Mahabharat Analysis and Debate

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461339

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Posted: 15 years ago

#61

Originally posted by: Mister.K.

What's up with those barbaric people back then and them sacrificing goats and horses? Jesus H Christ!!!!

There's an interesting account in the Mahabharata of a guy called King Rantideva, and some of the daily activities that took place in his palace. Below is an excerpt from the text.

And in days of yore, O Brahmana, two thousand animals used to be killed every day in the kitchen of king Rantideva; and in the same manner two thousand cows were killed every day; and, O best of regenerate beings, king Rantideva acquired unrivalled reputation by distributing food with meat every day. For the performance of the fourmonthly rites animals ought to be sacrificed daily. 'The sacred fire is fond of animal food,' this saying has come down to us. And at sacrifices animals are invariably killed by regenerate Brahmanas, and these animals being purged of sin, by incantation of hymns, go to heaven. If, O Brahmana, the sacred fire had not been so fond of animal food in ancient times, it could never have become the food of any one. And in this matter of animal food, this rule has been laid down by Munis:--Whoever partakes of animal food after having first offered it duly and respectfully to the gods and the manes, is not polluted by the act. And such a man is not at all considered to have partaken of animal food, even, as a Brahmacharin having intercoursed with his wife during the menstrual period, is nevertheless considered to be a good Brahmana.

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MagadhSundari

@MagadhSundari

Sparkler

+ 4

Posted: 15 years ago

#62

Sorry for being late guys, had classes bac to back... but gotta admit reading that I was missed got me feeling like the shizz 😆 j/k... thanks for addressing the prompt, Gauri! I agree, Amba might've gone a bit bonkers in geting as mad at Bhishma as she did because he tried to do the right thing after, but it's the before that makes me head-scratch... in every version I've read, it was forceful as you would think it is when you hear the word "kidnap", not some friendly "wanna ride with me"... so, I don't know if that's justifiable. I don't have the hard copy now but when I get home this weekend, I'll check... I use the one published by the Ramakrishna Math btw... but if I remember correctly, Satyavati asked Bhishma to propose the marriage legitimately to smooth over the rocky relationship between Kashi and Hastinapur... it got laughed off, so Bhishma's motive can be inferred as vengeance... and IMO, that should be carried out against the king - not the girls.

And as far as the Shakuni-and-the-goat story, I combed through this and can't find it anywhere: http://www.mahabharataonline.com/ Not much on his motives or even the timeframe for when he permanently moved to Hastinapur is in the "official" texts, as far as I remember... the angle BRC took was the one I tried to reflect in the prompt, that Shakuni thought it was condescending of Bhishma to think of pairing his sister up with a blind man, hence Gufi Paintal's perfect grudgy grunt everytime he said "Pitamah Bhishma... 😈" But, if anybody could find some other texts that might fill in the blanks on his character other than the goat story, I'd really appreciate it... Goat story does help him make sense, but the ritual itself is weird to me so I'd like to see what else is out there.

But thanks Gauri! I came, I read, I liked 😃

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MagadhSundari

@MagadhSundari

Sparkler

+ 4

Posted: 15 years ago

#63

Also, idk if this was mentioned before but the Amba and Co. swayamvar was the same freebie type that Kunti had, no challenge - just the girl's choice. Prehisoric version of The Bachelorette.

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MagadhSundari

@MagadhSundari

Sparkler

+ 4

Posted: 15 years ago

#64

Originally posted by: Gauri_3

Was Gandhari forced to marry Dhritrashtra? Wasn't the proposal accepted by her parents?

Not by her dad, but by her - so her dad just went along with it. He was refusing Bhishma initially but then she said it's a yes from me! and he's like, but he's BLIND! and she goes, great, so when I'm old and grey he'll still love me the same way! bonus! and the rest is history.

I need to know what happened there for me to sucessfully defend Bheeshm Pitameh - one of my absolute favorite character from MB thanks to Mukesh Khanna who played the role.
Yeps I love him too - both the actor and the character. I esp love the scene when he tells his dad that his pratigya is indeed politically responsible because his dad was not being a good king while he was pining for Satyavati - it was a really nice logical way to justify and modernize a kind of selfless act that otherwise seems so... yesterday 😳 So, anyways, just wanted to clarify that I put the prompt out there for fun, no personal issues with Pitamah.

