In your dharma palan only Kaikeyi's selfishness will win- Jabali

Now look at Jabali's accusations. I cannot permit you to go. If you go it is not dharma that is winning, but Kaikeyi's plan which is adharm. In the name of vachan, tradition what you are doing is injustice to the common man. As a crown prince you are shunning your responsibilities and allowing a woman's desire to have the upper hand. You are allowing her to win.

Yes with the present knowledge Jabali had whatever Jabali says is true. Ram going for vanvass is adharma winning so it looks. But irrespective of that adharma Ram does the vachan palan. And note the point that everyone understand it till here. So for your father it is expected that even if it is adharma you have to do it. That's son's duty. Doesnt matter if the society suffers. That is the truth seen. And that is the truth taken by everyone. Which includes Bhishma

But there is a truth unseen. And in understanding that unseen truth lies the greatness of Ram. Greatness of his action. Leela of Hari which people think only Krishna does not Ram. Unfortunately no. Ram is Vishnu. And what is Vishnu without Maya.

Certain actions you dont always give reply directly. Reply has to come from the right person, the right way. And you enable that person to take the right action.

Note the point Ram tells to the child ( I really was trying when that boy came and told Ram dont go). He tells with my father and younger brother nothing will happen to you.

What is hidden is the knowledge in Ram that answer to kaikeyi has to be given by the person who was born in her womb. Not Ram. If Ram gives answer to her, he is giving weapon directly in the hands of person like Manthara who can manipulate his brother. Ram's trump card was his knowledge of Bharath. That trust in his brother worked two ways. One if his brother takes the throne he is capable of running the kingdom. He has the same values of raghukul and will run the kingdom based on those values. Society wont suffer. Praja wont suffer.

And there was much larger trust on his brother. That in all probability he will not take power. Since he has obeyed the dharma, his brother will question the adharma. That's Ram's hidden knowledge. The trust in Bharath. What Ram actually does through vachan palan is delivering the supreme trust his younger brother kept on him. That his brother will always follow the path of righteous devoid of circumstances. Wealth and power cannot tempt him from straying from the path of dharma.

And seeing the path of dharma taken by his brother, Bharath reacts, he runs through the adharmis of Ayodhya shunning power and managing the kingdom as a caretaker king, living the life of a ascetic just like his brother.

Ram beats adharma with his vachan palan, which people will be able to see only when Bharath comes.

Now look at Bhishma. He is the crown prince. And for his father's lust he takes the pledge that he will not become king, he will not marry and have kids. Does this man has any clue what kind of kids Satyavati will have. Will they be capable of ruling the kingdom. And hastinapur gets incompetent kings one after another. Society is suffering, but for this man his pledge was important. Anybody could manipulate him with that pledge, with that vachan palan. And Shakuni does it with elan. Look what all this man does in the name of being a sevak to Hastinapur throne. Takes 3 ladies from swayamvar. Instead of getting married when the kingdom had no heir, make 2 women go through niyog without their proper consent. Shows the might of hastinapur and gets a bride for his brother's son who is blind.

Doesnt stand upto the blind king who is actually a care taker king and denies the right to the correct owners of the kingdom. Splits the kingdom. Watches a woman getting disrobed publicly in a sabha. All in the name of vachan palan.

Yes vachan has to be kept. But when vachan is being kept understand the intend of your actions. Will the family benefit in long run, will the society benefit in long run. What is the basis of your decision. Is it to satisfy your ego, or is it real selflessness of letting go. In the former not only you the entire society suffers. Because in your ego to show your greatness you are forgetting duty.

What Ram did was selfless duty and what Bhishma did was satisfying his ego. And most people take the moral high ground to satisfy their ego than to do selfless duty. Then how can you get greatness. Understand the intend of Ram's action, not the action in itself. Truth is not just vision, truth is much beyond vision. If you are able to see what other's cannot see with naked eyes, you are closer to truth. You are a visionary as you are able to see change.

BTW I really enjoyed your 5 senses theory on symbolism thread...and of course Shanta as the sixth sense...😊

Coming back,I love Rishi jabali.It's because of him ram gets answer's and we,in turn benefit from that.

You are so right,we should question each and every motive of ours,specially if it affects others.

Another question,please dont hate me for that...but who is Bhishma??Can you elaborate more about his role.I dont know much about Mahabharata.

Such an apt understanding of Ram's situation and Bheeshma's ego

This is why Ram is Lord

Even to this day, anyone , any person who does a selfless axt for us is like a god...or god messenger

I did say n i retreat it again...The calmness, the Devotion, the selfless love for siblings, the strongest will power concidering others happiness before his own is just what makes Ram the most idolize lord...

It is so tought to follow the path which lord has shown, but with strong will power and good will and selflessness one can follow The path of lord

Bhishma was egoistic, and in his ego he was responsible for MAHABHARAT

@supriya thanks dear for liking the senses theory. Yes you need to know whether your foot is on the ground, it is not just the eye on the sky. And one more thing. I want to highlight. Bhishma was a man alive because his father Shantanu broke the vachan he gave to Ganga that he will not question her actions. Ganga throws seven of their babies in water and kill them. When Ganga was doing it for the 8th child Shantanu couldnt hold on and she questioned her. Ganga disappears with the baby and after giving education to him, gives the child back to Shantanu when he becomes an young man. A man who is alive because of a broken vachan couldnt raise his voice even when kulvadhu of his family was dragged to court. See the irony. That's why it is said never forget the path you came, however high you go

@bheegi thanks dear. You know MB so I guess you will be able to relate it better

@ankita if I try to explain on Bhishma this page wont be enough. Read this wikipedia link to get a basic understanding.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhishma. Then you asked how much I understand so much. When all of your life you have been questioning Ram, asking why he is maryada purushottam when all his actions are used by the society to subjudicate women, one way or the other Lord himself has to answer to me. Why Ram is Maryada purushottam and the one's who pretend to be Ram's are not. What was the intend of his actions. If knowledge has to come to you there is only one way. Bow down before Maa Saraswati without any expectations. Walk the path with humility, she will open the doors one after another for a better life.

@cool_wonder to follow his path we have to understand his intend. That's why I always say stand in Arjun's position, take knowledge from Krishna as a first step. Because the most easiest thing for a human of Kaliyug to do is being in Arjun's position( that itself is tough in a way, but that is the most nearest possible to take the path of knowledge)

I thought as much when the Ram-Jabali samvad was happening.

At every turn, Ram's words give me a thought to ponder on. Everything he says is a way for us to live, the ideal way. Krishna gives us His advice showing us how a bad society must be destroyed, and Dharma must always be chosen, and of course, the Gita. They both teach us how to live; it depends on how we understand it.

Ram-Bhishma comparison 👏👏 You are right again. When you follow Dharma, you must put your foot forward, and work towards Dharma. But what could Bhishma have done against his vow? 😕

Maybe Shakuni and co would have disgraced him. Krishna is also cursed by Gandhari. But today look Krishna lives in the heart of all right thinking people. What about Bhishma. When you fear disgrace from evil, you are supporting evil.

That is why make dharma your inner strength not the vachan/ maryada...