A Bleak Future?

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Ganga

@Avatarana09

Dazzler

Posted: 14 years ago

#81

So Lennie here too. So Lennie and JZee, what say???

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Lennie

@Lennie

Trailblazer

+ 5

Posted: 14 years ago

#82

I do agree and thanks, that Gulaal does love Kesar more then anything, its always been there, the love she holds for Kesar is another part of her, seperate from Vasant, there are only two ppl she truly loves Vasant and Kesar, and love for Kesar is well not in those terms yet but its there...

Another thing, in all this - i have not once seen Gulaal mention i have no feelings for you, esp the ones he is having and so on...

She cant even says i dont love you or even if we do get a scene where she says i dont particular care for you or love you - we all know she doesnt mean it and so on (remember few times Kesar used to say stuff to her when he came back, trying to get across he doesnt care for her and so on, and to hurt her), coz she does esp that love she holds for him - remember the how she said after he saved her from drowning... that love she has held has not changed, coz anything else, to her he is that Kesar, despite what this Kesar is in front of her and so on

And you clearly see it, that Gulaal very much acts around Kesar and lets him see her and anger and so on - that is just exclusive to him, out of the house who else does she have this kind of open relation as... its always been them and however they are with each other, in anger, in sadness, in talking - because they are both free to act how they want with each other in a way, their way etc

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aimin

@aimin

Explorer

Posted: 14 years ago

#83

Hey there everyone, I'm Aimin. :) Been watching Gulaal for some time now & had a lot to say as well but never posted my thoughts before. >_> Since last night basically called for a rant from every fan of the show, good or bad, I'm copying & pasting a ramble of mine to JZee from earlier today.

The Gulaal episode was... confusing?! It drove me up the wall!!! There is such a fine line between right & wrong here. I agree with your point that it's appalling Gulaal treats Kesar like he's an animal while letting her husband's murderer walk freely but I guess it's all about her perception of the situation. To an outsider (& a person who really doesn't want to understand, for example Sudha) it would look like Gulaal betrayed Talli & ruthlessly got her way back into the house. & it was pretty obvious Gulaal was coming back, considering Kesar's obsession with her, we just didn't know how. So maybe she feels she has an obligation towards Talli, whose childhood dreams got dashed with the messy situation at hand, & to Vasant, to remain true to him for the rest of her life, that she feels it necessary to be firm in her stand & not melt against Kesar? Maybe there are more things to the sin aspect of a Kesar-Gulaal relationship other than age & Kesar being Vasant's brother. Maybe she sees it wrong to fall in love again, maybe for her that's betraying Vasant. I know all of this sounds like I'm grabbing at straws here (& believe me, I don't want to see Kesar with Talli, Gulaal with Dushyant anymore than you guys do) but maybe even if she genuinely feels repelled by Kesar at times, watching her reminisce about the past made me think she might actually be warring in her mind over this though she seems resolute in being cold & hard-hearted to Kesar.
Him taking care of her & later committing a 'sin' by falling in love with her. The latter part of her thoughts came later but it was drawn out, seemingly dominating her mind. For now, Kesar's confession lies heavily on her more than anything else. Looks like the situation cannot be resolved in a week or two, even in a month for that matter... There are so many dynamics to this.

& Gulaal refusing to put patti on Kesar? Me at my most deperate again but I'll be damned if that wasn't a sick version of reverse reverse reverse reverse reverse psychology. >_> It's not that Kesar needs either Gulaal or Talli for this, but taking that angle anyway, if Gulaal doesn't care about Kesar, why does she even bother showing up at his room? With a bowl of cold water to ease his fever to boot. & when he tries to get his way in this (hence trying to manipulate matters to his needs, like he has been doing so often recently), she gets pissed off & basically tells him that she doesn't care. Yeah. Right. One look at her face when Dushyant comes home saying he couldn't find Kesar in the storm & you'd see how indifferent she is about this. The guilt, the pain, the fear was clear as day. The patti scene & precap are just classic of how many parents when trying to reason out with their children who throw tantrums to get their way ignore the crying & the repeated pleas as if they don't care, when they actually do.
I think before anything, it's time Gulaal stopped seeing Kesar as a stubborn child. Stubborn he still is, child not so much.

