Arvi track going hum dil de chuke hai sanam style - Page 3

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sashashyam thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#21
Dear Sharad,

It seems that I did not make myself clear, so let me try again.

I am perfectly ok with Arjun and Purvi getting together again because they want to be with each other for the rest of their lives. So we are on the same page on this.

What I was talking about was something that has been touted ad infinitum in the forum: The Great Biological Parents Maxim. This holds that Arjun and Purvi should get together not so much for their love, but because Pari needs to have both her biological parents with her for her to have a healthy upbringing. We need not here go into the general principle, and what happens if, say, the father is a criminal or an alcoholic, and let us take it as a given for this case of Pari.

This maxim, if accepted, would naturally have to apply to all children, since every child should have the right to a healthy upbringing. Thus it would apply to any future Arjun-Ovi child as well. So that child would also need to have both his/her parents with him/her. And so we run into a brick wall.

The solution, of course, is to state, as you have done, that any Arjun-Purvi reunion should be only because they both want it. Not because of Pari or any biological parents argument. Here too we are on the same page.

And because I am dealing only with this one point, the issues of darja, which kid is older, or of Rama, Lakshmana etc. are naturally not relevant to my argument. I am not concerned here with legitimacy or the lack of it. All kids are in any case, legitimate.

Shyamala B.Cowsik

Originally posted by: sharadrocks


Sorry Ma'am but I believe Ram and all the other mythological characters have everything to do with this. So much has been spoken on this forum about the Indian way of life and morality and hence my comment! If people are preaching the Indian way of life, then let us go the whole hog. Going by that, Arjun had already had a gandharva vivah of sorts with Purvi. So, Arjun and Purvi are both bigamists but still they have first claim over each other. Let us go with any one code! Or let us say to hell with social convention and ask people to follow their hearts.

For all my sins, I belong to the latter category! Convention be damned is my philosophy in life. Am sure this will delight all those forumites who believe that compassion is reserved only for those people whose actions you would emulate!

If you ask me, this is not about Pari or any Arjun-Ovi baby that may decide to pop up in the future. Arjun and Purvi are the ones who need to decide what they want! And if they decide that it is each other that they want, no society can hold a gun to their heads and tell them what to do! By the same logic, if they decide they do not want to be with each other, Pari can never be the glue that will keep them stuck together.




Originally posted by: sashashyam

The point here is not really of any darja. Nor of who is to inherit the Kirloskar millions, so Ram and Lakshman and Bharat do not come into it. Though, as a matter of fact, both kids would be able to claim an equal share, if it came to that. There is no right of primogeniture in the Indian laws governing inheritance.

The point is only this. If it is argued that Pari should be with both her biological parents for her to have a healthy upbringing, surely the same would also apply to the second Arjun-Ovi kid. The biological parents maxim cannot be limited to the oldest child.

So he/she should also have both biological parents to raise him/her.

How can this be done for both this kid and for Pari? It cannot.

The real problem of course is Arjun's propensity to produce kids in what can only be called a casual fashion.

Shyamala B.Cowsik






Edited by sashashyam - 12 years ago
Not_a_fan thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#22

Originally posted by: sharadrocks




Sorry Ma'am but I believe Ram and all the other mythological characters have everything to do with this. So much has been spoken on this forum about the Indian way of life and morality and hence my comment! If people are preaching the Indian way of life, then let us go the whole hog. Going by that, Arjun had already had a gandharva vivah of sorts with Purvi. So, Arjun and Purvi are both bigamists but still they have first claim over each other. Let us go with any one code! Or let us say to hell with social convention and ask people to follow their hearts.

For all my sins, I belong to the latter category! Convention be damned is my philosophy in life. Am sure this will delight all those forumites who believe that compassion is reserved only for those people whose actions you would emulate!

If you ask me, this is not about Pari or any Arjun-Ovi baby that may decide to pop up in the future. Arjun and Purvi are the ones who need to decide what they want! And if they decide that it is each other that they want, no society can hold a gun to their heads and tell them what to do! By the same logic, if they decide they do not want to be with each other, Pari can never be the glue that will keep them stuck together.




Sorry to butt in here, but the underlined part---are they deciding what to do? Arjun and purvi? If they love each other, then they should leave their spouses and get married, whether or not onir or ovi is a saint or the devil. If they don't want to do that, they should truly try to move on and work on their marriages. But the two adults doing are not taking any decisions whatsoever, when nobody's putting a gun to their heads. What they're doing is hanging on to their marriages when they know very well they do not love their spouses, while finding the teensient excuse to be in constant contact with each other, since they cannot control their emotions or feelings, I'm told.

