Rewind and Review - Episode 6 - Page 5

Me in blue!

Originally posted by: kiranpri

Shaurya is fully justified in his act. Well not being rude and all, but why should he even entertain any relationship with anyone or even listen to the woman who left him and never bothered to look back.

Aastha demands respect. Which in one way I appreciate, but also would she have recognized her son if not for Shaan sending a photo or hearing the name "Shaurya Sabherwal" announced? From Shaurya's point of view she's a stranger that keeps cornering him. She's a part of his past that keeps wanting his attention. She's the one not getting a clue and then demanding his respect. I don't really fault Shaurya's actions.

Shaurya despite everything, felt the hurt again, when Asthaa took Anokhi away with her before he could say anything more to her. It is a sign of protection of Asthaa for Anokhi. And the direct comparison of leaving behind Shaurya gives us a glimpse into the depth of his misery.

It's these little scenes that KV has done such a great job in making Shaurya someone we can sympathize with. When he heard his mom's name for the first time, he scanned the crowd to see her. When Anokhi talked about upbringing, the look he gave his mom. And then when she walked away with her student that got his share of attention, he had such a sad look. You're so right, she walked away protecting Anokhi from him, as he remember being left behind by her. All of this just made me start to love Shaurya as a flawed human than the annoying sexist man he was being with Shagun.

Shaan was only a lover and nothing else. Being from an affluent family, and having an elder brother to take care of everything may very well lead to other members of the family being only there as an addendum and nothing else. Shaan could wallow in his misery and there is Alok who was the devoted younger son, at the beck and call of his bhabhi.

Stupid male privilege is what allowed Shaan to be a drunk and still have a roof over his head. He seems too soft for the real world; probably didn't want to struggle in the outside world when his claim to fame is that he's a Sabherwal. And Tej was only too happy to have his brothers dance to his tune.

Notice the signal that Tej gave to Devi when Asthaa was walking away with her son.

Yes, Gaytri was factual and showed the other side of the story, but has never dared to say anything to Shaurya about it, telling us how dominating Tej and Devi are.

I really wished Gayatri had opened up to Shaurya about what happened with his mom. She's a witness to it all and has more credibility than Kanchan.

Yes, today this struck a chord with me. Why lie? Why hide the truth? How does this affect her relation with her student. At that moment in time, she does not know that Anokhi would be going to SIAC, so why the mystery. What does this tell us about Anokhi? She can accept a lie from a person she loves, Isn't this against her principles?

Anokhi might not see it as such a big lie. Aastha and Anokhi never had a conversation about Shaurya/Aastha patch up either......such a missed opportunity. I'm trying to remember if Anokhi has lied before...I can't think of an instance.

I believe we still have families of the Bhalla type where the women live in fear. The whole bhalla family are very good actors.

In the 5th and 6th episode we are given a glimpse of the type of relation that Shakhi will have. Shaurya despite his reluctance would be attracted by the fiery nature of Anokhi and he will start to listen to someone other than BM, who will make him reflect on his actions. Shaurya has been surrounded by meek women in his household, so having an intelligent, sharp girl who can challenge him would be welcome, as he himself is very intelligent.

I love everything about this. Shaurya has always been compared to Shaan and Anokhi to Aastha. Here you can see that dynamic. Shaurya is righteous like Shaan can be. Anokhi is a spitfire like Aastha. It's not a surprise that Shaurya would like that spirit. And you're right that Anokhi is different from the meek women of the Sabherwal household.

Felt bad for Shaurya for his yearning, and for the Bhalla girls/women who are living in an abusive household.

I watched ep3-ep6 in one shot so here goes my thoughts-

Shaurya is an embodiment of "One bitten twice shy". I have always found it interesting as how people perceive things and absorb them. It is not that he does not believe in a woman's capability to manage both household and work but he does not want to risk it given his own experience and why should he, there is no financial reason for his wife to work. His father is asking him to rethink his decision but given what his father has done with life, his words hold no influence over him. It will take a woman who either he wants desperately at any cost or someone he trusts implicit manage both aspects of life very well and still feel secure in their feelings for him to take the leap of faith and Shagun is not it. It does not help that Devi is instigating him and Shagun unfortunately picked the worst possible way to break the news to him and then did exactly what he feared most- pick career. He is so overwhelmed with feelings of betrayal and abandonment that no logic will appeal to him. I did not take an offence to his odd speech given his mindset. His fiancé just picked her education over him, he just saw his mother who abandoned him and seemed to be oblivious to the emotional destruction she left in her wake when she left. He has a woman talking about independence and career and identity but what about her responsibility as a member of family. It is Sabherwal upbringing speaking but it is also his frustration speaking. He is smart enough to know such speech would not be received well in the forum he was standing in.