As for Gulaal being civil to Dushyant, maybe she accepted his repentance because he truly did, not to mention the fact that she herself gave him the biggest punishment of all by marrying Kesar? At this point he probably has demons of his own, trying to deal with his loneliness & the Kes-Gul deeyarvattu. I'm not sympathising with him, the fact still stands that he deliberately killed Vasanth. & someone mentioned this before but Daman's taunts might just take Dushyant to a public confession.

I have to say though Jaz, like you, I'm not taking Gulaal's side in this, or Kesar's for that matter. It would be much easier for these characters to take the path often taken, fall in love with matters resolved in a split second, (& garner some more TRPs??) but I think it's necessary that this is shown. Gulaal may act mahaan but she's not perfect & here she portrays the flawed thinking process many other women have.

Buuut I'll admit this, yes, like most here, I want to actually see what's running through her mind rather than guessing it. >_>

@MeySimi: I see we're on common grounds with the Gulaal-batraying-Vasant-by-falling-in-love theory. ^^

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without-fathom

@without-fathom

Rocker

Posted: 14 years ago

#84

Okay, to start with - I don't think the question ever was whether Gulaal loves Kesar or not. That has never been the question, never can be.

The question at this point would be more like - why is it wrong for her to love Kesar? [ps: I'm not referring to vice versa situation, of why it is wrong for Kesar to love Gulaal - because that is Kesar's side, and we're getting inside Gulaal's head atm]

Again the question never was whether Gulaal was justified in doing the deeyarvattu or not? Yes, it was the question once upon a long time ago, but no longer.

The question now is - why is she shying away from what was once her own decision? Whether or not is was her marzi or majburi - the decision was Gulaal's prerogative - and hers alone. She could have simply walked out of that house and never looked back - but that is not like Gulaal - and so she took a drastic step. She took a step, and lived with it a decade of her life - doing everything that she saw as part and parcel of the responsibility she had taken upon herself. But that eye opening lesson she was dishing out to Kesar standing in his bedroom as his wife - needs to be given back to her in kind. She never got into the deeyarvattu with the intention of being tied to Kesar as a wife - but since she did get into it, was the choice of its extent really hers alone to make thereafter?

I was talking to Aimin - one of the silent stalkers of this forum who I've been trying to convince to come aboard active discussions and here is a copy paste of something I said to her (to save myself typing again)

I think of it like this. About how Gulaal had become this proven wrong, fallen angel who had made loud claims and fatefully fallen flat on each one - and somehow getting together with Kesar would be the last straw to her reputation, among others, and more importantly in her own eyes...

On the one end, she will never give a damn to what people say and will do what she deems righteous; but on the other hand, when she knows she's failed a promise like Talli-Kesar wedlock, she can probably not bear to even put herself into the firing line now - because all her demons will come true at once - all the genuine well wishers who had warned her about the deeyarvattu backfiring a decade ago, and all the promises of a decade that she has failed now - and is being blamed for because she is the inadvertent root cause. When you just look at the sequence of events - from the wedding getting called off, the deeyarvattu not being revoked, Gulaal leaving the house, but eventually getting forced back in - it can seem like one big plan on her part, as Sudha perceives it (credit for argument to Aimin). Gulaal understands that backlash, more than anyone else - and tragedy of her predicament atm is, that if she was to accept Kesar, she would be consolidating all those dubious speculations of her having schemed; if she doesn't accept Kesar, as she is not, there is the other party of JK and co., not to mention Kesar himself, who will not let her rest a second in peace - by taunting her, or sending her down a guilt trip, or simply by throwing tantrums. When you look at things like that, it seems evident that Gulaal has opted for the second of the worse scenarios because she doesn't want to give anymore reason to affirm doubts that her intentions about the Talli-Kesar wedding, or about the deeyarvattu in the first place had been anything but selfless - to quote her from an episode meri neeyat mein koi khot nahi hai!

But is it likely that Gulaal is keeping away from Kesar simply to prove a point of her 'pure' selfless intentions? Knowing the person Gulaal is, maybe not, even though I suppose it can be more than intimidating to be questioned about intentions which were anything but vile. But again, knowing Gulaal, I'm very doubtful the CVs are playing at that side. I doubt they will show Gulaal inflicting so much pain on Kesar - as most viewers are perceiving her at this moment - only to save her own face some grace in the face of brutal character questioning - she's been there, done that. She would sooner take the brick bats then let anybody (least of all Kesar) suffer in the wake of it - no matter what it breaks or kills inside of her to take the toll upon herself instead.