Why in effing hell should onir or ovi move out of the way for arjun and purvi to decide to be together if they want to? Why the heck can't they decide for themselves? Before all this nonsensical charade, onir was the epitome of an understanding, trusting and loving partner. When did purvi truly try to work on her marriage with him? If she can't coz she doesn't love him and cannot love him, why is she not leaving him so they can both move on with their lives? Same goes for arjun and ovi. Its very very annoying to hear all the time that ovi came in between, onir came in and separated the lovers. If somebody came in between, remove them out of the way and get together if that's what you effing want! This constant and continuous vacillating between spouse and (ex)lover is disgusting and annoying. I despise arjun and purvi, but honestly if they can just make a decision and stick to it, I would respect them at least a little.
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Posted: 12 years ago
#23

Originally posted by: sashashyam

Dear Sharad,

It seems that I did not make myself clear, so let me try again.

I am perfectly ok with Arjun and Purvi getting together again because they want to be with each other for the rest of their lives. So we are on the same page on this.

What I was talking about was something that has been touted ad infinitum in the forum: The Great Biological Parents Maxim. This holds that Arjun and Purvi should get together not so much for their love, but because Pari needs to have both her biological parents with her for her to have a healthy upbringing. We need not here go into the general principle, and what happens if, say, the father is a criminal or an alcoholic, and let us take it as a given for this case of Pari.

This maxim, if accepted, would naturally have to apply to all children, since every child should have the right to a healthy upbringing. Thus it would apply to any future Arjun-Ovi child as well. So that child would also need to have both his/her parents with him/her. And so we run into a brick wall.

The solution, of course, is to state, as you have done, that any Arjun-Purvi reunion should be only because they both want it. Not because of Pari or any biological parents argument. Here too we are on the same page.

And because I was dealing only with this one point, the issues of darja, which kid is older, or of Rama, Lakshmana etc. are naturally not relevant to my argument. I am not concerned here with legitimacy or lack of it. All kids are in any case, legitimate.

Shyamala B.Cowsik









I perfectly understand where you are coming from, Mam! I have no quarrel with it! But since this forum is so obsessed with the Indian way of life and morality, my point simply was that, by that logic, the oldest child has greater rights as opposed to the others.Hence the Sri Ram logic. Even in modern day india, Mukesh Ambani has pretty much inherited his father's mantle

Of course, if the Arjun-Ovi baby turned out to be male, poor Pari might have to make way! Because our Indian code of conduct is after all so loaded in favour of the male! Anyway, i truly appreciate your stance that a child is a child irrespective of the marital status of its parents. It comes as a breath of fresh air in a space where the word 'najayaz' is flung so carelessly at Pari at every opportunity. A child is a life. How can it be illegitimate? At a time when we are looking to change laws, it is sad that people still entertain such archaic notions!
Edited by sharadrocks - 12 years ago
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Posted: 12 years ago
#24

Originally posted by: sowmya_jairam



Sorry to butt in here, but the underlined part---are they deciding what to do? Arjun and purvi? If they love each other, then they should leave their spouses and get married, whether or not onir or ovi is a saint or the devil. If they don't want to do that, they should truly try to move on and work on their marriages. But the two adults doing are not taking any decisions whatsoever, when nobody's putting a gun to their heads. What they're doing is hanging on to their marriages when they know very well they do not love their spouses, while finding the teensient excuse to be in constant contact with each other, since they cannot control their emotions or feelings, I'm told.

Why in effing hell should onir or ovi move out of the way for arjun and purvi to decide to be together if they want to? Why the heck can't they decide for themselves? Before all this nonsensical charade, onir was the epitome of an understanding, trusting and loving partner. When did purvi truly try to work on her marriage with him? If she can't coz she doesn't love him and cannot love him, why is she not leaving him so they can both move on with their lives? Same goes for arjun and ovi. Its very very annoying to hear all the time that ovi came in between, onir came in and separated the lovers. If somebody came in between, remove them out of the way and get together if that's what you effing want! This constant and continuous vacillating between spouse and (ex)lover is disgusting and annoying. I despise arjun and purvi, but honestly if they can just make a decision and stick to it, I would respect them at least a little.




Excuse me but I don't think a discussion on Onir or Ovi is relevant to the point I made. This is about whether Purvi and Arjun have a right to be together or should be together, Pari or no Pari. My point was that they and they alone had the right to make that decision.

I respect your right to despise Arjun and Purvi. I personally don't waste such intense emotions on fictional characters!
Edited by sharadrocks - 12 years ago
Not_a_fan thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#25

Originally posted by: sharadrocks




Excuse me but I don't think a discussion on Onir or Ovi is relevant to the point I made. This is about whether Purvi and Arjun have a right to be together or should be together, Pari or no Pari. My point was that they and they alone had the right to make that decision.