His meeting with his mother and his clash with her was interesting. I always feel like he tries to get a rise out of Shaan and Astha with his insulting words. Almost as if he wants to see if they feel something for him, if they feel even a little bit of regret that they they are not part of their son's life. If they understand his agony and feel anything close to it themselves. I think Astha and Shaan have gotten so used to wearing their stoic masks that they fail their son in giving the reaction that he wants from them. The more he fails in getting reaction, the more he withdraws. His meeting with his mother is almost like adding insult to injury after what he went with Shagun. She seems to be living a charmed life with her fav student and public recognition while his father is pining for her and had turned alcoholic and he himself was abandoned to the care of others. He seems to want to understand if he was not worthy of same love that she is lavishing on her student.

Shaan is principled but I am not sure if he truly is. He seems to have his heart in right place but he tends to pick the path of least resistance when he needs to act. I am just flabbergasted at the fact that while he seems to pine after his wife but he has never once defended her even in her absence. His silence is validation to all the stories Devi has been feeding Shaurya. I find it funny that no one ever tried to tell him the truth or even hinted at it.

Not a popular opinion but on this rewatch my opinion of Astha plummeted. As a mother myself, I owe my kid all the protection and love I could garner when I decided to bring them to this world. Their complete dependency and trust on me ensured that they would always be my priority, over myself, over my family and over my husband until they were old enough to be self dependent. I don't understand how Astha could just walk out on her kid for her old parents. I understand that she had responsibilities towards both but we are talking about an old couple vs 4 year old. She had to also know that she was leaving her son amongst sharks and he would grow nothing like she would have wanted. She claims to have wanted to contact him but she did not exhaust all avenues. She never contacted Shaan to try and meet her son and find out about him. All these years she never sent a message to him to ask how her son was doing and 25 years is a very long time. She meets her son after 25 years and she demands respect from him, I don't get what is going through her head.

Anokhi is in full rebellious mode and she has put Astha on pedestal. She cannot be wrong and thus everyone pointing a finger at her is wrong. This dynamics sets up stage for future clashes between Shaurya and Anokhi. As some of you have mentioned there was no need for her to irk her abusive father more just to go and get the prize. I understand that the public recognition would go along way towards bolstering her confidence and validate that she is worthy but she did this knowing it would put her mother and sister at risk. I won't make an excuse for her not would judge her, she is completely fair as a human. It is often said that one needs to love himself first before others can do the same. Rama and Babli's self doubt regarding if they are worthy and fear of failing makes them vulnerable to all the abuse that is being piled on them.

Here are some question that I struggle with as I saw these episodes-

1)If one should always think about self and one's happiness then why do we judge Shaurya for not picking Shagun's happiness over his in most simplistic terms? Also in any family, where every member has different thought processes and goals, how do you retain the fabric of the family when everyone is running in different directions chasing their own dreams which might be at odds with other family members? As a woman, you have a right to make choices as any other living being but how do you balance your personal ambitions with your role as a mother, as a wife, as a daughter .....? By the way this conundrum is not limited to women but is applicable to men too.

2)I am going to play devil's advocate for a minute-In a relationship, both parties have expectations and there is truly no wrong or right just if what you bring to the table satisfies the other party. Why would we expect that women should hold onto their pride, fulfill their ambitions, dream big even if it means major adjustments for their lover and men should bow down in the name of love but reverse is not true. We call it sacrifice/compromise when women bow down in name of love. I am not saying this just in context of Shaurya but Shaan too. Astha wanted to work to hold onto her pride, maintain her identity and take care of her parents and she wanted it so badly that she was willing to walk out on her husband and son. Our implicit expectation including mine was that Shaan should have supported her and walked out with her. But what about Shaan? What about his pride? How did he feel when his wife depriortized him and his son? Why and how could he walk out on Saberwals, he too had commitments to work with them and take care of them as a family member. What about his identity ? Astha felt betrayed that he did not support her but she did not support him either. In essence they failed in communication and solving problem together because they were too caught up in their own identity crisis and pride.