I do honestly think, that a part of her is purely in fear of this new person Kesar has become - a grown up. It's been coming to her all along, in various forms. First, on his return, he was no longer a kid, but a willful man she could no longer cajole and get her way with. Then, although she wouldn't admit to herself, she also begun feeling his 'man' presence around him. The way she would pull on her pallu, time and again, the way his physical overbearance would stump her... and finally, his love confessing, and adult obstinacy beat her down. Kesar has shown her a range of character shades in these few weeks of return- from childlike vulnerability, to sheer obstinacy even obsessions, to a mature protectiveness - and somewhere they have all been driven solely by her - for good or bad - and Gulaal realizes that.. ofc it can be scary. I don't think she's trying to be mean to Kesar really, it's just the only defense she can employ against him - this cold pretense shield, because he penetrates through everything else... so she's just evolved into this version of herself which A) preferentially doesn't speak, B) if and when she does, it's only to say things which are so cutting and accusing that they stun even Kesar to silence, and drive him far from reasoning with her. I suppose she figures that if they were to have a real conversation - he would win the debate - because she really doesn't have sound arguments on her, except those she makes up and puts her foot down on as hard believing.

There is such a fine line between right and wrong here (cr: Aimin). They're both like standing right on it, and it's obvious then, that each oversteps it time and again.

As for Dushyant - because I never watched the show in his real bad days - I never seem to be able to grudge him, really. But Gulaal's civility to him just gets to me, however hard it may have been to come by in days past. Because I can't help keep comparing it with her unrelenting attitude towards Kesar. It's obvious to a blind man she cares - but the CVs have worked up this peak of tension by not showing one actual scene of her admittance. Not in her own thoughts, far less in words to anyone else! We're just holding onto a thin string of strong belief - that the concern exists, because it defines Gulaal.

Oh well - the debate is like a black hole - isn't it?! 😆

Edited by JZephyr - 14 years ago

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without-fathom

@without-fathom

Rocker

Posted: 14 years ago

#85

Wohoo Amm!!! Here you are, at longest last!

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ansuya12

@ansuya12

Explorer

Posted: 14 years ago

#86

I am responding to the general gist of discussions on this thread and more specifically JZephyr and MeySimi's posts... BTW JZephyr, I am a fellow hyper caffienated soul...

- my return to viewing this serial after taking a break during the school play episodes was specifically because of the Kesar Gulaal chemistry - this truly was an absoultely well done set of scenes - to me the imli scene was simply a beautiful prtrayal of romance. The 30 seconds of KG eyelock-fluster-lookaway-bold eyelock-fluster -lookaway at the end of Gulaal's sprint in the mango grove was one of the best portrayal of chemistry -it was not sweet, cute or pretty, just very human. I agree with MeySimi's observations on specific scenes- and add when Kesar returned after 10 years, the way Gulaal reacted to him was like a lover both when she first saw him and then again in Kesar's room when he asked if she specifically had missed him.

- But the change in Gulaal's behaviour and her total inability to understand Kesar has me frustrated. I get that she is scared - Kesar in love has become her bogeyman. But I never really understood why she kept pushing for the K-T marriage even when she came to know of Kesar's intentions. A woman who was bold enough to do a deeyarvattu with a minor could not call him out in public? What indeed if Kesar had been involved with a girl in Bhuj? Then what good would her promise to Talli-Sudha have been? Why push Talli into a loveless trap? Waht happened to Gulaal's sense of principles and compassion and vasanth ka sapna? or has that always been negotiable?

- Like Jzephyr, I too would like Gulaal to unpack her emotions and start understanding Kesar, talking to him and THEN falling in love with him - i.e., letting love take its own course...as a viewer, I unashamedly want more Kesar-Gulaal scenes, they are so very good. I want some lighter scenes and some joy...however what has me a bit concerned is the inordinate amount of time being given to the charecter Talli. Though it is portrayed well by a newbie actress, there are plenty of really strong artists in the rest of the cast who do not get the same amount of face time...sometimes the screen time is disproportionate as comapred to even the main protagonists and we can only wonder at why that is...Oh and I still cannot get that bizarre nighttime dance of hers out of my head (I simply cannot forgive or trust the CVs for having subjected us to that🤢)...

- The other concern I have is that there are rumours of the serial ending soon - and gradually unpacking the K-G scenario simply might not get enough time - that needs subtelety. The gradually missing actors from the cast also makes me think that there is something not quite right on the sets...Since I would rather have a KG ending than a even more lame Talli-K ending, I am fine even if Gulaal has to have the "my knight in shining armour" + "my only hope and saviour" moment of realization with Kesar (if and when he defends her).

