Purvi's izzat or middle class tomfoolery? - Page 3

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Posted: 13 years ago
#21
Dear Janhvi,

I was in two minds whether to respond to your (as usual) beautifully argued and written piece, or not. Maybe it would have been better not, but in any case here I am.

I think this sort of Arjun-bashing is rather a waste of your remarkable facility with both ideas and language. It is too easy, for Arjun offers such a tempting target ' at first for being a richie rich young man, so arrogant and overbearing and, now that he has been reformed by love, for being persistent to excess, and prone to blunders whenever he gets the chance.

It does not matter that he is honourable to a fault, far more gentle and far more caring in love than one would ever expect any young man, of his background or otherwise, to be. It does not matter that his love is both unselfish and undemanding, and that he is prepared to quit and retreat, whatever the emotional toll on him, just so that Purvi can live in peace. It does not matter that having blundered at the engagement function, at the first opportunity he gets, he tells the truth to his formidable and intimidating father with no varnish on it, bluntly and categorically. He leaves no option for DK but to agree to what he wants, and he manages to do it without alienating his father as well. None of this matters when one wants to put Arjun in the pillory, and I must say that you have done it exceedingly well. I loved it from the aesthetic point of view, but not from the heart.

One could, and I am sure you can do it effortlessly, do the same kind of hatchet job on Purvi. I like her a lot, as she is a rare specimen in the world of TV soaps, a bright, ruthlessly capable and committed woman professional (the 'ruthless' streak was in evidence when she exposed Punni's boss), and I greatly admire her simplicity and her straightforwardness.

But I have never been blind to her faults, and a lack of compassion is one of them. I was so angry with the way in which she treated Arjun after he spends the night in front of her house that I wrote "What she displays is a total lack of concern for the feelings of a person who has, once he changed his ways, always shown her special consideration. She carries on as though she was the Queen of Sheba getting rid of an importunate suitor, whereas the fact is that she is only a stupidly obstinate, emotionally stunted, lower middle class girl, and normally the likes of Arjun Kirloskar would never come pleading to her door. If I was Arjun I would have told her to get lost and pushed off. Her good luck is that Arjun is so obsessed with her that he does not give up even in the face of such rudeness".


The interesting thing was that quite a number of people then jumped to Purvi's defence and were quite vocal in the process. I do not now see a single person speaking up for Arjun in response to your latest (and I must say very plausible) broadside. They all agree with you. It only goes to show that the majority of the forum are Purvi-philes to a remarkable degree, and if they like Arjun, it is not for himself, but only because he loves Purvi so deeply.

I beg to differ. I like Arjun for himself, He is a very rich, capable and powerful young man who could easily have become an irresponsible wastrel, living on the fruits of his father's talent and hard work, and/or a Casanova with no respect for the women he exploits. He is quite the opposite in both respects. Even more striking is that he is prepared to change himself completely for the sake of his love, and to totally suppress his ego where she is concerned. All this is so refreshing that I am quite prepared to forgive him a lot, and to empathise with him as he suffers - and no one can dispute how much he suffers - for his various acts of omission and commission.

My heart went out to the poor boy when he stood at Purvi's door that evening trying to explain the famous 'kiss', and was shooed away like a pariah by Sulochana ( if Archana had been present, things would have been quite different). lf they had let him sort things out with Purvi that evening, or if Purvi had not driven him to desperation by rejecting all his calls, there would have been no need for him to turn up on a rainy night and do all of the undesirable things you have cited so correctly.

I did not, as you would remember, approve of what Arjun did at the engagement party, but you can make a case for it nonetheless. Moreover, once her initial (and entirely justified) rage had cooled down, any girl with perception and good sense would, since she had seen how he looked throughout the ceremony, have realised that something had gone horrbily wrong, and that what happened was not intentional on Arjun's part. The next logical step would be to accept his call and see what he had to say, and also how best to proceed from there. She of course does none of this, and instead sheds endless tears like the typical soap heroine.

After his major blunder at the engagement function, the main point in Arjun's favour is that he tries hard to recover lost ground, even if he is not quite there yet. In the end, he suffers more than Purvi, as he has to cope with Ovi as well whereas Purvi at least has no importunate suitor round her neck, and can cry her heart out in peace.

I have already written about why I think it was a good thing he was NOT able to bring Ovi up to date in his office yesterday, so I shall not repeat myself here. But it is evident that it is unhappiness, tension and acute restlessness, made worse by Purvi's determined refusal to let him talk to her, that makes him disregard his father's express injunction and try to tell all to Ovi in his office.

In any case, even if he had told Ovi in advance and thus headed off the 'surprise' party, the end result as far as Purvi is concerned would have been the same, tyaag and all. This is because Ovi, on getting that clarification call from Arjun, would have caught the first flight to India and would have generally raised hell. By the time the dust settled, Purvi would have realised that this was her aayi's real daughter, and then it would be but one step to the grand sacrifice.

It would have been exactly the same if he had told Purvi in advance, for she would have insisted on knowing who the girl in Canada was. Nothing could have saved poor Arjun!

I apologise for repeating myself, but it is worth noting that Arjun is now like a very tightly stretched wire, and he is going to crack up very soon under the intolerable strain. He is prone to this sort of thing, and when he really flips, he will throw all caution and propriety to the winds. So Purvi would be well advised to let him talk to her and thus head off this explosion.

