varaali thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#1
I got to know that several members had complained against me last night for the debate on Karna that I had started.


First of all - my sincere apologies for having offended your feelings. It was unintentional, though. A non- AT does not mean a Criticism AT.

I often throw such debates open to my students and the arguments are often enlightening. That was my purpose here too.


That's why at the very outset I has asked the members to substantiate their arguments with examples / quotes, since I have found that arguments tend to be rational when backed with examples.


Nevertheless, how and when the debate spun out of control, I have no idea since by the time I came back, I found the thread securely under lock and key.


I do sincerely believe that it is possible to have a rational, level headed, enlightening discussions- without getting passionate and emotional. Think of the American Presidential Debates. Running to the DT - whining about every post that is contrary to one's views is reminiscent of Kindergarten children complaining to their Class Teacher- "Miss...he called me Motu" 😆


In any case- I reiterate- If my single solitary post had offended anyone's feelings, I do apologize.

There's one another thing which I would like to say to the Karna admirers before I bid adieu. And I wanted to highlight that through this thread- if only you guys had given me the chance.


It can be argued that Karna did NOT call Draupadi a prostitute / Vaishya / wh**e...etc etc.

It is widely beleived that Karna called Draupadi despicable names when she had been forcible dragged into the court. This point is often held against Karna, and KMG's translation also reiterates the same but the beauty of Sanskrit is that it lends itself to multiple explanations. And one thing we are taught while learning Sanskrit is to analyze whether a verse can interpreted differently from the intended meaning.

The relevant sloka is this

eko bhart striy devair vihita kurunandana
iya tv anekavaag
bandhakti vinicit.

The key word here is 'bandhaka'. While one of the meanings of this word is 'courtesan' which is what KMG uses, it can also mean 'tied to / attached to'.

So what Karna actually said can also be this: While the Gods have ordained one man as husband for a woman, this woman here is attached to / tied to many men.

Again in the next line according to KMG, Karna asks the clothes of Pandavas and Draupadi to be snatched. But see the actual line

38 dusana sublo 'ya vikara prjavdika
pavn ca vssi draupady cpy
uphara

KMG translates uphaara as apahara - meaning "take off forcibly". But the actual word is uphaara. Hence this line can also mean " Not only the Pandavas but their clothes and even Draupadi's have been gifted to us"

If this meaning is taken, then Karna does not order anyone's stripping - least of all Draupadi's. It is Dushashana who does the honours.

I did want to bring these points to the Karna admirers's notice but...was hounded out. I hopeI have given all the Karna's admirers something to cheer about.




Edited by varaali - 11 years ago

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varaali thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#2
Secondly- I was informed by the GM that the title to the thread was misleading, etc etc.
I would like to clarify that it was indeed meant for the Karna admirers to join in in the debate and put forth their views. Unfortunately the thread went into a bungee jump and hit the rock bottom.

Sabhayata thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#3
@varaali:Completly understand there is no need for apology i understand your true intention was just to have a discussion with Karna admirer's trying to understand their POV which we dont mind at all but things in the forum are little different as you would have seen yesterday.
But in any case you are one of the most well informed and well read and knowledgable member of this forum would love to have a karna discussin with you any time and get more knowledge from you.We have a Karna AT you are most welcome to come there and have discussions on Karna there with Karna admirers since that is visited only by his admirers or episode discussion thread alot of karna admirers visit there as well.Like i said you being one of the most knowledgable member of this forum would love to have discussions with you and get enlightened.
simplysappie thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#4

Originally posted by: Sabhayata

@varaali:Completly understand there is no need for apology i understand your true intention was just to have a discussion with Karna admirer's trying to understand their POV which we dont mind at all but things in the forum are little different as you would have seen yesterday.

But in any case you are one of the most well informed and well read and knowledgable member of this forum would love to have a karna discussin with you any time and get more knowledge from you.We have a Karna AT you are most welcome to come there and have discussions on Karna there with Karna admirers since that is visited only by his admirers or episode discussion thread alot of karna admirers visit there as well.Like i said you being one of the most knowledgable member of this forum would love to have discussions with you and get enlightened.

Same thoughts as mine ... And even I'm sorry if any of my posts on that thread yesterday hurt you or anyone...
shruti thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
#5
Healthy criticism/debate has always been welcomed however any post/title targeting any member/fan group will NOT be tolerated. Though you had presented your views/thoughts on character of Karna within the forum rules the topic was directed towards one particular fan group.You cannot single out fans and question their loyalty for the character. The topic in question could have been discussed/debated upon but due to difference of opinions and misleading title it lead to personal attacks and insults which could have been avoided.

I understand the intention behind this post was to apologize to members/ fans for hurting them. However this topic is with regards to other thread that was decided by Dev Team to be kept close after being reviewed thus we would be closing down this one.

If you want to open any topic with regards to any character or any issue related to Mahabharat stay objective, neutral and encourgae everyone to participate without singling out any fan group/members.

If you have any further concerns please feel free to contact us.

Regards,
I-F Dev Team

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