Abetment of suicide: Instigating vs. inspiring

tinoo thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#1
I see a lot of posts here which state that jagya did not abet suicide because he did not actually hand her the weapon which she slit her wrists with, and he did not tell her that she is worthless, she shouldn't live etc. (i.e. verbal abuse).
But there is a distinction between ' instigation' to suicide and 'inspiring' someone to suicide.
While instigating is a direct aggressive form of abuse that pushes someone to commit suicide,
"Inspiration" is creating so much emotional distress that a person is forced to commit or attempt suicide.
I believe that Jagya is definitely guilty of inspiring saanchi to try to commit suicide -- breaking off the engagement after the wedding cards have gone out -- and then marrying ganga three days later.
While technically there is no set time when an engagement can be broken off, and also no legal time period wherein one has to wait to get engaged/married after breaking off previous engagement and marriage -- the legal system does base its interpretation on "good faith intentions".
I personally disagree with Jagya's approach 200% even though saanchi has been a complete ass.
I do not believe that he entered into this engagement with good faith, nor do I believe he dissolved it in good faith, and he was already in love with ganga while in the relationship with saanchi -- whether he married her with intentions to marry her or under duress from sumitra's behaviour is irrelevant. He was emotionally involved with ganga right from the beginning. And he knew even when shiv asked him, and even when ira asked him, that he was not happy with the rishta and he still continued. He knows that really well, its his conscience here that will tell him. The realization that saanchi was not a good fit for him did not come like a ton of bricks falling on his head when he overheard her talking to her friends at the restaurant.
And therefore, his bad faith moves may indeed make him an accomplice to suicide through "inspiring" her to commit suicide even though he did not formally "instigate" it.
Two years ago, there was a case where a woman committed suicide after murdering her two children and left behind a note that she was doing it because of her husband's neglect. He was an alcoholic. Now the key is that he would just come home drunk every day and lie in a corner somewhere in a drunken stupor. He was never abusive to his wife or kids, but he just wasn't present in the way a husband should be, and his money was all going to alcohol. The wife saw a bleak future for her and the kids and decided that she couldn't continue living like this. The court awarded him seven years imprisonment under section 306 for neglect of his wife and "inspiring" her to commit suicide.
Now we can argue, "what did he do?" ... but the key take-away for this is to realize that we are all living in an interconnected society, and we have obligations and responsibility for the energy we bring into people's lives. We have to take care of these.
The question is not whether the engagement should have been broken or not ... the question is did he break it in good faith or break it in bad faith? And this is where the court will have to decide.
In itself, till he broke the engagement with saanchi off, there was no way the court could have convicted him ... because that his right and choice... and the court cannot mandate that someone should be married to someone else. Yet what weakens Jagya's case is that he married ganga three days immediately thereafter. It definitely shows that there was something between Jagya and ganga WHILE THE ENGAGEMENT WITH SAANCHI WAS STILL ON. While he married ganga after breaking the engagement with saanchi, it is evident that there was a love affair of sorts (private in both hearts or explicit in public is irrelevant). And this is where it can legitimately be argued that Jagya acted in bad faith. And consequently is an abettor to her suicide attempt.

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642126 thumbnail
Posted: 12 years ago
#2
Again an informative and thought provoking post Tinoo!👏

Yes Jagya could be held for inspiring suicide. Because clearly he was not into this rishta from day one, he felt forced and stifled, YET he kept giving reassurances to Shekhars, he would try to avoid Sanchi and he suddenly broke off without talking to her and Singhs. His sudden marriage to Ganga only weakens his stance even though he may not have planned to marry her so soon.

It is only when Sanchi's suicide is proven fake and an attention-seeking act, her other lies and EB (agree to this marriage or I will die!) are exposed, her intent on questioning Jagya's character is questioned (when Jagya's reformed character is brought to light) and issues of time lag between break up, Jagya's remarriage and her suicide attempt are examined - that Jagya will then get some respite and sword will hang on Sanchi's head.
Missesha thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#3
@ Tinoo. Great post.
@ Skepblun, I feel Sa's case is not as weak as J's

- Pandit bribery - could be looked as, she was only eager to marry, and it does not give any sort of emotional stress to J, to get engaged / married a few days earlier, as the engagement / marriage was happening with his consent. Timings may not matter much.

- Gossiping - Is a good reason for J to doubt Sa and his compatibility with her but not a strong reason to break off. And definitely not an acceptable reason to immediately marry Ganga.

- On the other hand, "facts" such as Sa was trying to change to suit the relationship will favour her case.

- I am not sure if the suicide attempt can be proven fake, as Sa lost lot of blood and was lying unconscious when A first found her.

On the contrary J's case weakens only one point, but it's a major one; the fact that he married G in 2-3 days. Obviously court will suspect that he had hidden intentions and his past history may go against him.

Just my thoughts. Will have to see how the court scenes go

Edited by Missesha - 12 years ago
SPuja thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#4

Originally posted by: Missesha

@ Tinoo. Great post.

@ Skepblun, I feel Sa's case is not as weak as J's

- Pandit bribery - could be looked as, she was only eager to marry, and it does not give any sort of emotional stress to J, to get engaged / married a few days earlier, as the engagement / marriage was happening with his consent. Timings may not matter much.