As for Purvi, it will again bear repeating that she has to rise above the overpowering misery that weighs her down now, and realize that running away from or cold-shouldering Arjun is not going to help either of them. She can see how acutely miserable he is as well, and if she really loves him (and I have my doubts about how much she loves him), she would feel his suffering as acutely as her own. She would want to get him out of this slough of despond no matter how she herself feels. She has to let him talk to her at some point, and this is better done outside the office, both for privacy and for both to be able to talk their hearts out instead of having to suppress their emotions and preserve a stoic front for public consumption.

As I have said often earlier, in every relationship, there is one who loves and one who is loved. In this one, it is Purvi who is loved.

This said, one has also to remember that she is new to the ways of love (but then so is Arjun!), and is perhaps not a romantic at heart , like Arjun has proved to be in his new avatar. She has a mental straight jacket of family - with her aai-baba in front - work, responsibilities, etc. in which she is most comfortable. When she ran to the airport and cried bitterly, she was being dragged out of her comfort zone by a new and unsettling force. She was at her best in her confession scene and those that followed, but she is not of the melting in love kind at all. The realist in her - fears of what people would say, etc. - will always win out, not to speak of the penchant for Great Renunciations.

One can be quite sure that if Arjun were ever to ask her to elope with him and get married in a mandir, her refusal would be instantaneous. She is no Juliet, our dear Purvi, but we love her nonetheless! But she has to get cracking, and it is not contracts with Sehgal & Sons that will solve her (and Arjun's ) problems.

None of the above is meant to detract in any from the praise due to your post for the language, the lucidity and the cohesiveness. But then, one expects all this of you!

Shyamala
PS: I noted, with dismay, that my response is twice as long as your post. But then, being a student of literature, you must be familiar with dissertations on, say, Pride and Prejudice, that are twice as long as the book, and I am sure you will excuse me!

/QUOTE]

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Dear Shyamala,
Loved reading your response, your reference to Pride & Prejudice, my most favorite book in the world just made your response that much more special (just as your reference on another post to that greatest of Romantics and the most blighted of lovers, Keats and his La Belle Dame Sans Merci). Ah, but you write with a double edged sword, you praise but detract 😊.
I readily admit I am a Purvi-phile. Yes, the girl is severely inhibited but her upbringing has a lot to contribute to that. Yes, she is more constrained, restrained in her expressions or rather exhibition of love than Arjun but that in no way makes her love less deep than her gallant's! 😆 She would abhor the idea of a run away wedding, which girl wouldn't? She probably has dreamed of a happy family occasion with her mother gladly giving her away, her aaji blessing her, all the mohallawallas giving their nods of approval, and that is the way it should be.
Purvi's summary dismissal of Arjun that night in the rains was perhaps not that of a girl swooning with love but quite characteristic of her no-nonsense approach to life. She is a survivor, she survived Arjun's onslaught at the office, he was mean, he was rude, he challenged her, she stood her own and proved her worth as an employee and to boot made the man fall desperately, head over heels in love with her. Nemesis? No small feat for a middle class girl who has had to come up the hard way, She has to look out for herself, no one else will otherwise. So, yes, when he makes a scene outside her house, her practical mind is asking, "does he mean it?" and then "what will the neighbors and more importantly aaji and aai think of the hullaballo this guy is creating?" Okay, she needs a little time to digest and come to terms but then so did her knight in chinked armor take a little time and some drink to comprehend his unsettled condition😃
The way to hell is paved with good intentions and while I too love Arjun dearly, not only because he loves Purvi but more so because he is, for all his self-possession, a bumbling idiot when it comes to her. No doubt his intentions are honorable, heaven forbid we think otherwise, he means well BUT unfortunately for him and for everyone around (Purvi, Vinay, DK, Ovi, Manav and all else in the family) his sense flies out of the window, when he is around Miss. Purvi. He flounders, he frets, he charges like a bull, he is like a madman and lover rolled into one. He is a little child that is attracted to the flame. He has absolutely no intention of dousing the flame or hurting himself, no intention but proceeds to do so anyway. That is his failing and he needs to be chided just like a child is chided not to wade into waters deep as he is just now learning to swim.
As for the great qualities of Arjun that you have cited😊, I agree he is rich, powerful, capable, romantic, all that and more. But he has been levelled, all those qualities do not matter anymore. "And love is love, in beggars as in kings" (Edward Dyer). Purvi and Arjun are just two individuals on the same plane now. Purvi will lend him her ear, all in due time. She cannot be rushed for the sole reason that he is desperate and desolate, and is impatient. She needs some time to adjust and come to terms with what appears to her as duplicity. She is a reasonable girl, logical, analytical (except when it comes to her aai and baba) so she will figure it out that Arjun does love her. Realizing that, however, is not going to make her fall into his arms. To revert back to what I wrote in my original post, he is a little naive if he thinks all can be set right in the twinkling of an eye because he had/has good intentions, intentions not to hurt Ovi, not to hurt his dad, and of course, never in his wildest dreams to hurt his Purvi. Circumstances beyond his control played against him, poor lad (we acknowledge that) but that does not make him less dense in expecting everything will be hunky dory in a jiffy. Life is not that fair even to rich, capable, charming, very much in love Canadian dudes! 😆
Edited by soapwatcher1 - 13 years ago
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Posted: 13 years ago
#22

Originally posted by: archverma10

Shyamala I saw your response to my heartfelt plea as u suggested and visited the posts u mentioned to read your analysis. Excellent excellent post!!! 👏 There certainly is a lot of Arjun bashing going on and I do remember feeling incredible anger at the meanness and audacity of Purvi during his confession time and the MMS fiasco. Although I defended her because of her background I remember posting that the episode when she was so rude and mean to me made me hard pressed to watch and made things difficult for me to justify. I also expressed hope that the CVs would quit making her so mean because I was afraid that by the time they finally came together we would wind up hating her- she was so cold at the time.


