roopshas1 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#1
OK so I have already been asked to clarify about Bindusara's wives.

You have to understand the marriage laws of that era as well as understand its society. Just read my post about marriage laws in this link from MP forums. You will understand it better.


You see, marital relations was not only important but precious at that time. The kings or princes didn't just go about marrying anybody they wanted. Marital relations were important to establish relations between kingdoms. So very often they just married for official purposes. But if they fell in love with somebody and if they were not of royal lineages, there was trouble because if the prince married them (especially if its a first marriage), then the value of those inter-royal marriages can be questioned. So those so called "true love" often landed up as concubines . Very rarely did those so called "love" actually last, so it was a win-win situation for royal families - marital alliances for state purposes and concubines as lovers. The only notable exception is Ashoka who just rammed away and married a non-royal girl (Devi) for his first marriage and was devoted to her. It was only when they were estranged did he go a second (forced) marriage with Karuvaki aka Padmavati, the Princess of Kalinga.

OK the Greek and Persian thing...

Chandragupta had married the defeated King of Magadha Dhana Nanda's only daughter Durdhara who became his first wife and Empress Consort and gave birth to Bindusara. However, within a year, she died as Bindusara was born and Chandragupta, unusually for some reason, remained a grieving widower and a single father for next 18 years (sort of explains Bindusara's mother issues) until 302 BC when he married Seleucus's daughter in a political alliance. Seleucus was a Greek General who had become the King of Persia, Iraq and Syria after Alexander's death while his wife Apama was a Persian Princess, making their daughter half-Greek and half-Persian. Seleucus and Apama had four children- Antiochus (son), Apama (daughter) (yes, same name as her mother), Laodice (daughter) and Ageaus (son). We have records about Laodice marrying a Persian nobleman, so it is generally presumed that it was Apama who got married to Chandragupta. Apama was at that time the same age as Bindusara. Apama was a queen but never an Empress. The marriage produced no children and seemed to end amicably after Chandragupta's death four years later around 298 BC. The Mauryan-Seleucid relations between Bindusara and Antiochus were very good.

There was no Helen, Helena, Cornelia or whatever other name they give her. There was certainly no love story. Chandragupta was a grandfather by the time he married a second time. There was no Justin. He is a completely fictional character. And the Mauryas certainly did not have foreign-blooded offsprings. SO Chanakya never worried about foreign blood.

So, there you have your Greek and Persian connections. Now, coming to Binduasara.
Bindusara had 16 officially legal and married wives. But remember these are just the wives. Unlike Channdragupta who remained a monogamous widower for a long time, Bindusara had concubines as well. Might as well since he was Chandragupta's only child.

When Bindusara was around 16, he went and defeated the 16 kingdoms of the Deccan and added them to the Empire. The Mauryas wanted to be Ekchhatras i.e.s sole rulers of the subcontinent. So they used to dethrone the royal families, merge the kingdoms, create provinces and appoint direct governors. As a compensation for dethroning them, Bindusara married a princess from each of the 16 royal families.

The first of the wives was his Empress Consort who gave birth to a son Sushima, a daughter (name unknown) who gave birth to a son named Agnibrahmi and most probably two more sons named Sudatta and Sugatra.

His other fifteen wives also gave birth to four more sons and probably daughters as well. The 101 sons thing is a Buddhist exaggeration to elaborate Ashoka's cruelty before conversion.

There was no Noor. There was no Mir Khorasana. Bindusara didn't have a Persian consort. And Islam didn't even exist before seventh century AD. This is third century BC in the show.

Now, coming to Ashoka's mother.

OK, when Bindusara's first wife was around five months pregnant with Sushima, his Ajivika Guru Pingalavatsa prophecised that the unborn child will not become a great king and that Bindusara's child from a virgin daughter of a poor Ajivika Brahmin with certain physical characteristics (don't ask, its a long list) would bear him two sons - the elder would become the greatest emperor ever and the younger a monk who would achieve enlightenment. Historians agree that the prophecy was more religiously motivated move than an actual prophecy. Anyways, hearing this, Chanakya sent out orders to search for such girls and had them brought in to the palace as concubines.

Yes, Subhadrangi/Dharmaa/Janapadakalyani, Ashoka's mother, was a concubine, brought in to the palace to bear Bindusara's children. Nothing more than that. She was not a wife. So she certainly did not have any rights. She was not a rishikanya with Shakuntala-style romance as the show tries to make out. Just a daughter of a starving and poor Ajivika Brahmin. Bindusara's other wives were jealous of her beauty and tried make a fool of her but it backfired and it actually managed to impress Bindusara who praised her beauty and brains and made her the Chief of Concubines, not a queen or empress as wikipedia suggests. It gave her some powers but zero rights. That was one of the reasons why Ashoka had to kill his half-brothers who were all born of Bindusara's wives because as long as they were they had greater right than Ashoka to the throne. It didn't matter that Ashoka was older than them.

