly said these words slowly unto Yudhishthira and Keshava and Srinjaya and Dhananjaya and the two sons of Madri, "They that had dragged Draupadi, while ill, into the assembly and had disrobed her there, behold those Dhartarashtras slain in battle by the Pandavas through the ascetic penances of Yajnasena's daughter! Those wicked-hearted sons of king Dhritarashtra who had called us 'Sesame seeds without kernel,' have all been slain by us with their relatives and followers! It matters little whether (as a consequence of those deeds) we go to heaven or fall into hell!"

From Bheema. He also mentions disrobing.

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

True. But it would've been a huge deal back then.

Conditions are worse today is what i feel. Drapaudi was highly respected empress of her times. And rightly so she deserved it every bit of the respect and adoration . And the respect only increase as tge story progresses Mine surely did It is today s generation who reduce her to an "embarrassed" victim or mooning fool or an "object" to be offered.

As star drapaudi says - uss bhari sabha main drapaudi nagan nahi hui thi nagan toh panch nirbal pandava hue the

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

True. But it would've been a huge deal back then.

Even today it's a huge deal. How much the victims suffer and are mocker at is no secret

Originally posted by: .Vrish.

Whose provincial autonomy are you talking about here?

Provinces under British India

First of all ved vyas never called abhimanyu in dron parv

He called saubhadre to abhimanyu. In Sanskrit version it written saubhadre instead of abhimanyu in dron parv

And no where ved vyas mention abhimanyu vadh

It is mention in. Dron parv that is

Saubhadrasya nipaatanam

Mean subhrada ke bete ki mrityu

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/mbs/mbs07032.htm

Line 25

You know Draupadi is maligned by writers, I don't think they'd do anything to save her from embarrassment, I don't want to compare but she did continue her life as a powerful individual rather than victim of something, one has to appreciate Pandavas here too (No, don't kill me), what I am saying is that men, even today leave women who they think are not 'Pure'

Draupadi wasn't embarrassed, her husband didn't make her feel that way

I feel the change was to protect people who witnessed everything as mute spectators, Lord Krishna saved her so they didn't have to, gives them a reason why they didn't let go of their faulty dharma to protect her

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

While Panchali did make good arguments, Suyodhana did make the foolish mistake of offering to take one of the brothers' words, and Arjuna did speak up, IMO, none of that freed her ON ITS OWN.

If your notice, Dhritharashtra was gung ho about it until the jackals howled. Gandhari was present in court and didn't say a word until the jackals howled. This even AFTER Suyodhana made that offer, and Arjuna spoke up.

Now, Hastinapuri was located in Kurujangala. I assume jackals howling were not uncommon. So why did it become a bad omen that day?

One of the things you see in text is jackals being used to indicate spies.

Tracking forward a bit, we know Krishna was fending off an attack by Salwa, Kamsa's half brother. In that episode, Salwa made it very clear his interest was in Krishna, not Dwaraka or any of the other Yadavas.

The following is extrapolation on my part, but I do thing this is likely what happened.

It is improbable that both events, dice hall qnd the attack on Krishna, which happened at the same time to be coincidence. My feeling is that the conspirators meant Krishna to die. In his absence, it would be difficult for Panchal alone to do much for the enslaved. The jackal/spy likely delivered news that Krishna remained alive and well.

Krishna being still around, combined with the political conundrum Panchali and Arjuna placed the Kurus in thanks to Suyodhana's idiocy, made the risk vs. benefit ratio tilt on the side of freeing them. The 2nd dice game was a clever work around to that where Pandava/Panchali slavery was not an issue, so no one would have a reason to attack as gaming was completely legal at the time.

Gandhari was present in court?

Wouldn't it take time for spies to deliver the news of Krishna's survival from the attack, considering he wasn't in Hastinapur

Although there's mention of Krishna walking there on foot (I think), maybe they got to know that Krishna is near Hastinapur

Originally posted by: NoraSM

Gandhari was present in court?

Wouldn't it take time for spies to deliver the news of Krishna's survival from the attack, considering he wasn't in Hastinapur

Although there's mention of Krishna walking there on foot (I think), maybe they got to know that Krishna is near Hastinapur

Gandhari is mentioned when jackals howl. The woman stayed silent until then. 😡 Like Krishna says to her when she curses him, everything which happened was HER fault also.

The simultaneous attacks wouldn't have been exactly at the same time. Krishna clearly didn't know dice game was about to happen. He says he didn't know to Yudhishtira. Which means that he was likely under attack before the game started.

Dwaraka and Hastinapuri had about 1500 km distance between them. 1 horsepower is about 50 km per hour. Ie, it would take 30 hours... less than 2 days for news to reach Hastinapuri.

Originally posted by: surabhi01

I never say abhimanyu was wicked and dussasan is good person so here abhimanyu vadh is wrong word

Like it is wrong to say kans ne 6 sons ka vadh kiya. Correct word is kan se 6 son ki hatya kia

It is wrong to say bhakt prasann hue. Correct word is bhakt आनंदित hue

Prassann word is use for God. That God uski tapasya se prasann hue

You might wanna take that up w/ Rishi Vyasa, or Vaisampayana: he/they used the term 'Abhimanyu-vadh' to name that chapter.

Like I said, vadh means either a legitimate killing in battle, or an execution. That's regardless of whether the object or subject of the verb is good or bad

Originally posted by: surabhi01

First of all ved vyas never called abhimanyu in dron parv

He called saubhadre to abhimanyu. In Sanskrit version it written saubhadre instead of abhimanyu in dron parv

And no where ved vyas mention abhimanyu vadh

It is mention in. Dron parv that is

Saubhadrasya nipaatanam

Mean subhrada ke bete ki mrityu

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/mbs/mbs07032.htm

Line 25

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m07/index.htm

It's the freaking name of the section: you had Dronabhisheka Parva, Abhimanyu-vadh Parva, Jayadratha-Vadh Parva, Ghatotkacha-vadh Parva and Drona-vadh Parva

You have the 'vadh' of 4 warriors - 2 from the Kaurava side, 2 from the Pandava side, being used to describe their sections.

And Ved Vyasa randomly uses the primary or secondary names of his heroes, probably to throw Ganesh off-base, and make him ponder while he composed the next verses. It had nothing to do w/ any endorsements

(Yeah, for some bizarre reason, this transcription spelt vadh as 'badha' for Abhimanyu and Ghatotkacha)