Originally posted by: adianasr
You knw Shyamala, one of the best castings ever was done for Severus Snape being played by Alan Rickman!!! He just made Snape 'ALIVE'!!!
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Originally posted by: adianasr
You knw Shyamala, one of the best castings ever was done for Severus Snape being played by Alan Rickman!!! He just made Snape 'ALIVE'!!!
Originally posted by: Mallika-E-Bhais
COMPLETELY!!! He is a very, very talented actor!!! 😳And did you know? He was the ONLY one (after Rowling of course!) to know the entire story & character progression of Snape?He knew since the beginning about Snape being absolutely in love with Lily & therefore played Snape that way. Even a flick of his hair & hand, meant SO much & just brought the SCREEN ALIVE!!!⭐️These British actors are exceptionally talented!!! 👏Apparently his child threatened him with running away, if he did not agree to play the character!! 🤣
Dear Shyamala Aunty,
My name is Divya and I have been following your posts and the forum for a while but have been able to participate only now as I am on leave from a very time consuming job. My timing couldn't have been worse given the current track. However, I have always loved your posts for their depth and your perspective, especially how a sixteenth century king should be portrayed and treated.Your defense of Jalal's actions is very accurate as a sixteenth century shehenshah- he should not put up with a rude wife, can be with and marry whomever he likes, etc. My concern is that it doesn't gel with the image of Jalal that the CVs have built for this show and I think that is what bothers me.The characters of Jalal and Jodha have been tampered with to suit 21st century sensibilities from the beginning. Jalal is shown less ruthless and more patient than in reality, and Jodha more strong willed and independent to the extreme.This is why I was not at all pleased with Jalal's behavior over the past few days because the CVs have gone against whatever they built of his character over the past few months:- the CVs portrayed him as a king who promised his wife not to touch him ( I know they never showed that scene- maybe they forgot we saw that scene only in the movie and not the serial but given everyone has seen the movie it is now known as fact). As a character who keeps his promises, Jalal kept this promise. Now, how can he hold it against Jodha that she did not due any of her wifely duties. Either he makes the promise or does not. If he was a true sixteenth century king he would have never made the promise so how can he suddenly behave like a pure 16th century king today.- and this show's Jalal not only respects Jodha's wishes on this point but Salima as well in this show, agreed that Salima was willing to do whatever he wanted as a wife but that is besides the point- it is more Jalal's behavior In is manner, I don't think Jalal would ever say that Salima did not perform her wifely duties.- a 16th century king would force Jodha to change religions and not give up his throne but not the Jalal of this show because he is a man of his word and made a promise to retain her religion. I don't see this as him having a soft corner for Jodha.- the CVs have shown him as very smart and calculative and this is where I think I agree with the entire forum that the fact that he does not know Ben is a spy and how he was deceived by Ben yesterday as an insult to the intelligent Jalal the CVs created.I know that you are not a big fan of Jodha's character and to be honest there are times I was surprised by Jodha's coldness and rudeness- especially during Sukanya's wedding track especially when she should have been apologetic after the Mohan tiger attack. The only thing I would say is that would say that Jodha was always shown as independent and strong willed then a real sixteenth century even before her marriage. One scene that comes to mind was when she stopped her father from killing Abdul - her dad asked her to go back and she refused. The CVs always wanted to show her that way because the typical tv viewer wants the heroine to embody what she dreams to be - standing up for herself, independent, victorious. That is the state of Indian TV for better or worse.If I looked at it from a sixteenth century sense, I would absolutely agree that Jalal is in the right and Jodha in the wrong. However, based on the show, this Jalal is not the one I have grown to like and respect and has gone completely against his character. And I have gotten used to this strong willed Jodha as well - though I am glad she has realized that there are some things that are more important than her swaabhimaan.I also do not want Jalal to become a puppy dog in love as this would also go against the character they built.So in conclusion, if my ramblings made any sense, I am mad that the CVs have gone against the characters they have built and concerned this trend will continue. The CVs were never true to the sixteenth century norms so I cannot be mad at them when they go against it nor justify their actions when they are in line with them- isn't that why they have a full 30 second disclaimer. I just want them to be consistent with themselves- is that too much to ask?Just wanted to share my thoughts as I realized why this track and Jalal's behavior was bothering me so much.Divya
Yes Aunty,Originally posted by: sashashyam
Sandhya dear, you know that I would agree with you on all the rest, so I need not say that.
This is about Severus Snape, who single-handedly redefined love and made even a hardboiled character like me weep at the end of The Prince's Tale. Even earlier, in fact, when the dying Snape looks at Lily's green eyes in Harry's face.
Now that is love. Remember the time when Dumbledore, after seeing that Snape's Patronus is also a silver doe,the same as Lily's, asks him After all these years, Severus? And he answers Always.