Jhanvi dearest... I do understand where Purvi is coming from...she, with her background and upbringing, somehow summoned up the courage and fortitude to overlook the societal norms, swallow her pride, go to the airport, and confess her love to Arjun. Only to experience the total shock and horror of learning that the man she loves and took such a big step out of her world for had promised to marry someone else the entire time.

However, I have to agree with Shyamala. It is obvious...even to Purvi...that Arjun loves her so much. With a completeness, whole ness, and intensity that makes Purvi a very lucky girl indeed. To be loved like that is a rare and amazing thing. That he does love her like that is something nobody can successfully dispute in this entire forum.

He looked into her eyes and told her she was his world...and that she was the one who changed him. Purvi talks about sacrifice?????????? This man was going to go back to Canada keeping the pain of rejection in his heart...but he was still so gentle and loving with her...he was willing to go just so she could be at peace...and be happy...with or without him. He loves her so much he is willing to endure anything for her: humiliation, rejection, pain, her constantly misunderstanding him and not giving him a chance to explain, embarrassment, etc.

He loves her with a love that is all-encompassing and total...with every part of his being. Even she doesn't realize the deptths and magnitude of it...but that is her cross. With her he is the happiest man alive. Without her he is miserable and hurting. He loved her enough to let her go when he thought that was what would make her happy. Now that's love. And that's the real meaning of sacrifice.

Dear Archana, you are completely correct, Arjun does love Purvi, no disputing that but love alone doesn't cut it some times, one has to deliver. I like Arjun, he is a Mills & Boon hero come to life but loving him cannot make us blind to his faults.😃
You write: It is obvious...even to Purvi...that Arjun loves her so much. With a completeness, whole ness, and intensity that makes Purvi a very lucky girl indeed. To be loved like that is a rare and amazing thing. My question is what is amazing about it? he has another girl's ring on his finger, the day he takes that off will be amazing.

You say : "He looked into her eyes and told her she was his world...and that she was the one who changed him." Talk is cheap, not that Arjun doesn't mean what he said but again he has to deliver on his promise. And I for one, am not waiting with bated breath.
You ask so impassionedly: "Purvi talks about sacrifice?????????? This man was going to go back to Canada keeping the pain of rejection in his heart...but he was still so gentle and loving with her...he was willing to go just so she could be at peace...and be happy...with or without him". Again, he didn't, did he? he did not even board the plane, he didn't leave for all his talk of leaving her alone in peace.
Don't get me wrong, I am glad he didn't leave just as I hope that he is not going to make good that promise he made her today that he will leave her alone if she meets him just this once and hears him out. The guy is in love, no doubt but what is she supposed to do? Take that thought to her grave and dance merrily as her sister weds him? Is she to think as she goes on living her middle class life, marrying the likes of another Vinay, "Oh I was so blessed to have been touched by real love?"

I agree with your, "Even she doesn't realize the depths and magnitude of it...but that is her cross" except for the last bit, he has made it her cross by donning that ring on his finger. The day he removes that, I will sing Arjun's praises till I am blue in the face, cross my heart! 😉
I hope he knows that, "With her he is the happiest man alive. Without her he is miserable and hurting". I am truly glad he loved her enough to NOT let her go when he thought that was what would make her happy. I hope he knows how to keep her close and keep her happy, for his sake as much as hers.
Edited by soapwatcher1 - 13 years ago
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Posted: 13 years ago
#23
Dear Janhvi,

Atta girl! I knew you would come back fighting, imbued with a never say die spirit, ready to trade punch for punch. You must have been an excellent debater at college; as I said, I am sure you could speak both for and against the proposition with equal conviction. I was never a debater, but then I have been a diplomat all my working life, all of 38 years, and one cannot survive there if one cannot argue in favour of (or against) just about anything. This time, however, I said what I feel and feel very strongly.

And no, I do not write with a double edged sword, to praise but detract; I gave praise where it was due, even when I did not agree with most of what you had said. The two things are quite different, and I have so far never read any post of yours that I did not like a great deal, though sometimes I felt the same as you did and sometimes, as now, very differently.

Now I have no yen for having the last word, and no intention of inflicting a 4 page rebuttal on you and the unsuspecting forum members. I will thus limit (!!) myself to the following.

I am not a Purvi-phile, but I greatly admire some of her qualities, above all everything that sets her apart from the standard issue TV soap heroine. But there are other aspects of her that irritate me beyond bearing at times. You, on the other hand, love her unconditionally, so much so that this love pervades all your arguments, and you never see anything wrong in her, or even if you do, it is not with anything even remotely like the clearsightedness you reserve for Arjun's failings.

I delighted in the para in your latest about his being like a bumbling idiot when he is around her – and which real lover is not a little like a madman? - but was that what he was like at the temple? And what did Purvi have to say in reply to that incredibly moving and generous speech of his ? All she could summon up was the usual shrill complaint about her usool and how she could not transgress those rules, which grated on one's nerves. Couldn't the girl find a single kind thing to say to the poor chap, for Heaven's sake!