3) We seem to think that women have got a raw deal in society and that is completely true but the society also puts a lot of pressure on men to conform too. In some ways society has decided responsibilities and behavior based on gender and any deviation from it tends to generate a very nasty response. If working women are challenged, then house husbands are looked down on too. If women are looked down when their children fail, men are looked down on when they are unable to earn enough money to support their families. If Astha was pining after Shaan constantly trying to contact him , it would have been more acceptable than when Shaan was doing it.

Originally posted by: kiranpri

I think Aastha is still under the impression that Shaan is also responsible in bringing up Shaurya along with the rest of the family. Otherwise she wouldn't have mentioned that he resembles his dad if she knew how much Shaurya dislikes him too. She finds out only later on that Shaan was pretty much as absent in his son's life as she was. Only then she realizes that she made a big mistake by leaving him. So Aastha's decision of not looking back at her son for 25 years can also stem from the fact that she was assured that his dad was with him. She did say later that she was present at every important occasion in his life, but from afar. Still doesn't justify her leaving her son for 25 years with people she knows are selfish and incapable of love. Which is what she will regret soon.

Anokhi does manage to rip off his veneer bit by bit. But the first time he actually sheds a tear is when he visits his mom in the dead of the night at the hospital. Unknown to himself, a few drops do slip out of his eyes seeing her lifeless in the hospital bed. Something he has been conditioned to never do by his Badi Maa.

About lying to Anokhi, I think she doesn't want to complicate things for herself nor for Shaurya? Knowing Anokhi, she just might go up to him and question him on his behaviour with his own mother- exactly what she did when she first came to know the truth. Right now she doesn't know that their lives are going to get even more tangled with Anokhi applying to SIAC itself. So this was probably, to her, a one-off interaction which will have no significance in the future.

KV does an amazing job of portraying every emotion so perfectly that we as the audience can decipher exactly what he wants to say without him saying a word.

Anokhi and her clear focus is very commendable. She has a goal and is all set to achieve it. She wants liberalization, first for the women in her family and then women at large. She sees her education as the means to achieve it and will do everything she can to work towards it.

Shaurya and Aastha confrontation is so great to see….25 years in the making. It has both mind and heart. Aastha loves her son but also won’t tolerate any disrespect. Shaurya is savage in addressing her as “tum” but also you can see the little boy look in his eyes when she walks away. Love their battle of words because they’re both so curt with each other.

Oh I absolutely loved this. How they both expressed their love and disappointment without a lot of words and indirect assertions. Anokhi was there and could not read the room. I don't blame her now, but you know, I always feel she is never able to read shaurya in the first go ever.

Shaan is soooo spineless. It’s one thing to not have the courage to leave yourself but to keep a son and mother apart is unforgivable. Tejvi used their money and position for blackmail against Aastha and their power is their facade of mahaanta that has put Shaan in their karz. Side note, I really enjoy the way Gayatri told the story of the past to Kanchan. Gayatri deserved to be more than a wallflower on the show!

Why did Shaan not go back? The man walloed in self pity and alcohol. Ignored his son but could not ask his wife to come back once? What was stopping him? Maybe his own self esteem was so low that he never could. I can't the put the full blame on tejvi, they took advantage of a situation shaan created. The bahus of the house except devi are silent and righteous. I think what gayatri could not do kanchan will..the story will flow that way.

Aastha lied to Anokhi. She’s hiding her truth. Anokhi’s idol of right & wrong and truth & falsity is capable of telling a lie! I find it interesting that Anokhi never calls her out of this omission.

Aastha has always been curt, to the point and private. Well, what is she supposed to tell a 19 yr old girl? But yes in the future too anokhi always chooses white ovee grey. Completely agreed.

Until we get more of the Khannas and Monty, I don’t care to comment on Canada rishta! It sucks that Rama and Babli were trembling with fear and that Ramesh had the audacity to take his anger out on Rama. He is so repulsive.