I do not know if you have read Dickens' A Tale of Two Cities. Sydney Carton there, who dies on the guillotine to save the husband of the girl he loves, is often rated as the epitome of selfless love. Snape does something much, much harder than dying for his love. He lives for it, as a double agent in the most spinechilling of conditions, year after year, hated and reviled by those who knew not what he was and what he was doing. No wonder Harry's second son, the one with the green eyes. is Albus Severus, in honour of "the bravest man I have ever known".
And no, the premises of the Harry Potter series were anything but bizarre. In fact it was a completely internally consistent alternate world, far better than those of Philip Pullman, for example.
Shyamala Aunty
Bobby my dear,
Well, Sandhya has answered your points below much better than I could, which she does all the time - she once demanded that I "bash Jalal" and then proceeded to do so herself with full vim and vigour! - so I will desist.
But I will offer a bit of advice, for whatever it is worth. Do not fret so much over this serial and the onscreen goings on, kid, and try and just go with the flow.
Thank you for your well meant advice Aunty. I will try to follow as much as possible. But you know how it works with us sentimental fools. Getting upset about a serial (that too Ekta kapoor's serial !!!). How pathetic. I am OK now Aunty. I realized not worth crying over this.
Both Jalal and Jodha are flawed characters, in my opinion she far more than he, for he is ready to learn from his mistakes, and to apologise publicly, as after the Laki Mahaam double track. She does not, nor does she ever introspect and wonder if she has been wrong, with only 2 exceptions that I can remember, and even those were swiftly buried and forgotten.
The problem is not that they are flawed, but that they are not flawed in an interesting and consistent manner, especially Jalal. Jodha has been pretty consistent till now: self-righteous, almost always disdainful of Jalal for SKLL and other real and imaginary sins, and full of bhashanbaazi.
Plus she appeared , till very recently, to be as implacably hostile to Jalal as she was in love with no one but herself and her Ameri heritage.The latter is not a bad thing per se, for it you do not love yourself, you cannot love another, but here it seemed to go to extremes, as did the hostility towards Jalal, which created a distorting lens thru which she regarded every generous move of his.
Jalal, on the other hand, oscillates wildly from one extreme to the other. The whole "make Jodha jealous" idea was, as I wrote then, puerile beyond belief. He proclaimed that he would take revenge for The Shove, and did nothing of the kind. Now he has retreated into barring himself behind a wall of standoffishness, but the old hurts about The Letter & The Shove, which form a seamless whole in his zehen, seep thru that wall at the first opportunity.
But even his stupid oscillations are those of tactics, not of the fundamentals. The one core fundamental for him has always been that inexplicable pull at the very sound of her name that drove him to that dangerous journey to Amer just to catch a glimpse of her, and once there, to burn his hand to pull her payal out of the fire. If you have the time, take a look at my first ever post in this forum,
Jalal is thus handicapped by that untamable obsession for this wife of his, which now makes him angry , as he sees it as a shameful weakness that will bring him, to borrow Mirza's unfortunate and ill-timed line, to his knees. This has backed him into a cold, unyielding aloofness, which masks his craving , NOT that she should let him make love to her, but that she should care for him and what happens to him. It has always been like that.
Jodha, on the other hand, is still kachchi in matters of the heart. It is only very recently that she has begun to even glimpse the restlessness, the craving for acceptance, the sense of abandonment when that is not forthcoming, the hurtful emotional dependence on another, and the gnawing pain that eats away at one's heart when one loses what one has had but not valued, and now it seems as though one cannot get it back.
She still does not understand love, much less accept it, while he resents it and hides it
In this last week, as Jodha's sense of loss and of exclusion have been intensified, and her fears for Jalal's life have mounted and are now raging high within her, her feet, already bruised, are beginning to bleed, as his have been for quite a while now. This is the real meaning of that line of mine that frightened you.
The best thing that Jodha can now do, once she has somehow personally managed to save Jalal from the vishkanya, would be this. She should run straight to him, embrace him tightly, and weep all over him, babbling incoherently You are safe, Shahenshah, you are safe, you are safe, you are safe!!!!
With that one move of hers, all the walls between them will come down in one go, their feet will be miraculously healed, and their hearts made whole again. There will be no need for apologies or casting of accounts between them, The Letter and The Shove will be consigned to the dustbin, and we will have a real love story at long last, if not the epic one we were promised.
This, however, is what I want. Not what is most likely to happen. Which is what you had initially suggested. Another round of aloof chilliness, this time from Jodha, to hosannas from Hamida and her gang, while Jalal abases him himself even worse. I am quite prepared for that, though it is going to make me feel distinctly queasy.