Again, when I criticized the way she treats Arjun the morning after his confession, it was not because I expected her to swoon with love. I would never question her right to refuse his love. What made me angry was her total lack of compassion. I would never have rejected even an obnoxious suitor in that extremely unpleasant fashion: she crosses her arms and says, for all the world like a queen dismissing a recalcitrant subject "Aapko jawab mil gaya na. Ab aap ja sakte hain." It was plain awful, and no amount of verbal legerdemain on your part will make me feel otherwise.

Now, you are not prepared to give Arjun any brownie points for being so good (for want of a better word) despite the temptations that his background and position in life would have offered him. Fair enough. By the same token, I am not prepared to give Purvi any brownie points for having been a 'survivor", inhibited by a constrained upbringing. For one thing, I do not believe what Archana dishes out periodically, without any supporting facts, that Purvi has had a very tough time of it and many problems in her life. What problems, pray? I had listed all the ways in which she has had remarkable good fortune, in a post to Archana that you might have seen, and none of those points can be controverted. If she had not been so lucky, she would have ended up in a squalid orphanage, and then she would have other things to worry about than Arjun Kirloskar's importunities!

If Arjun "flounders, frets, charges like a bull, like a madman and lover rolled into one" it is largely because Purvi will not give him a decent hearing. In diplomacy the first thing we are taught is that you must ALWAYS be open to talking face to face. Purvi, on the other hand, believes in running away and choking off the other person, even if she knows that he desperately needs a hearing. I repeat myself, but if she had talked to him that evening when he turns up at her door, he need not have dragged her out in the pouring rain the next night, need he? And the mess he is in now is mostly not of his making but, as in a Thomas Hardy novel, the doing of malicious Fate. If he had only spoken to DK the previous day, if only Ovi had heard his first confession, if, if, if..

Even then, as I pointed out in my post, the end result would have been exactly the same, given Ovi's hyper tendencies and Purvi's bent of mind. Purvi might be a reasonable girl, but logical and analytical she is not. If she had been so, she would have figured out quite a while back that something had to be done to sort out the mess and rescue Arjun from the results of his being a 'bumbling idiot" (how I love that term!). That is what one does with a child, one picks it up when it falls, no matter that the fault was its alone.

Then again, how can one say that Arjun expects that "everything will be hunky dory in a jiffy" ? I do not think he does any such thing, nor did he do so when he confessed his love to her under exceptionally difficult circumstances. He is not thinking cockily that "all can be set right in the twinkling of an eye because he had/has good intentions". He knows perfectly well that is is nothing of the kind, and what he wants is to do his best to convince her, and to take in on the chin if he fails. He is always prepared for the worst – when he confesses, when she rejects him, and also now. That is why he always assures her that if that is what she wants, he will leave her strictly alone in the future. So, you see, I do not think that your primary grouse against him holds water.

But in all this, what both you and I are forgetting, is that while we want her and Arjun to get together again at the earliest ( or all in due time, to please you!), Purvi might not, and most likely does not want any such thing. What she wants above all is to please her aai, and she is convinced that she can best do this by giving up Arjun (she does not have 'to figure it out that Arjun does love her'; she knows that perfectly well, otherwise where is the sacrifice?) to Ovi. And with practically everyone around her singing hosannas to Ovi's amar prem for Arjun, no wonder her lemming-like tendencies are reinforced!
Thus for Purvi, there is no real dilemma; she will choose the tyaag option without a second thought and carry on, in the process sacrificing Arjun on the altar of 'sisterly' love. This is not love, but it is the kind of thing the target audiences for such soaps like. So Purvi will not see that she is doing no good to Ovi, and nor accept that she has no right to dispose of Arjun in such a summary fashion. She will not try to evaluate the balance sheet of what her decision will mean for all concerned, and to see whether there is some other way out. She will not tell the one person who could help her – Archana – what she is going through and why. She is so convinced that hers is the ONLY way that it will become the only way.
At least this is what I fear, but I still hope that perhaps she might, just might, be logical for a change and listen to the voice of reason – in this respect, for a change, both our voices!
It was great fun having this exchange with you, and I want to thank you for the treat. I am sure you will take all of the above in the right spirit and not feel that I am deliberately running down your neatly constructed arguments.
What really crushed me was that I had attributed La belle dame sans merci to Walter de la Mare. HOW could I?
Shyamala

Originally posted by: soapwatcher1

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Dear Janhvi,

I was in two minds whether to respond to your (as usual) beautifully argued and written piece, or not. Maybe it would have been better not, but in any case here I am.

I think this sort of Arjun-bashing is rather a waste of your remarkable facility with both ideas and language. It is too easy, for Arjun offers such a tempting target ' at first for being a richie rich young man, so arrogant and overbearing and, now that he has been reformed by love, for being persistent to excess, and prone to blunders whenever he gets the chance.

It does not matter that he is honourable to a fault, far more gentle and far more caring in love than one would ever expect any young man, of his background or otherwise, to be. It does not matter that his love is both unselfish and undemanding, and that he is prepared to quit and retreat, whatever the emotional toll on him, just so that Purvi can live in peace. It does not matter that having blundered at the engagement function, at the first opportunity he gets, he tells the truth to his formidable and intimidating father with no varnish on it, bluntly and categorically. He leaves no option for DK but to agree to what he wants, and he manages to do it without alienating his father as well. None of this matters when one wants to put Arjun in the pillory, and I must say that you have done it exceedingly well. I loved it from the aesthetic point of view, but not from the heart.