*No words* , the less said is better about Bhalla senior and his Canada ka rishta

First real conversation between Shakhi!! It was a lecture!! She lectured him on being rude!! Their future equation was set from the very beginning. Last episode she forced him to give a speech. This time she lectured him. The bedrock of their relationship is that she talks and he listens and she gets her way! Her boldness and assertiveness adds to her attraction for Shaurya(in the future).

I always felt the chemistry since the first time they collided. I remember watching that scene on hotstar and then re-watching it a couple of times. The chemistry uff. She talks and she makes him reflect. She makes him confront. But she never listened. (Something I don't like..sigh!). Both these characters are quite similar on some front, adamant and righteous in their own way. Maybe that is why when they clash, we all tend to think. Also, she also hits him where it hurst the most. Her comment about his mother's etiquettes given to him and his face. Oh god! I think this is the charm, that they almost fight for the same things with different pov's. Making even the viewers debate.

Precap: Abusive Ramesh Bhalla comes out again! Ugh! 😩

Thoughts?

/QUOTE]

I am in black

Me in pink.

Loved all the points you made. Just picked some specific ones to respond to.

Originally posted by: ss286

His anger and disappointment in her shows clearly and his lack of respect cannot be faulted too knowing what he has gone through in the last 25 years. When he sees his mom holding the hand of another ward and dragging her away from a confrontation, he hopes she had done that 25 years ago when he pleaded her to not leave him. Again the parallels amaze me!

I love that all of us had similar reactions to this scene. We all saw the hurt look in Shaurya when Aastha dragged Anokhi away, as he remembered being left behind as she walked away 25 years ago. I LOVE the parallels of this how.

He does seem taken aback by Anokhi defending Aastha all of a sudden. But this is just the beginning of all the "lectures" he is going to endure with her 'Aastha M'am' at the core.

It took the rewatch for me realize that Anokhi's lectures and Aastha ma'am jhaap has been an essential part of the ShaKhi story from the beginning.

And yes, the subtle, yet typical line about 'Boys don't cry, girls do' . No wonder he never had the courage to show his vulnerabilities in front of his closest confidante- his Badi Maa even!

I had forgotten about this line. This dialogue reflects how masculinity is viewed in our society. It's how the patriarchy/misogyny/sexism/toxic masculinity hurts males as well. And you're right, this is probably why Shaurya has never felt right sharing his real persona with his Badi Ma.

Shaan's biggest mistake was not taking a stand for his wife against his family. Shaurya would have been saved from being "orphaned" if his dad and mom were on the same side that day. Shaan's living in the past and not concerning himself with his son's future has been his other big mistake. Is Aastha aware of how Shaurya has been living without his father's support? Or does she think that Shaurya hates only her? From Shaan's messages she seems to have not been answering him at all.

Shaan's texts makes me think that Aastha has never tried to talk to him, so is probably unaware that Shaan hasn't been raising their son as Aastha probably intended. I find it weird that she didn't even check in on her son. Her reasons for leaving were her parents, and if she never intended on abandoning her son, why didn't she do the bare minimum in checking in with Shaan?

Originally posted by: black.snowflake

Oh I absolutely loved this. How they both expressed their love and disappointment without a lot of words and indirect assertions. Anokhi was there and could not read the room. I don't blame her now, but you know, I always feel she is never able to read shaurya in the first go ever.

Why did Shaan not go back? The man walloed in self pity and alcohol. Ignored his son but could not ask his wife to come back once? What was stopping him? Maybe his own self esteem was so low that he never could. I can't the put the full blame on tejvi, they took advantage of a situation shaan created. The bahus of the house except devi are silent and righteous. I think what gayatri could not do kanchan will..the story will flow that way.

Aastha has always been curt, to the point and private. Well, what is she supposed to tell a 19 yr old girl? But yes in the future too anokhi always chooses white ovee grey. Completely agreed.

*No words* , the less said is better about Bhalla senior and his Canada ka rishta

I always felt the chemistry since the first time they collided. I remember watching that scene on hotstar and then re-watching it a couple of times. The chemistry uff. She talks and she makes him reflect. She makes him confront. But she never listened. (Something I don't like..sigh!). Both these characters are quite similar on some front, adamant and righteous in their own way. Maybe that is why when they clash, we all tend to think. Also, she also hits him where it hurst the most. Her comment about his mother's etiquettes given to him and his face. Oh god! I think this is the charm, that they almost fight for the same things with different pov's. Making even the viewers debate.