I respect your right to despise Arjun and Purvi. I personally don't waste such intense emotions on fictional characters!



Discussion on onir or ovi might not be relevant, but the rest of the post is. You made a point that arjun and purvi have the right to decide about their lives, and I asked you if arjun and purvi were anywhere close to making that decision? Thank you for respecting my right, I appreciate it! 😃
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Posted: 12 years ago
#26
@sowmya_jairam

I would honestly not want to speculate on where they stand currently. Since the scriptwriters have a penchant for taking dizzying curves, I would prefer to leave it to them to throw light on that. However, if that train sequence is any indication, they certainly are closer to each other than to their respective partners. Of course, that is not a constant 😆
Dabulls23 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#27

Originally posted by: sharadrocks



I thought submitting to each other heart and soul is marriage...it is a form of Gandharva vivaah to the best of my knowledge...this kind of marriage certainly does not need walking around the fire...which fire did Dushyant and Shakuntala walk around if I may ask? A recent judgment pronounced by the Madras High Court may interest you. When two people come together in love and commitment without the benefit of a legal or a social marriage, the relationship can still be said to have the sanctity of a marriage and the child born out of such a marriage has a legal status 😆

As for your comments on the characters, they are entirely yours to have. I respect that completely!

Lord have mercy to the definition and the logic given for Gandharva vivah and legitimacy to the child out of wedlock=najaayaz 😆 I give up...My intellect cant take it no more...
If we start going by the definition of GV than we will be seeing many many marriages in a day each time 2 think they love each other from mind, body & soul..LOL
Though I dont need your approval abt posting my views or respecting them, Thank you Embarrassed
Edited by Dabulls23 - 12 years ago
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Posted: 12 years ago
#28

Originally posted by: Dabulls23

Lord have mercy to the definition and the logic given for Gandharva vivah and legitimacy to the child out of wedlock=najaayaz 😆 I give up...My intellect cant take it no more...
If we start going by the definition of GV than we will be seeing many many marriages in a day each time 2 think they love each other...LOL
Though I dont need your approval abt posting my views or respecting them, Thank you 😳



Ma'am...I offered you no explanations...you raised the point with your definition of it.. I had to necessarily share my thoughts with you...pity that my pea brain is not able to come up with something that tickles your intellect...apologies 😆

Anyway, I do not offer gandarva vivah as excuse or justification..I don't believe in either...I do exactly what I believe to be right, society notwithstanding... thought this forum that is ao obsessed with morality and Indian code of conduct should be willing to accept something that is spoken of in their books of wisdom!
Going by the way this forum defines EMA, I think EMA is the norm rather than the exception 😆

Of course neither of us needs each other's approval...thank the Lord for that!



Edited by sharadrocks - 12 years ago
Dabulls23 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#29
We all mortals know EMA, emotional, physical affairs do exist and happens...The problem is when not admittting and claiming it is for someone else's bhalai...Admit them and take responsibility for it..No one likes to be moral police or hold indian code of conduct on this stupid forum but we are hear to discuss the show...So what we see we write abt..Nothing more or less..
Just because it may be OK by some it does not mean its OK by rest...
Bringing up mythological stories means didly when it comes to fictional shows...😳 Let the lord rama, krishna, shiva, king dushyant etc alone and let them rest in peace..😃 They dont deserve to be involved in EK and CVs chirned out stupidity 😳
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Posted: 12 years ago
#30

Originally posted by: Dabulls23

We all mortals know EMA, emotional, physical affairs do exist and happens...The problem is when not admittting and claiming it is for someone else's bhalai...Admit them and take responsibility for it..No one likes to be moral police or hold indian code of conduct on this stupid forum but we are hear to discuss the show...So what we see we write abt..Nothing more or less..

Just because it may be OK by some it does not mean its OK by rest...
Bringing up mythological stories means didly when it comes to fictional shows...😳 Let the lord rama, krishna, shiva, king dushyant etc alone and let them rest in peace..😃 They dont deserve to be involved in EK and CVs chirned out stupidity 😳


I am great friends with Rama, Krishna,, Dushyant and their ilk 😊...they don't take offence so easily to what I say ...not to worry on that count...and did not Indian morality and culture derive from these great epics...of course, if we started delving deep, we would find most of our notions shattered...

Of course morality is subjective...but shoving one"s personal code of conduct down another's throat is just a tad disconcerting...and making sweeping judgments about people here on the basis of characters they support...that is definitely disturbing...please do not take this personally...but I have seen several posts in this vein...like Christ said...let the one who has never sinned throw the first stone...I can't speak for others...but I certainly don't qualify!
Edited by sharadrocks - 12 years ago

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