One could, and I am sure you can do it effortlessly, do the same kind of hatchet job on Purvi. I like her a lot, as she is a rare specimen in the world of TV soaps, a bright, ruthlessly capable and committed woman professional (the 'ruthless' streak was in evidence when she exposed Punni's boss), and I greatly admire her simplicity and her straightforwardness.

But I have never been blind to her faults, and a lack of compassion is one of them. I was so angry with the way in which she treated Arjun after he spends the night in front of her house that I wrote "What she displays is a total lack of concern for the feelings of a person who has, once he changed his ways, always shown her special consideration. She carries on as though she was the Queen of Sheba getting rid of an importunate suitor, whereas the fact is that she is only a stupidly obstinate, emotionally stunted, lower middle class girl, and normally the likes of Arjun Kirloskar would never come pleading to her door. If I was Arjun I would have told her to get lost and pushed off. Her good luck is that Arjun is so obsessed with her that he does not give up even in the face of such rudeness".

The interesting thing was that quite a number of people then jumped to Purvi's defence and were quite vocal in the process. I do not now see a single person speaking up for Arjun in response to your latest (and I must say very plausible) broadside. They all agree with you. It only goes to show that the majority of the forum are Purvi-philes to a remarkable degree, and if they like Arjun, it is not for himself, but only because he loves Purvi so deeply.

I beg to differ. I like Arjun for himself, He is a very rich, capable and powerful young man who could easily have become an irresponsible wastrel, living on the fruits of his father's talent and hard work, and/or a Casanova with no respect for the women he exploits. He is quite the opposite in both respects. Even more striking is that he is prepared to change himself completely for the sake of his love, and to totally suppress his ego where she is concerned. All this is so refreshing that I am quite prepared to forgive him a lot, and to empathise with him as he suffers - and no one can dispute how much he suffers - for his various acts of omission and commission.

My heart went out to the poor boy when he stood at Purvi's door that evening trying to explain the famous 'kiss', and was shooed away like a pariah by Sulochana ( if Archana had been present, things would have been quite different). lf they had let him sort things out with Purvi that evening, or if Purvi had not driven him to desperation by rejecting all his calls, there would have been no need for him to turn up on a rainy night and do all of the undesirable things you have cited so correctly.

I did not, as you would remember, approve of what Arjun did at the engagement party, but you can make a case for it nonetheless. Moreover, once her initial (and entirely justified) rage had cooled down, any girl with perception and good sense would, since she had seen how he looked throughout the ceremony, have realised that something had gone horrbily wrong, and that what happened was not intentional on Arjun's part. The next logical step would be to accept his call and see what he had to say, and also how best to proceed from there. She of course does none of this, and instead sheds endless tears like the typical soap heroine.

After his major blunder at the engagement function, the main point in Arjun's favour is that he tries hard to recover lost ground, even if he is not quite there yet. In the end, he suffers more than Purvi, as he has to cope with Ovi as well whereas Purvi at least has no importunate suitor round her neck, and can cry her heart out in peace.

I have already written about why I think it was a good thing he was NOT able to bring Ovi up to date in his office yesterday, so I shall not repeat myself here. But it is evident that it is unhappiness, tension and acute restlessness, made worse by Purvi's determined refusal to let him talk to her, that makes him disregard his father's express injunction and try to tell all to Ovi in his office.

In any case, even if he had told Ovi in advance and thus headed off the 'surprise' party, the end result as far as Purvi is concerned would have been the same, tyaag and all. This is because Ovi, on getting that clarification call from Arjun, would have caught the first flight to India and would have generally raised hell. By the time the dust settled, Purvi would have realised that this was her aayi's real daughter, and then it would be but one step to the grand sacrifice.

It would have been exactly the same if he had told Purvi in advance, for she would have insisted on knowing who the girl in Canada was. Nothing could have saved poor Arjun!

I apologise for repeating myself, but it is worth noting that Arjun is now like a very tightly stretched wire, and he is going to crack up very soon under the intolerable strain. He is prone to this sort of thing, and when he really flips, he will throw all caution and propriety to the winds. So Purvi would be well advised to let him talk to her and thus head off this explosion.

As for Purvi, it will again bear repeating that she has to rise above the overpowering misery that weighs her down now, and realize that running away from or cold-shouldering Arjun is not going to help either of them. She can see how acutely miserable he is as well, and if she really loves him (and I have my doubts about how much she loves him), she would feel his suffering as acutely as her own. She would want to get him out of this slough of despond no matter how she herself feels. She has to let him talk to her at some point, and this is better done outside the office, both for privacy and for both to be able to talk their hearts out instead of having to suppress their emotions and preserve a stoic front for public consumption.

As I have said often earlier, in every relationship, there is one who loves and one who is loved. In this one, it is Purvi who is loved.

This said, one has also to remember that she is new to the ways of love (but then so is Arjun!), and is perhaps not a romantic at heart , like Arjun has proved to be in his new avatar. She has a mental straight jacket of family - with her aai-baba in front - work, responsibilities, etc. in which she is most comfortable. When she ran to the airport and cried bitterly, she was being dragged out of her comfort zone by a new and unsettling force. She was at her best in her confession scene and those that followed, but she is not of the melting in love kind at all. The realist in her - fears of what people would say, etc. - will always win out, not to speak of the penchant for Great Renunciations.

