Exploitation of employee or blackmail of employer? (Khobragade case) - Page 31

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_Angie_ thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: K.Universe.



in reality, an at-will employee is entitled to leave his/her job without warning or reason anytime during the employment. Nothing wrong in accepting a contract, evaluating the job and quitting. Doesn't matter a white-collar job or a blue-collar one.

Agreed to the entitlement to quit, but what thereafter? Surely before quitting one would weigh the options. In this case the employee had gained entry through A-3 visa with conditions that the person could not be employed by any other.

In such circumstances what are the options if either the employee or the employer wishes to discontinue the services?

Is the employer still obliged to provide the accommodation, salary, insurance and travel expenses as per their contract or do they become void once the contract is breached?

Does the visa permitting ones stay in the country still hold good after termination of the services?

Is it permitted to stay on and work in the US after expiry of the visa?

_Angie_ thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: krystal_watz



Btw, how exactly did Sangeeta gush about her employer to her sister in India (homely environment, free accomodation-insurance-travel, long hours of watching TV etc. etc ?) when she was being mercilessly crushed all over? Beats me.

Some options-

1. She had felt on top of the world on bagging that job as the initial comparison was with Indian maids. She felt happy enough to convey that to her employers sister, her family, and also her personal diary.

Later on reaching the USA the comparison was with local maids and what earlier had looked like a steal looked like exploitation.

- The pay and working conditions remain the same. Perspective changed.

2. Conspiracy theory- She lied purposely to gain asylum.

Option- a) It was an after thought on reaching the US with or without instigation.

Option b) Planned from the very outset before leaving India.

-Option b makes no sense as in that case sangeeta would have been foolish to leave evidences of her joy at the khobragde camp.

3. Devyani was good to Sangeeta initially but for some reason turned into a monster later on.

Bazigar thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
Fact is those are Devyani's sister statement. When one is accused she or he will bring any kind of witness in defense which media happy to highlight , when media did the biased reporting they are happy to give the picture which they like instead digging for truth.

It depends on us weather we believe on them who use every kind of falsify statement like Devyani, her father , her sister or we should question them. Now choice is on weather we will believe on what Devyani , her family says , Whatever proof (in fact those are statements without backing proper proof )they want to present they should do it in front of court rather than media till than i prefer to believe on the indictment statements rather than their manipulative statements , others may believe on them . At least we can see the picture of other side along with considering Devyani witness .

http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/documents/world/us-v-devyani-khobragade-indictment/739/

All charges and background are mentioned in the above document.


Edited by ramjaane - 11 years ago
K.Universe. thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago
RJ - I liked your perspective on the previous page. A little rough around the edges, but I found myself mostly in agreement with what you said about Sangeeta and Devyani.

Angie - option#1, with one caveat. Unaccounted for work hours.You are free to assume 8 hours a day and I am free to assume 18 hours a day. We will never know the truth.
441597 thumbnail
Posted: 11 years ago
You didn't answer the Employer-employee agreement, K. Why was it wrong for Devyani to take action when it was illegal for Sangeeta to take up employment elsewhere?
_Angie_ thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: K.Universe.



Angie - option#1, with one caveat. Unaccounted for work hours.You are free to assume 8 hours a day and I am free to assume 18 hours a day. We will never know the truth.

I ve been trying to figure out just how much work could one possibly be required to do as a housekeeper /nanny in all those 18 hours on a daily basis!
I admit I have no idea how many times a day Devyani required her house to be cleaned, laundry and cooking done 😆
K.Universe. thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: krystal_watz



You didn't answer the Employer-employee agreement, K. Why was it wrong for Devyani to take action when it was illegal for Sangeeta to take up employment elsewhere?



Sorry, must have missed it.

It was illegal for Sangeeta to work for another employer but not illegal for her to look into other avenues.