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200467

Suspended

Posted: 15 years ago

#65

Shakuni's goat story is on wiki. Here's the link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shakuni

I am getting conflicting versions on the trio's swyamwars. Some claim there was a test thrown in and that after Bheeshm aced it and made his intentions known --- that it's not him marrying the A's, some Kings opposed, Bheeshm fought with them and won fair and square and the girls then went with him willingly.

However, what bothers me is that why Amba not utter a single word when Shalve was fighting with Bheeshm? Why wait till she reaches Hastinapur? Will have to do more research on it. But if a task was set up to win the princesses and Bheeshm won them fair and square then he can't be blamed.

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200467

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Posted: 15 years ago

#66

Originally posted by: lola610

Not by her dad, but by her - so her dad just went along with it. He was refusing Bhishma initially but then she said it's a yes from me! and he's like, but he's BLIND! and she goes, great, so when I'm old and grey he'll still love me the same way! bonus! and the rest is history.

If that's the case and if the goat story is not there in Vyas' MB, then Shakuni really has no case at all. If goat story is there in Vyas' MB, then it's Dhritrashtra's fault. Bheeshm can't be blamed under either scenarios.

I hear ya when it comes to Bheeshm - the character and the actor both!

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200467

Suspended

Posted: 15 years ago

#67

Originally posted by: lola610
... Goat story does help him make sense, but the ritual itself is weird to me so I'd like to see what else is out there.

Ash married a tree before marrying Abhi😆

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200467

Suspended

Posted: 15 years ago

#68

Gandhari is known to be a smart and righteous woman. She was the only sane voice amongst her kids and hubby. Why did Gandhari not ask Shakuni to leave when she is shown to be averse to him and very well aware of what he was up to?

This question bugs me at times.

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Kal El

@Kal El

Rocker

+ 2

Posted: 15 years ago

#69

Here's a different issue: Draupadi's disrobing. Did it really happen? Here are two articles which investigate this interesting question and argue that the whole incident may have been a later addition to the text.

Was Draupadi ever disrobed?
by Pradip Bhattacharya

Was Draupadi Disrobed
in the Dice Hall of Hastinapura? - Satya Chaitanya

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461339

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Posted: 15 years ago

#70

Originally posted by: lola610

Actually this is incorrect, Gandhari's father initially did hesitate on the proposal, but then considering the lineage and fame of the Kurus, he consented. There is also no mention of Sakuni objecting to the marriage, he happily gave her hand to Dhritarashtra.

Here's the relevant excerpt.

"Vaisampayana continued, 'Soon after Bhishma heard from the Brahmanas that Gandhari, the amiable daughter of Suvala, having worshipped Hara (Siva) had obtained from the deity the boon that she should have a century of sons. Bhishma, the grandfather of the Kurus, having heard this, sent messengers unto the king of Gandhara. King Suvala at first hesitated on account of the blindness of the bridegroom, but taking into consideration the blood of the Kurus, their fame and behaviour, he gave his virtuous daughter unto Dhritarashtra and the chaste Gandhari hearing that Dhritarashtra was blind and that her parents had consented to marry her to him, from love and respect for her future husband, blindfolded her own eyes. Sakuni, the son of Suvala, bringing unto the Kurus his sister endued with youth and beauty, formally gave her away unto Dhritarashtra. And Gandhari was received with great respect and the nuptials were celebrated with great pomp under Bhishma's directions. And the heroic Sakuni, after having bestowed his sister along with many valuable robes, and having received Bhishma's adorations, returned to his own city. And, O thou of Bharata's race, the beautiful Gandhari gratified all the Kurus by her behaviour and respectful attentions. And Gandhari, ever devoted to her husband, gratified her superiors by her good conduct; and as she was chaste, she never referred even by words to men other than her husband or such superiors.'" - Mahabharata, Adi Parva, CX

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