One can be quite sure that if Arjun were ever to ask her to elope with him and get married in a mandir, her refusal would be instantaneous. She is no Juliet, our dear Purvi, but we love her nonetheless! But she has to get cracking, and it is not contracts with Sehgal & Sons that will solve her (and Arjun's ) problems.

None of the above is meant to detract in any from the praise due to your post for the language, the lucidity and the cohesiveness. But then, one expects all this of you!

Shyamala
PS: I noted, with dismay, that my response is twice as long as your post. But then, being a student of literature, you must be familiar with dissertations on, say, Pride and Prejudice, that are twice as long as the book, and I am sure you will excuse me!

/QUOTE]


sashashyam thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 13 years ago
#24
Dear Archana,

Thank you so much for this lovely, moving post. I do not need to add that I share your views completely, and I would like to compliment you on the fervent eloquence you have displayed in making your points. Your descriptions of Arjun's love for Purvi are worthy of a poet.

And whatever dear Jahnvi might say in her exasperation with Arjun(for something that is quite outside the poor boy's reach), the fact remains that he loves Purvi to distraction and would jettison anything at all for her. This is a precious thing in itself, no matter whether this love comes to fruition or not. It is not for nothing that all the classic love stories are tragedies.

Then again, when the dust finally clears and Arjun has resolved HIS problems, it will be Purvi and her hang ups that will be the crucial roadblock for the pair. The catch is that Arjun is too soft where she is concerned and is always ready to take a lot of nonsense from her without reacting. Now if he could only say" Look here, my girl, you are marrying me if you like it, and you are marrying me if you don't!" that would be the thing!

Shyamala

Originally posted by: archverma10

Shyamala I saw your response to my heartfelt plea as u suggested and visited the posts u mentioned to read your analysis. Excellent excellent post!!! 👏 There certainly is a lot of Arjun bashing going on and I do remember feeling incredible anger at the meanness and audacity of Purvi during his confession time and the MMS fiasco. Although I defended her because of her background I remember posting that the episode when she was so rude and mean to me made me hard pressed to watch and made things difficult for me to justify. I also expressed hope that the CVs would quit making her so mean because I was afraid that by the time they finally came together we would wind up hating her- she was so cold at the time.


Jhanvi dearest... I do understand where Purvi is coming from...she, with her background and upbringing, somehow summoned up the courage and fortitude to overlook the societal norms, swallow her pride, go to the airport, and confess her love to Arjun. Only to experience the total shock and horror of learning that the man she loves and took such a big step out of her world for had promised to marry someone else the entire time.

However, I have to agree with Shyamala. It is obvious...even to Purvi...that Arjun loves her so much. With a completeness, whole ness, and intensity that makes Purvi a very lucky girl indeed. To be loved like that is a rare and amazing thing. That he does love her like that is something nobody can successfully dispute in this entire forum.

He looked into her eyes and told her she was his world...and that she was the one who changed him. Purvi talks about sacrifice?????????? This man was going to go back to Canada keeping the pain of rejection in his heart...but he was still so gentle and loving with her...he was willing to go just so she could be at peace...and be happy...with or without him. He loves her so much he is willing to endure anything for her: humiliation, rejection, pain, her constantly misunderstanding him and not giving him a chance to explain, embarrassment, etc.

He loves her with a love that is all-encompassing and total...with every part of his being. Even she doesn't realize the deptths and magnitude of it...but that is her cross. With her he is the happiest man alive. Without her he is miserable and hurting. He loved her enough to let her go when he thought that was what would make her happy. Now that's love. And that's the real meaning of sacrifice.

abhimg thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Navigator Thumbnail
Posted: 13 years ago
#25
Soapwatcher and Shyamala and Archana and Jhanvi, it is so wonderful to read the long analysis/ thoughts/ concerns...the language, the thoughts- all are heartfelt and it is so obvious you are all such brilliant writers and it expresses how we all truly feel too. Its absolutely amazing to read...truly joyful. Keep up the writing...and expressing...and so beautifully putting into words that one is transported into a whole different world reading it...thank you...
soapwatcher1 thumbnail
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Posted: 13 years ago
#26

Originally posted by: abhimg

Soapwatcher and Shyamala and Archana and Jhanvi, it is so wonderful to read the long analysis/ thoughts/ concerns...the language, the thoughts- all are heartfelt and it is so obvious you are all such brilliant writers and it expresses how we all truly feel too. Its absolutely amazing to read...truly joyful. Keep up the writing...and expressing...and so beautifully putting into words that one is transported into a whole different world reading it...thank you...

Dear abhimg, thank you for the sweet words :) Funny how these characters in the "idiot box" can connect and transport viewers all around the world!
Soapwatcher is my forum name but please feel free to call me Janhvi.
sashashyam thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Sparkler Thumbnail + 3
Posted: 13 years ago
#27
Dear abhimg,

What a very sweet and thoughtful message! Thank you ever so much, and speaking only for myself, it is a relief to know that at least some one like you feels that my posts are not over long!

PS: Just a small point: soapwatcher1 and Janhvi are the same person, and yes, from her, words flow with the same turbulent energy as the water in her namesake, the holy Ganga.