I too do not want Jodha to be cold. That initial statement was made in fit of anger. I am not sure whether she will do as you told. If she does that, that will be a miracle. I agree that if she does that everything else will be forgotten and the real love story will start. But even after that I don't know how much roller-coaster ride we are going to have (Ekta kapoor's serial it is, why do we forget always ??? )
Also I do not want Jalal to be on his knees. Never wanted that and I don't think that will happen. As somebody else suggested, he probably might go on his knees in front of God for praying for Jodha's life (if she gets kissed by Ben instead of Jalal )
As for you, my dear, my advice at the beginning is worth thinking about. It is good advice , if I say so myself.
Shyamala Aunty
Originally posted by: Sandhya.A
Yes Aunty,
I have read The Tale of Two Cities. Carton's swapping places with Darnay in the prison and his conversation with the girl while he waits in line for the guillotine was chilling and overwhelming.But they say, it is great to die for one's country and greater to live and work for its progress. On these lines Snape's love surpasses Carton's. How hard it must have been for him to see Lily whom he loves so deeply and James whom he has always hated, both of them in Harry. He was prepared to take the biggest risks, dangle in the arms of death, all for the sake of his lost love while inviting the wrath and hatred of all till he died for the sake of love! Ultimately Snape beat even Harry as the ultimate hero of book 7.Snape's crying with the torn letter in the book and with dead Lily in his arm in the movie was really heart-rending.THIS IS EPIC LOVE.You must have read 'Sivakamiyin Sabatham'. That too is a beautiful love story and King Narasimha Pallavan one of the most lovable almost-perfect characters in fiction. How well history, fiction and romance has been blended in the novel, keeping the key-characters of history intact, presenting them as great as they really were, the fiction part only adding beauty to them. In comparison our JA is making mincemeat of poor Akbar.😭. What began equally promisingly is now in tatters.PS: I agree with you that the premises of the Harry Potter series were anything but bizarre and that it was a completely internally consistent alternate world. Yes it was. A world so well etched out as to leave no doubts of its credibility.
Originally posted by: TheIronLady
@bold, Sandhya, beautifully written and very true also.😳Severus Snape is one of my favourite characters. He always had this unconditional love for Lily.
Originally posted by: loveanime
Now back to today episode I liked Jalal scene the best. The way Moti dialogues transitioned to his face and you can clearly see pain flash across his eyes, it was subtle yet powerful. I found it kind of strange that Moti being a daasi noticed he is miserable but Jodha his wife hasn't been as preceptive. I did like that cut to Jodha and Jalal pre marriage promise, for Jalal it must have been like giving the moon to her and he must have felt he check mated her and has won her now. I think he has always been in love with her but his love at the initial stages was more like a rough cut diamond, but now more a polished one. His thinking back to that moment shows how hurt he is at that fact that no matter what he does he can't win her. Why does the forum and Jodha keep obsessing over the fact that when he talks about jeethna he means her body but it is her heart and soul?Another thing I am confused about why all this uproar, is Jalal in the show never expected to marry again. What are the writers trying to show in regards to Jalal, is the audience angry because we feel he is betraying Jodha, or we just disturbed he is taking decisions to irk Jodha not thinking straight? But I feel he cares nothing of this marriage really he is only hung up on what he feels for Jodha marriage to Benazir is only a side show and will not undo anything in regards to Jodha. Benazir can join his harem but Jodha will remain Khaas if Jalal wants to and his love for her won't change just because he has another wife. This is where MA and Ruq are miscalculating bringing Benazir in the fold with not remove Jodha from the picture not if Jalal doesn't want to. I always expected Jalal in the show to marry again so I don't really care he is marrying again, but marrying a daasi that is ridiculous.I am pissed off he has come off stupid in this whole affair, but can't help but feeling for the poor guy at his state. He has so much unacknowledged feelings for Jodha bursting to come out, pain of rejection, fear of his love never being reciprocated must be haunting him. Small mercies by the writers that they have turned this impending marriage track to show Jalal turmoil that he is not thinking clearly because his own feelings are all tied up in knots and to top that he is afraid that even if he wants to face them Jodha won't be there for him so he is even more reluctant. He is already tried that remember he faced his feelings, he went to Jodha and he got such a rude shock that broke his heart. He is scared to do down that path again, why should he and he is perfectly justified in wanting to do anything in his power to not suffer that pain again.
I supposed that is realistic in whatever century you live in, to love and to have lost is a natural emotion and the pain would be the same whether you are a farmer or an emperor, and love makes us all do dumb things. Obviously emperor should be made of tougher mettle but our onscreen Jalal is far more emotional he is tough in other aspects but he seems just as fragile in the matters of his non existent heart.
The few moments of Jalal with Atgha Khan Lashy described so beautifully in the post of hers, he knows this is a dumb move on his part, but he is unable to steer the ship in another course regardless, it is like you are watching an accident happen right in front of your eyes but you are powerless to stop it. Portraying Jalal so vulnerable so human would have been touching to watch if it just wasn't mingled with his stupidity.
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