Vicky: Khilji & Aurangzeb very different, Ranveer inspires me

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Posted: 6 years ago
#1
19 April 2019

Making Sense of Aurangzeb

Vicky Kaushal
Rajeev Masand is entertainment editor at CNN News18

Man of the moment Vicky Kaushal doesn't sweat the small stuff, but the Uri star admits he's "a little bit terrified as he gets ready to play despotic Mughal emperor Aurangzeb in Karan Johar's historical Takht. "It's not the look and the voice and the physicality that scares me... we'll achieve that. What scares me is getting into his head, not judging him, and coming to terms with his ideologies and his actions in a way that I am able to see them as justified, he explains. "I have to get to a place where his cruel choices make sense to me.

In response to the obvious questionthat parallels will be drawn between his performance as Aurangzeb, and Ranveer Singh's celebrated portrayal of Alauddin Khilji in Padmaavat(2018), another pitch-black characterVicky says he's not intimidated or threatened. "I really enjoyed what Ranveer did with that role. It inspires me, it doesn't cripple me. I've read the script of Takht, and while on the surface both men seem similar because they're the embodiment of absolute evil, I can safely tell you they're very different characters.

Ironically Vicky's co-star in Takht is Ranveer himself, who plays Dara Shikoh, the good brother' to Vicky's evil sibling Aurangzeb.

Edited by mystic786 - 6 years ago

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Posted: 6 years ago
#2
On paper
Aurangzeb-Khilji
Dhara Shikoh- Raja Ratan Singh...

Many ,including me ,have complained how a more stronger Ratan would've made Padmaavat more interesting... Now here is our second chance to see the good guy to be equally strong without becoming bad and that being good doesn't mean one has to be an idealistic fool! But here also as per history Dhara does get brutally killed by Aurangzeb after he was returning from winning the war and hence winning the Takht(as per the Mughal rule those days)
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Posted: 6 years ago
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No, Dara didn't win the war Aurangzeb did even though Dara had a much bigger army. Dara fled from the battlefield.

Aurangzeb was an excellent military general, Dara was very inexperienced when it came to warfare. He was always kept close to Shah Jahan and sent his deputies to govern provinces.

Also, killing brothers to ascend the throne was a norm in the Mughal Empire (since most of them were half brothers). The succession rules were not as simple as "the eldest son became emperor", a war of succession took place and whoever emerged victorius, became emperor.
Jahangir, Shah Jahan, Bahadur Shah, etc. all had their half brothers executed.

Originally posted by: cricketfan1

On paper

Aurangzeb-Khilji
Dhara Shikoh- Raja Ratan Singh...

Many ,including me ,have complained how a more stronger Ratan would've made Padmaavat more interesting... Now here is our second chance to see the good guy to be equally strong without becoming bad and that being good doesn't mean one has to be an idealistic fool! But here also as per history Dhara does get brutally killed by Aurangzeb after he was returning from winning the war and hence winning the Takht(as per the Mughal rule those days)

Edited by mystic786 - 6 years ago
576281 thumbnail
Posted: 6 years ago
#4

Originally posted by: mystic786

No, Dara didn't win the war Aurangzeb did even though Dara had a much bigger army. Dara fled from the battlefield.

Aurangzeb was an excellent military general, Dara was very inexperienced when it came to warfare. He was always kept close to Shah Jahan and sent his deputies to govern provinces.



Ummm..I remember it as Dara being the more able one but Aurangzeb taking it away from him with deceit...😕
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Posted: 6 years ago
#5

Aurangzeb vs Dara Shukoh: A never-ending war of wrong perceptions

February 26, 2017, 10:00 AM IST Manimugdha S Sharmain Parthian Shot | India | TOI

May 1633, Agra. A grand spectacle organised by the Mughal emperor on the banks of the Yamuna turned into a near disaster when a war elephant charged at a 14-year-old Mughal prince. The boy held firm, reined in his agitated steed, and thrust the spear in its head, showing that he was made of rare mettle.

Twenty-five years later, the prince, now a 39-year-old veteran of many battles, took the field east of Agra at the head of a 40,000-strong army. Facing him was a larger host, commanded by his eldest brother. As the day drew to a close, the brother fled the battlefield, leaving behind the better man standing. Aurangzeb had trumped Dara Shukoh in the contest for the throne of Hindustan.

But 350 years later, those two brothers are still fighting in the Indian imagination, reduced to a new good Muslim-bad Muslim narrative. The government clearly believes this too, as evident in the erasing of Aurangzeb's name from a Delhi road, and the recent naming of another road after Dara. In this post-truth age, has Dara won the war, aided by the government? Not if history has a say.

Dara's image is that of a secular, liberal prince who loved Hinduism and Hindus, who might have avoided the beginnings of communal divide that eventually led to the partitioning of the Indian subcontinent. Aurangzeb, by contrast, is presented as a bigoted, puritanical Islamist who hated Hindus and therefore took the Mughal Empire to its doom, paving the way for the British conquest of India. Both these images are far from the truth.