You're soooo right, Anokhi always had a tendency to judge Shaurya based on something she conjured up and misunderstand him. I don't really blame her because she doesn't have much experience with men. She looks at people as black or white. She thinks what people say or show is their true face. With Shaurya, he tends to hide his feelings and hide his thoughts being this mask of sarcasm and meanness. Anokhi never could fully read him.

She was great at confronting him and laying out her thoughts. But you're right, she never learned to listen and fully absorb what he has said. But this all added to their sizzling chemistry that I often overlooked it all.

Shaan is a mystery to me. He regretted his actions but never tried to correct them. And unfortunately we never got to know the real reason behind it all.

Me in green

Originally posted by: pj10

I watched ep3-ep6 in one shot so here goes my thoughts-

It will take a woman who either he wants desperately at any cost or someone he trusts implicit manage both aspects of life very well and still feel secure in their feelings for him to take the leap of faith and Shagun is not it.

We all know such a woman is coming! I think the first holds more true with Anokhi. He just falls for her so hard from his side than feeling secure in her love for him. He needed to love so hard that his abandonment issues took a back seat.

It does not help that Devi is instigating him and Shagun unfortunately picked the worst possible way to break the news to him and then did exactly what he feared most- pick career. He is so overwhelmed with feelings of betrayal and abandonment that no logic will appeal to him. I did not take an offence to his odd speech given his mindset. His fiancé just picked her education over him, he just saw his mother who abandoned him and seemed to be oblivious to the emotional destruction she left in her wake when she left.

Shagun made him face all his fears. He'd wanted a nice secure life with a housewife he "loved", which Shagun seemed to fit well. Until she decided she didn't want to be a housewife and being "loved" by him wasn't enough. At that point, I don't know why Shagun was trying to stay with Shaurya, but also go to grad school for 2 years. I'm glad she gets the point that he doesn't love her enough to even try.

I always feel like he tries to get a rise out of Shaan and Astha with his insulting words. Almost as if he wants to see if they feel something for him, if they feel even a little bit of regret that they they are not part of their son's life. If they understand his agony and feel anything close to it themselves. I think Astha and Shaan have gotten so used to wearing their stoic masks that they fail their son in giving the reaction that he wants from them. The more he fails in getting reaction, the more he withdraws. His meeting with his mother is almost like adding insult to injury after what he went with Shagun. She seems to be living a charmed life with her fav student and public recognition while his father is pining for her and had turned alcoholic and he himself was abandoned to the care of others. He seems to want to understand if he was not worthy of same love that she is lavishing on her student.

My heart breaks for Shaurya for all the reasons you wrote. Children often fight their parents when they're young. They try to instigate them and learn to be secure in their love at a young age(if they're lucky). Shaurya wasn't so lucky, with having both his parents being absent, he stayed that hurt and lonely boy. As an adult he gets a chance to poke at them, annoy them, insult them, piss them off and see if they stick around. He wants that unconditional love from them, wanting reciprocation for the love which I believe he holds for them. You're right that every time he fails to get a reaction, he seems to pull himself back and become more 'stoic'.

He's judging his mom's life from the outside just like Aastha is probably doing too. Aastha just sees the successful Shaurya Sabherwal, just as Shaurya sees the content Aastha Sabherwal. Why else would she not reach out to her son, if not because he's been replaced and she's moved on from her family? I don't fault Shaurya his anger at all. I don't think it's his responsibility to make peace with his mother.

Not a popular opinion but on this rewatch my opinion of Astha plummeted. As a mother myself, I owe my kid all the protection and love I could garner when I decided to bring them to this world. Their complete dependency and trust on me ensured that they would always be my priority, over myself, over my family and over my husband until they were old enough to be self dependent. I don't understand how Astha could just walk out on her kid for her old parents. I understand that she had responsibilities towards both but we are talking about an old couple vs 4 year old. She had to also know that she was leaving her son amongst sharks and he would grow nothing like she would have wanted. She claims to have wanted to contact him but she did not exhaust all avenues. She never contacted Shaan to try and meet her son and find out about him. All these years she never sent a message to him to ask how her son was doing and 25 years is a very long time. She meets her son after 25 years and she demands respect from him, I don't get what is going through her head.