I hope this clarifies some of the doubt. And yeah, about Bindusara...already having Charumitra and Noor...TRUE LOVE DOES NOT GIVE YOU A LICENSE TO BE UNFAITHFUL!!!!


Edited by roopshas1 - 10 years ago

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Mirage09 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#2
Heya Gal...!!!! Thanks for the info...!!! I knew there was no justin nor there was any Noor...although I was not sure about Helen...so thought she existed...!!!
If I remember correctly, the show CGM prodded about a love story of Chandragupta n Helen...🤔

Mirage09 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#3
What about the two sons ?? One is Ashoka.., the other was ??🤓
MaxMayfield thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#4
Thanks roopshu - very insightful!⭐️
but is there any such thing about ashoka having some great bond with his mother?

and it is true na that ashoka and bindusara did not have great father-son relationship😕
Proud-India thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#5
Omg
Yaar they have research team


This is nor fiction

Are u historian?


How can u say this ?

Big historians are telling about this

The Mr.Ashok writer of this show...have researched from last 20 years

And are they mad that showing 100% fiction in first episode?

Please from which sources have u got this information?

And Khurasan is not fiction

Islam and Khurasan-Noor there is no relation

In Faras these names are famous from ancient time...not related to culture of islam

Later in islam...spread in Arab and Iran... They accepted these olden faras culture


navyasingh thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#6
thank you roopsha for sharing this information:)
these people have introduced many fictitious character from the very 1st episode

could you please tell me about dharma's other son.

~richa
roopshas1 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#7

Originally posted by: ---Anu---

What about the two sons ?? One is Ashoka.., the other was ??🤓


The other was Vigatashoka also known as Tishya or Vittashoka who was around eight years younger than Ashoka. Initially hated Buddhists and was quite a brat. He was even married but childless. He was the Crown Prince for the first four years when Ashoka become the Emperor and was the Governor of Takshashila Province under him. Ashoka loved him a lot but somewhere he was troubled by his brother' murders and went on to become a Buddhist monk. He was quite close to Mahendra, Ashoka's eldest son and heir. In fact, Tishya became the Crown Prince because Mahendra was not yet 20, the age of religious coronation. He accompanied him to Lanka and died there in 244 BC.
Edited by roopshas1 - 10 years ago
CatcherInTheRye thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#8
Thankiu so much
Bit i wonder y tjey add so much fictional bharacyers in historical show..i mean y
Huh
And whay aboit the youher bro of asoka
roopshas1 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#9

Originally posted by: ---Anu---

Heya Gal...!!!! Thanks for the info...!!! I knew there was no justin nor there was any Noor...although I was not sure about Helen...so thought she existed...!!!

If I remember correctly, the show CGM prodded about a love story of Chandragupta n Helen...🤔


You are welcome. Yup...there was no Justin nor Noor...but I think you misunderstood. Helen existed...as in the Greek wife of Chandragupta and daughter of Seleucus existed...but she was not named Helen...her name was Apama. God I have no idea why they have named her Helena. Why can't they just use her actual name?
Edited by roopshas1 - 10 years ago
Meself thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#10
And thus begins a saga of historical inaccuracies and discrepancies. Ironic it is for one side they scream and shout, advocating an already known fact that Asoka is the greatest emperor on this soil and on the other side they are skillfully marring his origins! Serves me right for putting up my hopes on DEFCON ONE! Anyways, may I disagree with you a bit?




Its true that a character like Justin never existed in a context that he was Chandrgupta's son; but there is a certain dispute over existence of Helena. Some are of the belief that Helena or Cornelia was Seleucus's daughter married off to Chandragupta; while other believe that these were two different ladies who were under the Imperial Patronage. Not sure which is true but a certain vague mention is made to Helena/Cornelia every now and then.




Next Shubhadrangi/Dharma; well this was the very reason I shot that PM to you. While some historians believe her to be a rakshita(keep) in the palace, most of them suggest that she was a rani(low queen). Either way she was a neglected and less cared for woman. It was during her pregnancy that prophecy had been made that her son shall rise like no else; bringing her back to everyone's notice. So the fact that she was left abandoned in a forest is way too farfetched.




Another glitch in this entire setting is Noor Khorsan's lineage. She is shown as Persian princess when truth is she wasn't. There is a mention of a courtesan from Persia who was gifted to Bindusara by Seleucus, but she being a Muslim and a wife to Bindusara is simply preposterous! She might have enjoyed her position in the Imperial court for a while but definitely had no hold over the politics of the place like they are suggesting. Not only this that Persian courtesan (who is unnamed) was not brought along with her family.




The first episode was a jumbled up mix, what surprised me more was active involvement of Chanakya! Wasn't he by that time a silent beneficiary of the empire?And where is Amatya Rakshash??




And as far was Kaurwaki is concerned; the recent finding suggests that Padmavati and Kaurwaki and two different women; for Padmavati was killed before Devi's return back to Magadha and Asoka married Kaurwaki after her return. Although this aspect is still is under discussion by some!



Oh and thank you so much Roopsha for putting this all up!

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