- JZephyr, you are absolutely right - it was easier to emapthize with Kesar because his letters and flashbacks helped to portray and convey his turmoil. In Gulaal's case - she is the sphinx. The only conclusion I come to time and time agian is that she is in love with Talli!!

- Gulaal has a lot of flaws but she is deified by the two families and only when they see her flaws will she need a real friend and a companion - am not sure that Vasanth's photgraph can help...BTW why has Vansanth's photgraph changed from a smiling benevolent expression to a shocked/surprised/worried one?

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aimin

@aimin

Explorer

Posted: 14 years ago

#87

Originally posted by: JZephyr

Okay, to start with - I don't think the question ever was whether Gulaal loves Kesar or not. That has never been the question, never can be.

The question at this point would be more like - why is it wrong for her to love Kesar? [ps: I'm not referring to vice versa situation, of why it is wrong for Kesar to love Gulaal - because that is Kesar's side, and we're getting inside Gulaal's head atm]

Again the question never was whether Gulaal was justified in doing the deeyarvattu or not? Yes, it was the question once upon a long time ago, but no longer.

Point!

I was leaving (yes, really >_>) but caught your last post & had to underline, bold & emphasise those points in particular!

Toodles then. ^^

EDIT: Thank you! 😆

P.S. Dulli FTW?! 😆

Edited by aimin - 14 years ago

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without-fathom

@without-fathom

Rocker

Posted: 14 years ago

#88

Can I start off with how much this post made me laugh - and I should accordingly thank you for the same - because we need some on this thread ... I wanted to go dig out Srush from her KRML hiding hole to give us some happy liners - but you made up entirely! 😆

I also want to add, as a pre-note, that I'm not thinking about the show ending atm. I know there's talk of it all over the place - but very successfully (like Gulaal) I've managed to shut out what I don't like to hear from my head - until I absolutely must come around and face it... so, all my rambles are irrespective of that alleged fact atm.

Originally posted by: trifolia
I am responding to the general gist of discussions on this thread and more specifically JZephyr and MeySimi's posts... BTW JZephyr, I am a fellow hyper caffienated soul...*high fives*

- my return to viewing this serial after taking a break during the school play episodes was specifically because of the Kesar Gulaal chemistry - this truly was an absoultely well done set of scenes - to me the imli scene was simply a beautiful prtrayal of romance. The 30 seconds of KG eyelock-fluster-lookaway-bold eyelock-fluster -lookaway at the end of Gulaal's sprint in the mango grove was one of the best portrayal of chemistry -it was not sweet, cute or pretty, just very human. I agree with MeySimi's observations on specific scenes- and add when Kesar returned after 10 years, the way Gulaal reacted to him was like a lover both when she first saw him and then again in Kesar's room when he asked if she specifically had missed him. - yup, like I said, I personally have never questioned Gulaal's love for Kesar - only its means, its nature/kind, and its reveal/conceal games. And most importantly, why is ought to be questioned at all.

- But the change in Gulaal's behaviour and her total inability to understand Kesar has me frustrated. I get that she is scared - Kesar in love has become her bogeyman. 👏 👏 👏 I'm officially going to quote you on that one, somewhere, sometime! He's freaking her out - he has been, from the moment he pulled off his first coin toss! But I never really understood why she kept pushing for the K-T marriage even when she came to know of Kesar's intentions. A woman who was bold enough to do a deeyarvattu with a minor could not call him out in public? What indeed if Kesar had been involved with a girl in Bhuj? Then what good would her promise to Talli-Sudha have been? Why push Talli into a loveless trap? Waht happened to Gulaal's sense of principles and compassion and vasanth ka sapna? or has that always been negotiable? - some excellent questions raised. In the face of the challenge Kesar as a person is posing, and his impossible ways, Gulaal sure has lost track of what she put herself to a decade ago. Ironic it is, how she stepped into Vasant's shoes with her deeyarvattu, and now has cast them away in the face of that same deeyarvattu.