Mughal painting depicting a young Aurangzeb fighting a war elephant in 1633.

"Dara Shukoh was never secular, but he was engaged in a series of intellectual projects that we might well describe in modern terms as liberal. For example, he translated Sanskrit texts into Persian, including some of the Upanishads, and he wrote a treatise about the unity of Hindu and Muslim thought. Other scholars have written about the limits of Dara's vision, such as how he preferred one Sufi lineage and thereby alienated other Sufi orders, says historian Audrey Truschke.

Her latest book, Aurangzeb: The Man and the Myth, was released in India recently. "In my view, Dara would likely have been a disappointing emperor. His military skills were slim to non-existent, for example, says Truschke.

Historian Ali Nadeem Rezavi agrees. "Dara had no practical experience. As a governor, administered his provinces through deputies. In case of any issues, Shah Jahan would solve them. When action was needed, Dara was translating the Upanishads! He was a theoretician who was not taken seriously by anyone, he says.

Dara's intellectual projects, namely the Majma ul-Bahrain and Sirr-i-Akbar (a translation of the Upanishads), reveal his fertile mindsome would say fertile imagination. Historian Munis Faruqui believes that Dara's commentary on the Sirr-i-Akbar shows that he treated the Upanishads as an Islamic scripture, denying their independent existence outside an Islamic theological framework. He also deduces that in Dara's view, "conversion to Islam seems to be the only logical and rational choice for certain communities of Hindus. As Faruqui sums up in a lecture, "these are hardly the hallmarks of an apostle of Hindu-Muslim understanding.

In fact, they were actively problematic views. Many Hindus of that time were quite skeptical of the work and were "terrified by the implied suggestion that Hindus were originally Muslims the mirror image of today's Hindu nationalists claiming that all Indian Muslims were originally Hindus. Mirza Raja Jai Singh, the premier noble of Shah Jahan, thought Dara was "dabbling with subjects he didn't quite understand.

Islamic scholars, too, questioned Dara's understanding of the Quran. "But Dara was rude and haughty. He antagonised senior nobles like Mirza Raja Jai Singh whom he called a Dakhani bandar' (Deccani monkey), says Rezavi. He also antagonised the ulema by calling them ignorant fools, even heretics, Faruqui says. And ironically enough, Dara was ultimately executed on the charge of heresy.

Aurangzeb, meanwhile, was the polar opposite of Dara. He had his first brush with war when he was 16, and spent his entire princely career leading military campaigns and governing difficult provinces. This experience helped him nurture relationships, even with those who didn't agree with him. Those whom Dara antagonised had no trouble supporting Aurangzeb during the War of Succession. "Aurangzeb won due to the support of the Hindus and Rajputs. Mirza Raja Jai Singh, Jaswant Singh, Raghu Ram, Rana Raj Singh, Rao Dalpat Bundelaall helped him, Rezavi says.

Aurangzeb proved to be a good king, too, says Truschke. "In many ways, Aurangzeb conformed to the general expectations of Mughal sovereignty. He kept the empire united, put down rebellions without mercy, expanded borders, and supported state patronage of various sorts, she says.

Much of the historical opinion about Aurangzeb hangs on how far he was responsible for the splintering and decline of the Mughal empire. In Truschke's view, there isn't enough research to make that judgement yet.

But is it possible ever to reach a middle ground where Aurangzeb isn't reviled and Dara not overrated? "I certainly hope so. I also hope that the middle ground is not merely lukewarm feelings about both Dara Shukoh and Aurangzeb but rather substantive historical information about each one, says Truschke.


Originally posted by: cricketfan1


Ummm..I remember it as Dara being the more able one but Aurangzeb taking it away from him with deceit... 😕

Edited by mystic786 - 6 years ago
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Posted: 6 years ago
#6
I honestly have no expectations from this film. Just falling in line with whatever ranveer does.
TeenRose1 thumbnail
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Posted: 6 years ago
#7
So it is indeed terifying to play negative. Someone needs to show this to Akhsay acc. to him it is nothing terrible about playing negative or serious role and also that actors who claim it are lying to show off or whatever. So is Vicky doing the same? Everyone expresses but it is only for Ranveer to brag right?
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Posted: 6 years ago
#8

Originally posted by: mystic786

No, Dara didn't win the war Aurangzeb did even though Dara had a much bigger army. Dara fled from the battlefield.

Aurangzeb was an excellent military general, Dara was very inexperienced when it came to warfare. He was always kept close to Shah Jahan and sent his deputies to govern provinces.

Also, killing brothers to ascend the throne was a norm in the Mughal Empire (since most of them were half brothers). The succession rules were not as simple as "the eldest son became emperor", a war of succession took place and whoever emerged victorius, became emperor.
Jahangir, Shah Jahan, Bahadur Shah, etc. all had their half brothers executed.