For instance, she was free to request an adjustment to visa status.

http://faq.visapro.com/A3-Visa-FAQ3.asp

As far as I understand, she was exploring her options; likely, she didn't have enough information on how to proceed with an adjustment to status, or how to obtain a work visa. I couldn't find verifiable information on how and under what circumstances she got in touch with the authorities over here. Was she applying for work and got caught in the process? Did she approach the authorities herself? I couldn't find anything on that.


K.Universe. thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: _Angie_



I ve been trying to figure out just how much work could one possibly be required to do as a housekeeper /nanny in all those 18 hours on a daily basis!

I admit I have no idea how many times a day Devyani required her house to be cleaned, laundry and cooking done 😆




If it wasn't much work, Devyani could have done it all by herself too. She didn't need a full time nanny on premises.
_Angie_ thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: K.Universe.




If it wasn't much work, Devyani could have done it all by herself too. She didn't need a full time nanny on premises.

As a working mom with two small kids having a full time nanny on premises would have provided the assurance of having someone elder at home to watch over the kids while the parents were away at work. The nanny need not necessarily be required to be engaged in work all that time as being made out. In hindsight it may have been better to have hired a part time local help and keep the kids in a decent neighbourhood crche. Lesson for future diplomats.
CuckooCutter7 thumbnail
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Posted: 11 years ago

Originally posted by: K.Universe.


How about we play a game "spot the generalizations", just for fun?

Clue words used in support of generalizations: all, none, most, many, always, everyone, never, sometimes, some, usually, seldom, few, lot, lots, generally, in general, and overall.

  • Most people in America don't earn that kind of income after decent degrees.
  • I bet a lot of people dont know how to fill out any form properly
  • Most americans are burger flippers, certainly no better.
  • At 4500 dollars a month (exceeding 51K a year), you'd have most of the world wanting to be US nannies.
  • Lots of white collar people have to be at blackberry beck and call all day/ night long
  • There are a zillion laws that the feds can find most citizens breaking if they go after someone with all their resources
  • Richards was getting a better deal than most of the world gets, and that goes for the average american Joe and Jill too, a lot of whom live on govt handouts.
  • A lot of people would be better off being full-time nannies even at sangeeta richards' pay
  • Indian courts might be notorious in that conviction rates are low and the wheels grind slowly. The positive is they generally do not wrongfully convict people.
  • We (Indians) follow a hybrid that takes the best of english and american legal systems
  • Indian judges have higher IQ than the dumb secretaries and nannies flooding american juries
  • But trust americans to demonize people they want to go after. In fact, people are paid in the US to zealously go after people.
  • Most people who have ever applied for a student visa to the US have been less than totally honest about their intentions.
  • Most intend to settle in the US; yet most everyone state they will return back to India after studies.
  • Given the nonsense American diplomats indulge in world-wide, one would have expected better sense of reciprocity and understanding on their part.
  • (American instruction manuals) criminalize trivia and put millions of americans into jails year in year out (yet their crime stats keep going up)
  • American employers regularly "thwart" the designs of employees that leave using no-compete and other clauses
  • Thwarting and pressure tactics, in fact downright lying, it's the american way.
  • Most (Indians) return (from US) only when they can find no jobs, else they stay back


hey this is so heartwarming, your attempts to extract the pearls of wisdom above. But really, one should start simple before getting to the high IQ stuff. With that in mind, can you now say banana?😆

Coming back to topic, even your latest quip about devyani not needing a maid unless she made the maid work hard is absurd. Things don't have to be one extreme or the other. For all we know, the actual labor might have been just a couple of hours, with the other hours being light. We do not really know. Also, having a live-in maid can be mutually beneficial. It saves costs both ways (housing/, food, utility bills, transport etc for the maid), and is often more practical. It does not have to be about making the maid work long hours just because she lives in... Culturally too, i can see where devyani was coming from. Servants in India often live in the same premise, and it gives them a roof over their heads... Its not hard to see why devyani would have done the same with this maid.

you also did not have any reasonable answer as to why devyani should not have filed a report when the maid went missing. Devyani could have gotten into more legal trouble if she had not... So how about you try to fix at least some of the many holes you've been running in all your arguments? I can always teach the advanced stuff later😆

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