Discussion: The Pride of Radha and the Gopis

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Vishakha_Sakhi

@Vishakha_Sakhi

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+ 5

Posted: 14 years ago

#11

That's awesome news! I would be very grateful if you or Lola could post the link! 😃

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Aishwarya

@pakhara

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+ 2

Posted: 14 years ago

#12

Srry for the post. I forgot that i had reserved.

Edited by AishuJSKfan - 14 years ago

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Janaki

@RamKiSeeta

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Posted: 14 years ago

#13

Hmm, what you say is interesting Aishu....but I don't think Radharani is a made-up character. After all, there are some puranas that describe her in great deal and the authors of those puranas saw Krishna's life through divya drishti or were blessed through a dream or whatnot. Take Tulasidas for example. People take Valmiki Ramayan as main source for Ramayan, but Tulsidas is said to have been blessed by Lord Hanuman himself and also a reincarnation of Valmiki (who is said to be an incarnation of Narad Muni)...he wrote about a great many things that are not in Valmiki Ramayan, like a Swayamvar for Sita Devi (in VR Ramji lifts the dhanush for fun only...there was no swayamvar) or the whole Chhaya Sita concept.

Likewise, I think Radharani is a character some great rishi or pundit found out through divya drishti or blessings, and wrote about her so humanity does not forget her.😳 After all, she is a very important idol in many temples and I don't think the great saints of today would let humanity worship a fictitious character.

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Aishwarya

@pakhara

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Posted: 14 years ago

#14

Yes di, you are right that the great saints of today, like Shri Prabhupada would never let people worship false deities, but I've read that Jayadeva, while still being a devotee of Shri Krishna, was a court poet rather than a saint.

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Janaki

@RamKiSeeta

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Posted: 14 years ago

#15

Originally posted by: AishuJSKfan

Yes di, you are right that the great saints of today, like Shri Prabhupada would never let people worship false deities, but I've read that Jayadeva, while still being a devotee of Shri Krishna, was a court poet rather than a saint.

I have never heard of Jayadeva actually, so I'm not sure who he is.😳 But whether one is a poet or saint, a devotee is a devotee and if he is a true devotee of Krishna, Krishna would never let him give out false info to people, would he? After all, Tulsidas was also a poet and not a saint I think...not sure though. And before he became a rishi, Valmiki too was not a saint. In fact, he was from a low caste and a thief at that too, but achieved such a high status because of his devotion and tapasya. So bhakti and devotion can overcome any title and caste.😊

Moreover, there were other saints like Surdas and such who talked about Radharani a lot...and some miracles have happened before where people who prayed to Radhaji were restored of their health, eyesight, etc....will try to find some stories on the net. How can such miracles happen if people pray to a fictional character?

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Aishwarya

@pakhara

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Posted: 14 years ago

#16

Thanks di! That cleared some doubts in my head. I was thinking about that article all day long, worried. Haha, being fifteen is difficult. I didn't really mean to doubt a Goddess, but I am trying to find a better understanding of my own faith.

Edited by AishuJSKfan - 14 years ago

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MagadhSundari

@MagadhSundari

Sparkler

+ 4

Posted: 14 years ago

#17

Sooo much fun stuff has happened here since I reserved that post a page ago that I'm gonna go ahead and type up a new one, leaving that one as is... sorry about the waste of space 😆

@ Aishu - the origin and authenticity of Radharani is a matter of confusion for many, hun... don't be too hard on yourself, nobody's offended 😛 The confusion arises because all of the Puraans originated as oral scriptures, not texts - so to put a date on when people started reciting them is much harder than if they were on paper. However Vaishnav scholars usually date all of them in B.C.E., long before Jayadevji wrote his Gita Govind. And one of them - the Brahma Vaivart Puraan - talks about Radha in great detail. If your interested, I wrote lots more on it and provided some links here: https://www.indiaforums.com/forum/post/35953415 Moreover, as Janu beautifully put it, it doesn't really matter that Jayadev was a court bard - the author's occupation should have no bearing on the authenticity of his work when it comes to devotional literature, because there were no New York Times bestseller lists and TRPs back then for which people would want to spin fiction around God. He wasn't going to help them sell products because no one was buying them then - if they were writing about Him (or Her in this case 😆), it was probably out of their own personal devotional experience.