Shyamala B.Cowsik

Originally posted by: abhimg

Soapwatcher and Shyamala and Archana and Jhanvi, it is so wonderful to read the long analysis/ thoughts/ concerns...the language, the thoughts- all are heartfelt and it is so obvious you are all such brilliant writers and it expresses how we all truly feel too. Its absolutely amazing to read...truly joyful. Keep up the writing...and expressing...and so beautifully putting into words that one is transported into a whole different world reading it...thank you...

abhimg thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Navigator Thumbnail
Posted: 13 years ago
#28
Shyamala, Janhvi (sorry for spelling error last time) and Archana, i have never been this crazy to join a forum and actually read and enjoy and fall in love with ARVI like this. I sometimes stop to wonder if this is normal behavior on my part. Yes, i know these are soaps only TV shows, but the brilliant acting by RD, Asha, the chemistry between them, brings out the romantic in all of us and we fall in love with them. The love of literature, and reading and writing and the flair for superb writing that all three of you have is simply marvellous and comes across very well in this forum especially for the ARVI track...and it is a joy, and the hope it inspires in us as readers and participants in this forum...just for that too thank U 😳😆😊😃
soapwatcher1 thumbnail
14th Anniversary Thumbnail Rocker Thumbnail
Posted: 13 years ago
#29
Dear Janhvi,

Atta girl! I knew you would come back fighting, imbued with a never say die spirit, ready to trade punch for punch. You must have been an excellent debater at college; as I said, I am sure you could speak both for and against the proposition with equal conviction. I was never a debater, but then I have been a diplomat all my working life, all of 38 years, and one cannot survive there if one cannot argue in favour of (or against) just about anything. This time, however, I said what I feel and feel very strongly.

And no, I do not write with a double edged sword, to praise but detract; I gave praise where it was due, even when I did not agree with most of what you had said. The two things are quite different, and I have so far never read any post of yours that I did not like a great deal, though sometimes I felt the same as you did and sometimes, as now, very differently.

Now I have no yen for having the last word, and no intention of inflicting a 4 page rebuttal on you and the unsuspecting forum members. I will thus limit (!!) myself to the following.

I am not a Purvi-phile, but I greatly admire some of her qualities, above all everything that sets her apart from the standard issue TV soap heroine. But there are other aspects of her that irritate me beyond bearing at times. You, on the other hand, love her unconditionally, so much so that this love pervades all your arguments, and you never see anything wrong in her, or even if you do, it is not with anything even remotely like the clearsightedness you reserve for Arjun's failings.

I delighted in the para in your latest about his being like a bumbling idiot when he is around her ' and which real lover is not a little like a madman? - but was that what he was like at the temple? And what did Purvi have to say in reply to that incredibly moving and generous speech of his ? All she could summon up was the usual shrill complaint about her usool and how she could not transgress those rules, which grated on one's nerves. Couldn't the girl find a single kind thing to say to the poor chap, for Heaven's sake!

Again, when I criticized the way she treats Arjun the morning after his confession, it was not because I expected her to swoon with love. I would never question her right to refuse his love. What made me angry was her total lack of compassion. I would never have rejected even an obnoxious suitor in that extremely unpleasant fashion: she crosses her arms and says, for all the world like a queen dismissing a recalcitrant subject "Aapko jawab mil gaya na. Ab aap ja sakte hain." It was plain awful, and no amount of verbal legerdemain on your part will make me feel otherwise.

Now, you are not prepared to give Arjun any brownie points for being so good (for want of a better word) despite the temptations that his background and position in life would have offered him. Fair enough. By the same token, I am not prepared to give Purvi any brownie points for having been a 'survivor", inhibited by a constrained upbringing. For one thing, I do not believe what Archana dishes out periodically, without any supporting facts, that Purvi has had a very tough time of it and many problems in her life. What problems, pray? I had listed all the ways in which she has had remarkable good fortune, in a post to Archana that you might have seen, and none of those points can be controverted. If she had not been so lucky, she would have ended up in a squalid orphanage, and then she would have other things to worry about than Arjun Kirloskar's importunities!

If Arjun "flounders, frets, charges like a bull, like a madman and lover rolled into one" it is largely because Purvi will not give him a decent hearing. In diplomacy the first thing we are taught is that you must ALWAYS be open to talking face to face. Purvi, on the other hand, believes in running away and choking off the other person, even if she knows that he desperately needs a hearing. I repeat myself, but if she had talked to him that evening when he turns up at her door, he need not have dragged her out in the pouring rain the next night, need he? And the mess he is in now is mostly not of his making but, as in a Thomas Hardy novel, the doing of malicious Fate. If he had only spoken to DK the previous day, if only Ovi had heard his first confession, if, if, if..

Even then, as I pointed out in my post, the end result would have been exactly the same, given Ovi's hyper tendencies and Purvi's bent of mind. Purvi might be a reasonable girl, but logical and analytical she is not. If she had been so, she would have figured out quite a while back that something had to be done to sort out the mess and rescue Arjun from the results of his being a 'bumbling idiot" (how I love that term!). That is what one does with a child, one picks it up when it falls, no matter that the fault was its alone.

Then again, how can one say that Arjun expects that "everything will be hunky dory in a jiffy" ? I do not think he does any such thing, nor did he do so when he confessed his love to her under exceptionally difficult circumstances. He is not thinking cockily that "all can be set right in the twinkling of an eye because he had/has good intentions". He knows perfectly well that is is nothing of the kind, and what he wants is to do his best to convince her, and to take in on the chin if he fails. He is always prepared for the worst ' when he confesses, when she rejects him, and also now. That is why he always assures her that if that is what she wants, he will leave her strictly alone in the future. So, you see, I do not think that your primary grouse against him holds water.