I totally agree with you here. I admire Aastha as a woman who made a difficult decision and learned to survive on her own, but what she has done to her child is unforgivable. No matter the level of emotional blackmail she might have faced, to not meet her child even in adulthood is disgraceful.

Anokhi is in full rebellious mode and she has put Astha on pedestal. She cannot be wrong and thus everyone pointing a finger at her is wrong. This dynamics sets up stage for future clashes between Shaurya and Anokhi. As some of you have mentioned there was no need for her to irk her abusive father more just to go and get the prize. I understand that the public recognition would go along way towards bolstering her confidence and validate that she is worthy but she did this knowing it would put her mother and sister at risk. I won't make an excuse for her not would judge her, she is completely fair as a human. It is often said that one needs to love himself first before others can do the same. Rama and Babli's self doubt regarding if they are worthy and fear of failing makes them vulnerable to all the abuse that is being piled on them.

Here are some question that I struggle with as I saw these episodes-

1)If one should always think about self and one's happiness then why do we judge Shaurya for not picking Shagun's happiness over his in most simplistic terms? Also in any family, where every member has different thought processes and goals, how do you retain the fabric of the family when everyone is running in different directions chasing their own dreams which might be at odds with other family members? As a woman, you have a right to make choices as any other living being but how do you balance your personal ambitions with your role as a mother, as a wife, as a daughter .....? By the way this conundrum is not limited to women but is applicable to men too.

I don't think I judge Shaurya's reasons for breaking up with Shagun....he wanted a housewife, she wants to study.....they're not on the same page, they should break up! I judge him for his thoughts/beliefs. A woman is not made to meet a man's standards. But also I don't think you should marry anyone who doesn't share your personal wants in life. Life is long and shouldn't be spent with someone who won't make you happy. This is one of the reasons I respected Anokhi's decision to love Shaurya but not wanting to be with him because their outlook on life is different and she wasn't trying to change him.

2)I am going to play devil's advocate for a minute-In a relationship, both parties have expectations and there is truly no wrong or right just if what you bring to the table satisfies the other party. Why would we expect that women should hold onto their pride, fulfill their ambitions, dream big even if it means major adjustments for their lover and men should bow down in the name of love but reverse is not true. We call it sacrifice/compromise when women bow down in name of love. I am not saying this just in context of Shaurya but Shaan too. Astha wanted to work to hold onto her pride, maintain her identity and take care of her parents and she wanted it so badly that she was willing to walk out on her husband and son. Our implicit expectation including mine was that Shaan should have supported her and walked out with her. But what about Shaan? What about his pride? How did he feel when his wife depriortized him and his son? Why and how could he walk out on Saberwals, he too had commitments to work with them and take care of them as a family member. What about his identity ? Astha felt betrayed that he did not support her but she did not support him either. In essence they failed in communication and solving problem together because they were too caught up in their own identity crisis and pride.

These thoughts and arguments would be more valid in an equal society. And since we're not there, it's hard to have a real conversation about this. I agree that men and women should be able to live independent lives and strive for their dreams, no matter what they are. But the society, worldwide, that we live in prioritizes a man's life over a woman's. Women do put aside education and career for marriage, family, and children. The nurturer is still a mother, as if the Y chromosome makes men incapable. When we can evolve our society into one that has the same expectation from both genders, then we can have a real conversation about the impact on men when a woman makes a decision that is seen as 'selfish'. Even though I find a mother's decision's impact on her child to be a valid one.

This a a good thought experiment though.

3) We seem to think that women have got a raw deal in society and that is completely true but the society also puts a lot of pressure on men to conform too. In some ways society has decided responsibilities and behavior based on gender and any deviation from it tends to generate a very nasty response. If working women are challenged, then house husbands are looked down on too. If women are looked down when their children fail, men are looked down on when they are unable to earn enough money to support their families. If Astha was pining after Shaan constantly trying to contact him , it would have been more acceptable than when Shaan was doing it.

I totally agree with this. Our society might be patriarchal but the system does a disservice to males as well. The 'boys don't cry' and 'boys will be boys' can hurt women and men equally. These gender norms have really hurt all of us. But since male privilege is innate to the system, it's hard to feel bad for men, when women are sacrificed at the altar of a man's whims, dreams, and decisions.