@ Vedo - yayyyy, so glad to hear you've been watching Shri Krishna too You should totally start a diary thread like Janu's or participate in hers, we'd all love to know how you feel about it! Hmmm you're on 33 - the Janmasthami epis - hence the other thread you made, I get it 😆 Unfortunately the guy who's putting it up in HQ on youtube is only picking and choosing short clips that summarize the main story, it's not the whole series 😒 But the dailymotion quality does improve not too far from where you've reached, as you'll see in the clip Janu provided - I would stick with dailymotion only because it's from the original uncut version of the series, the dvds and the vids that most YT uploaders have gotten from them are missing a lot of good stuff. Still, for avis and pics and stuff that guy's channel is really useful... so here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/user/drsaurabhparikh

@... everyone, I guess 😆 - I basically second everything Vedo said in her contribution to this discussion, and I couldn't have said it better myself 👏 We have plenty of instances like this, when God plays dumb in one form (or in this case, jealous) so that in another, he can teach us a valuable lesson.

For example, in Ramayan Parvati Maa is always becoming bewildered by Shri Ram's leela and asking Shivji questions about it (the ones that NDTV Ramayan's Shivji veryyy often answered by saying "vidhi ka vidhaan"). Was she ever really confused and did she herself really need the wisdom he gave her? I don't think so. He is Shaktimay, she is his Shakti. They are inseparable so for her to really have any less knowledge than he does would not make any sense. In this form, in their RadheShyam form, and wherever else we see this kind of behavior coming from a form of the divine, I believe it's all about teaching us a lesson.

On a practical daily life level, I agree that the lesson was what Vedo said it was - that pride and the jealousy that comes from it are dangerous and need to be overcome as soon as they arise.

On a spiritual level though, at least in the serial, this episode was part of an ongoing explanation of dwait and adwait. It started right after the "Aaja re Kanhaiya tohe Radha banaadun" leela of RadheShyam swapping clothes. From then on, for a couple of beautiful scenes we have Shri Krishna essentially telling us about the peacefulness of adwait (dwelling in the oneness of the jiva and the Paramatma) and Radharani glorifies and exemplifies the depth and the fun of stormy dwait (considering the jiva to be separate from and devoted to God). So this episode - which kind of gives closure to the debate and then summarizes it in the song Prem Jagat Ka Saar - presents the conclusion that both are equivalent, and in fact both are the same because they start and end with God - so accepting that and harmonizing both in our way of thinking and our way of life, we can enjoy supreme devotional bliss.

Radharani realizes that adwait/nonduality is the truth about her relationship with the other gopis, they are all manifestations of her only so harboring any jealousy or ill-will towards them is ignorant and futile. However, at the end of the scene she does get Shri Krishna to acknowledge that the intense love she has for Him due to her dwait/dualistic understanding of their nature is what keeps the world going - he admits, "ek prem ke aage hi to Bhagwan bhi haarte hain" 😍 So, for us, this means that we should realize that we and everyone else in the world are reflections of the same truth - like the gopis were of Radha - and on account of that unity, we should abandon any useless arrogance/jealously/ill-will/any other negative feelings we have towards them... and at the same time, by having a dualistic understanding of God as our master/friend/beloved and engaging in pure devotion towards Him, we can experience that boundless bliss that comes with it and get the best of both worlds!

So that's my interpretation of this leela... hope it was short enough 😆

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Aishwarya

@pakhara

Rocker

+ 2

Posted: 14 years ago

#18

Thanks Lola di! I'll definitely try to read the entire Brahma Vaivarta Puranam! As of yet, I've only read the Wikipedia description of it after you posted this. Thanks so much di! You don't know how much this helps!

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Vishakha_Sakhi

@Vishakha_Sakhi

Inactive

+ 5

Posted: 14 years ago

#19

Originally posted by: AishuJSKfan
Thanks di! That cleared some doubts in my head. I was thinking about that article all day long, worried. Haha, being fifteen is difficult. I didn't really mean to doubt a Goddess, but I am trying to find a better understanding of my own faith.

Aishu, I think that this is a phase that every devotee must go through in order to make their faith stronger! We should all listen to our elders, read from the texts and learn from all sources but we can only accept what our hearts let us right? If from our hearts we don't accept something then how can we believe in it on the outside? It doesn't work that way. Another thing...Shri Krishna resides in our heart right? So I don't think he would make a devotee of his believe in something that is wrong. If we truly believe in him he would never lead us astray. ❤️ Take it all as a test to reaffirm your faith.

Edited by Vedo - 14 years ago

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Aishwarya

@pakhara

Rocker

+ 2

Posted: 14 years ago

#20

Thanks Vedo! That's really good advice! I mean I grew up listening to stories from my mom. But I still want to read the geeta and the puranas so that I can get a better understanding of what I'm believing in. I mean, don't get me wrong, I really do seriously love Krishna.

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