But in all this, what both you and I are forgetting, is that while we want her and Arjun to get together again at the earliest ( or all in due time, to please you!), Purvi might not, and most likely does not want any such thing. What she wants above all is to please her aai, and she is convinced that she can best do this by giving up Arjun (she does not have 'to figure it out that Arjun does love her'; she knows that perfectly well, otherwise where is the sacrifice?) to Ovi. And with practically everyone around her singing hosannas to Ovi's amar prem for Arjun, no wonder her lemming-like tendencies are reinforced!
Thus for Purvi, there is no real dilemma; she will choose the tyaag option without a second thought and carry on, in the process sacrificing Arjun on the altar of 'sisterly' love. This is not love, but it is the kind of thing the target audiences for such soaps like. So Purvi will not see that she is doing no good to Ovi, and nor accept that she has no right to dispose of Arjun in such a summary fashion. She will not try to evaluate the balance sheet of what her decision will mean for all concerned, and to see whether there is some other way out. She will not tell the one person who could help her ' Archana ' what she is going through and why. She is so convinced that hers is the ONLY way that it will become the only way.
At least this is what I fear, but I still hope that perhaps she might, just might, be logical for a change and listen to the voice of reason ' in this respect, for a change, both our voices!
It was great fun having this exchange with you, and I want to thank you for the treat. I am sure you will take all of the above in the right spirit and not feel that I am deliberately running down your neatly constructed arguments.
What really crushed me was that I had attributed La belle dame sans merci to Walter de la Mare. HOW could I?
Shyamala
_____________________________________________________________________

Dearest Shyamala.

No worries, I look forward to these exchanges, the banter of words. I delight in these scrumptious delicacies, it is an addiction to the sweet tooth, sans which, one is rummaging through the cupboards for a morsel but still yearning for something substantial in content - which is what it felt like yesterday looking for your daily dose of wisdom and instead finding scattered tidbits amidst several posts.
First things first, what is in a name? Prose or poetry that appeals does not need to be attributed to the correct author to be enjoyed. Keats or De la Mare, it really does not matter. 😉
Coming to the meat of the matter, you nailed it, my judgement is a little clouded where Purvi is concerned, but we do not disagree too much in this regard, you like Purvi "for Arjun" and I like Arjun "for Purvi"! Almost the same!
No brownie points for Arjun, you ask? 😃 No quarter given, no quarter asked.😉 You say Arjun could have fallen to temptation, rich and attractive as he is, true, but then Purvi too could have turned into a money hungry Punni. Neither did. Arjun and Purvi are a match made in heaven, PR heaven at least. He for all his money and power is an idealist and conservative at heart, she is prim and proper Miss. Purvi with a touch of the romantic hidden in her. The last attributable perhaps to the Sunday movies with mom? Well done, Archana, your foresight in creating this little chink in oh, little Miss.Perfect (said indulgently) is to be applauded!
But we digress. I have given a lot of thought to the temple scene and her totally off the wall remark about her "usool" and this is my analysis of it. Tell me if I am way off the mark. She is being bombarded with emotions and sensations hitherto unknown to her. He is telling her with that sweet half smile he is selfish, he wanted to see her again, her mind is going "oh, he is so cute" and then when he tells her she is his world and his life's best gift, "does, he mean that? how sweet" "Can I tell him not to leave? Or do I need mom's permission to fall in love?" "Am I supposed to respond, I have not said a word" With thoughts a whirl in her head, she responds to the only mundane (how I hate that word!) thing in the entire conversation with words that she can utter without compromising, rather committing herself and that comes out as the nonsensical remark about her "usool" I am sure the minute it came out, she regretted it, he at least paid scant attention, he knows his Purvi well and kept plowing away.
The morning after the blinking lights incident, I cannot find fault with her for it at all, she had already told him to leave the night before, he persists in not giving her time and her exasperation was well warranted. If a child keeps asking you for something and you tell him/her you will think about it but they keep bugging you, your answer often times is a flat no just because you are at your wit's end. He promises her always she can take her sweet time and he will honor her decision but he does not. He did expect everything to return to normal right away even after "his" engagement, otherwise why the question in her cabin? He should have started off with "I know you are angry, you have just cause, let me explain" which is what he later did in the auto and she listened!
Bumbling idiot, when is he one? Oh, all the time and that is what makes him so endearing. 😆 When he is with her alone not as much, then it is the gung-ho lover boy but at her engagement, even as Punni's parents were talking to him, he strays. When he gifts her those bangles, when he offers money to settle her with Vinay, when he calls her a surprise package after her dance performance, countless instances but it is heartwarming to see him lose his cool. He disarms us and her with these revelations of weakness for Purvi that he cannot control and that is why we love them together!
Let me not start waxing poetical about why they are perfect for each other, we all know that and that was not the point of this post😉, hence the fervent prayer for this track to end. 😊
PS: You must have been formidable as a diplomat, your opponents probably did not know what hit them when you unleashed your eloquent arguments!
Edited by soapwatcher1 - 13 years ago
vgiri thumbnail
13th Anniversary Thumbnail Navigator Thumbnail
Posted: 13 years ago
#30

I would like to second @abhimg. Awesome writing Shyamala, Trish, Jahnvi, Archverma and Desi Chic(wow!! is the only word i can say for her). You are all gifted writers. Kudos ladies. Please continue writing, I love this online debate.

Most of the credit goes to Rithvik & Asha for their acting. RD.. i just watch him in awe, excellent acting. wish he gets more screen time.

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