- Like Jzephyr, I too would like Gulaal to unpack her emotions and start understanding Kesar, talking to him and THEN falling in love with him - i.e., letting love take its own course...as a viewer, I unashamedly want more Kesar-Gulaal scenes, they are so very good. I want some lighter scenes and some joy...however what has me a bit concerned is the inordinate amount of time being given to the charecter Talli. Though it is portrayed well by a newbie actress, there are plenty of really strong artists in the rest of the cast who do not get the same amount of face time...sometimes the screen time is disproportionate as comapred to even the main protagonists and we can only wonder at why that is...Oh and I still cannot get that bizarre nighttime dance of hers out of my head (I simply cannot forgive or trust the CVs for having subjected us to that🤢)... 😆😆😆 - Sorry, to laugh at your disgust, but you had it coming! You're right, I'm not a Talli hater - I'm just (like I said yesterday) wary of being at the mercy of cupids like Sudha, JK and Talli. Heck I'm not even all out support on the knight-damsel scenario! I truly want some humans come around to their follies kind of brilliance - but I suppose I can still settle for damsel in distress scenario, if nothing else.

- The other concern I have is that there are rumours of the serial ending soon - and gradually unpacking the K-G scenario simply might not get enough time - that needs subtelety. The gradually missing actors from the cast also makes me think that there is something not quite right on the sets...Since I would rather have a KG ending than a even more lame Talli-K ending, I am fine even if Gulaal has to have the "my knight in shining armour" + "my only hope and saviour" moment of realization with Kesar (if and when he defends her).

- JZephyr, you are absolutely right - it was easier to emapthize with Kesar because his letters and flashbacks helped to portray and convey his turmoil. In Gulaal's case - she is the sphinx. The only conclusion I come to time and time agian is that she is in love with Talli!! 🤣 Again, if you were trying to distress me, it counter worked !!! But just for the record, I'm still team DULLI!

- Gulaal has a lot of flaws but she is deified by the two families and only when they see her flaws will she need a real friend and a companion - am not sure that Vasanth's photgraph can help...BTW why has Vansanth's photgraph changed from a smiling benevolent expression to a shocked/surprised/worried one? 😳 Oh wow. I genuinely thought my eyes had played a game, bu I was too drawn into the GK whirlpool to go back cross check. But if that is so, whoa the signs!

Edited by JZephyr - 14 years ago

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surithy

@surithy

Inactive

Posted: 14 years ago

#89

Gnaga- You have no company? Didn't you see me banging my head on the wall after reading your post? Had I read your post before my long boring post, I would have just saved myself from embarrassment. Loved it and agree to it too.

Aimin-Why didn't you post so far? You make a lot of sense; you have beautifully put all perspective. You are so right about the fin line-that is why this show is meant to be seen in character's pov rather than right/wrong.

You are right about Suda-because she was so confident that Gulaal won't return. On the other hand for whom she is doing all this ironically she is hurting her even more. Also she is one woman who should be happy that her daughter is saved from loveless marriage. May be all yet to be seen.

Again agree with sin concept, it is not that Kesar she is fighting with but she is fighting within herself. That is exactly why she needs to see things beyond her Vasanth shell. She needs to be healed and give herself permission to move on.

You have beautifully said about the patti scene-can't agree more.

Gulaal being civil with D-I guess she doesn't have any attachment nor expectation from D-where Kesar she does. You invest your emotions where or whom you give importance to.

Jzee- Thank you for convincing aimin, one great asset to this forum.

Yes it was her decision and she had warnings beforehand as well.

You are spot on her cold version is in fact it is her her protective shield. She will try and hold on to every possible way of defence to back off from the situation. She can't win over him by having a chat with him.

Don't you see her slowly coming out of her denial world? I mean she is facing the reality of being Kesar's wife, not accepting it yet though. Her words nowadays are giving in like it is my way, I need to rediscover myself all over again and a lot in recent episodes.

Can you guys do same biopsy of Kesar?

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Ganga

@Avatarana09

Dazzler

Posted: 14 years ago

#90

Arre JZee,

I have no doubts about her love for him. She does in her own way. Since the CVs have not shown any official signs of that feelings of love (wifely) from her end like they did with Kesar, i am trying to figure out since when she has had feelings towards Kesar.

Thanks Surithy, that comes with a warning.

Guys meanwhile do catch a glimpse of the SBS segment on Neil and Manasi. Its posted in the forum.

About Srusti, I PMed her, she has gone into her burrow with a promise to return in few mniutes. That was an hour ago.

Thanks Trifolia, Lennie, Aimin, Surithy and of course JZee for some worthwhile discussions.

Edited by MeySimi - 14 years ago