- Gossiping - Is a good reason for J to doubt Sa and his compatibility with her but not a strong reason to break off. And definitely not an acceptable reason to immediately marry Ganga.

- On the other hand, "facts" such as Sa was trying to change to suit the relationship will favour her case.

- I am not sure if the suicide attempt can be proven fake, as Sa lost lot of blood and was lying unconscious when A first found her.

On the contrary J's case weakens only one point, but it's a major one; the fact that he married G in 2-3 days. Obviously court will suspect that he had hidden intentions and his past history may go against him.

Just my thoughts. Will have to see how the court scenes go


Not much hope to see something logical even in court scene. We know this serial is about Singh family- so they are right - since they are supporting Jagya, so nothing will prove against him.
tinoo thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#5
BTW, today's news has a news story of a principal being arrested under section 306 because he failed to do anything about ragging owing to which a girl commited suicide.
so it is evident that neglect of one's duty can also be seen as abetment.
Spring-Dew thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#6

Originally posted by: tinoo

I see a lot of posts here which state that jagya did not abet suicide because he did not actually hand her the weapon which she slit her wrists with, and he did not tell her that she is worthless, she shouldn't live etc. (i.e. verbal abuse).

But there is a distinction between ' instigation' to suicide and 'inspiring' someone to suicide.
While instigating is a direct aggressive form of abuse that pushes someone to commit suicide,
"Inspiration" is creating so much emotional distress that a person is forced to commit or attempt suicide.
I believe that Jagya is definitely guilty of inspiring saanchi to try to commit suicide -- breaking off the engagement after the wedding cards have gone out -- and then marrying ganga three days later.
The suicide drama itself a fake drama played by Sanchi to win Jagya and the wedding cards didn't went out
While technically there is no set time when an engagement can be broken off, and also no legal time period wherein one has to wait to get engaged/married after breaking off previous engagement and marriage -- the legal system does base its interpretation on "good faith intentions".
What to talk about good faith here🤢 he broke the engagement to prevent problems in future and that was absolutely correct
I personally disagree with Jagya's approach 200% even though saanchi has been a complete ass.
I disagree with Shiv's revenge approach 2000%
I do not believe that he entered into this engagement with good faith, nor do I believe he dissolved it in good faith, and he was already in love with ganga while in the relationship with saanchi -- whether he married her with intentions to marry her or under duress from sumitra's behaviour is irrelevant. He was emotionally involved with ganga right from the beginning. And he knew even when shiv asked him, and even when ira asked him, that he was not happy with the rishta and he still continued. He knows that really well, its his conscience here that will tell him. The realization that saanchi was not a good fit for him did not come like a ton of bricks falling on his head when he overheard her talking to her friends at the restaurant.
I believe in good faith no worries many of them accepted it .He realised his love later...
and he was Ganga's friend from the beginning it is a pure relationship and few talk rubbish about it🤢Sumitra was the one who is responsible for all mess😡
And therefore, his bad faith moves may indeed make him an accomplice to suicide through "inspiring" her to commit suicide even though he did not formally "instigate" it.
I said b4 itself there is nothing to feel pity for Sanchi bcoz her suicide attempt was a drama made by her
Two years ago, there was a case where a woman committed suicide after murdering her two children and left behind a note that she was doing it because of her husband's neglect. He was an alcoholic. Now the key is that he would just come home drunk every day and lie in a corner somewhere in a drunken stupor. He was never abusive to his wife or kids, but he just wasn't present in the way a husband should be, and his money was all going to alcohol. The wife saw a bleak future for her and the kids and decided that she couldn't continue living like this. The court awarded him seven years imprisonment under section 306 for neglect of his wife and "inspiring" her to commit suicide.
Now we can argue, "what did he do?" ... but the key take-away for this is to realize that we are all living in an interconnected society, and we have obligations and responsibility for the energy we bring into people's lives. We have to take care of these.
The question is not whether the engagement should have been broken or not ... the question is did he break it in good faith or break it in bad faith? And this is where the court will have to decide.
He break the engagement to prevent obstacles in future
In itself, till he broke the engagement with saanchi off, there was no way the court could have convicted him ... because that his right and choice... and the court cannot mandate that someone should be married to someone else. Yet what weakens Jagya's case is that he married ganga three days immediately thereafter. It definitely shows that there was something between Jagya and ganga WHILE THE ENGAGEMENT WITH SAANCHI WAS STILL ON. While he married ganga after breaking the engagement with saanchi, it is evident that there was a love affair of sorts (private in both hearts or explicit in public is irrelevant). And this is where it can legitimately be argued that Jagya acted in bad faith. And consequently is an abettor to her suicide attempt.

Talking nonsense about Jagan relationship is disagreed. prove me when did he had private affair with her🤢 he married Ganga bcoz he love her and that he did after breaking the rishtaa and marrying Ganga is his perosnal choice! once again her suicide attempt was just an drama made by her to win Jagya and the great Collector fool can't understand his own sister's feelings🤢 Shivraj bcame fool in his sister love ...
The main reason which few r bothered for Sanchi bcoz she is a victim and a good soul🤢🤪

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