Aurangaeb won it by playing wicked. He is negative not bcos of his bravery, he is actually pretty lame character who is nothing but greedy and pure evil. No he is not a powerful intelligent warrior like Khilji, Alexander. Don't even compare them. I rem my father said how he is such a disgust to mughal family.
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Posted: 6 years ago
#9

Originally posted by: mystic786

Aurangzeb vs Dara Shukoh: A never-ending war of wrong perceptions

February 26, 2017, 10:00 AM IST Manimugdha S Sharmain Parthian Shot | India | TOI

May 1633, Agra. A grand spectacle organised by the Mughal emperor on the banks of the Yamuna turned into a near disaster when a war elephant charged at a 14-year-old Mughal prince. The boy held firm, reined in his agitated steed, and thrust the spear in its head, showing that he was made of rare mettle.

Twenty-five years later, the prince, now a 39-year-old veteran of many battles, took the field east of Agra at the head of a 40,000-strong army. Facing him was a larger host, commanded by his eldest brother. As the day drew to a close, the brother fled the battlefield, leaving behind the better man standing. Aurangzeb had trumped Dara Shukoh in the contest for the throne of Hindustan.

But 350 years later, those two brothers are still fighting in the Indian imagination, reduced to a new good Muslim-bad Muslim narrative. The government clearly believes this too, as evident in the erasing of Aurangzeb's name from a Delhi road, and the recent naming of another road after Dara. In this post-truth age, has Dara won the war, aided by the government? Not if history has a say.

Dara's image is that of a secular, liberal prince who loved Hinduism and Hindus, who might have avoided the beginnings of communal divide that eventually led to the partitioning of the Indian subcontinent. Aurangzeb, by contrast, is presented as a bigoted, puritanical Islamist who hated Hindus and therefore took the Mughal Empire to its doom, paving the way for the British conquest of India. Both these images are far from the truth.

Mughal painting depicting a young Aurangzeb fighting a war elephant in 1633.

"Dara Shukoh was never secular, but he was engaged in a series of intellectual projects that we might well describe in modern terms as liberal. For example, he translated Sanskrit texts into Persian, including some of the Upanishads, and he wrote a treatise about the unity of Hindu and Muslim thought. Other scholars have written about the limits of Dara's vision, such as how he preferred one Sufi lineage and thereby alienated other Sufi orders, says historian Audrey Truschke.

Her latest book, Aurangzeb: The Man and the Myth, was released in India recently. "In my view, Dara would likely have been a disappointing emperor. His military skills were slim to non-existent, for example, says Truschke.

Historian Ali Nadeem Rezavi agrees. "Dara had no practical experience. As a governor, administered his provinces through deputies. In case of any issues, Shah Jahan would solve them. When action was needed, Dara was translating the Upanishads! He was a theoretician who was not taken seriously by anyone, he says.

Dara's intellectual projects, namely the Majma ul-Bahrain and Sirr-i-Akbar (a translation of the Upanishads), reveal his fertile mindsome would say fertile imagination. Historian Munis Faruqui believes that Dara's commentary on the Sirr-i-Akbar shows that he treated the Upanishads as an Islamic scripture, denying their independent existence outside an Islamic theological framework. He also deduces that in Dara's view, "conversion to Islam seems to be the only logical and rational choice for certain communities of Hindus. As Faruqui sums up in a lecture, "these are hardly the hallmarks of an apostle of Hindu-Muslim understanding.

In fact, they were actively problematic views. Many Hindus of that time were quite skeptical of the work and were "terrified by the implied suggestion that Hindus were originally Muslims the mirror image of today's Hindu nationalists claiming that all Indian Muslims were originally Hindus. Mirza Raja Jai Singh, the premier noble of Shah Jahan, thought Dara was "dabbling with subjects he didn't quite understand.

Islamic scholars, too, questioned Dara's understanding of the Quran. "But Dara was rude and haughty. He antagonised senior nobles like Mirza Raja Jai Singh whom he called a Dakhani bandar' (Deccani monkey), says Rezavi. He also antagonised the ulema by calling them ignorant fools, even heretics, Faruqui says. And ironically enough, Dara was ultimately executed on the charge of heresy.

Aurangzeb, meanwhile, was the polar opposite of Dara. He had his first brush with war when he was 16, and spent his entire princely career leading military campaigns and governing difficult provinces. This experience helped him nurture relationships, even with those who didn't agree with him. Those whom Dara antagonised had no trouble supporting Aurangzeb during the War of Succession. "Aurangzeb won due to the support of the Hindus and Rajputs. Mirza Raja Jai Singh, Jaswant Singh, Raghu Ram, Rana Raj Singh, Rao Dalpat Bundelaall helped him, Rezavi says.

Aurangzeb proved to be a good king, too, says Truschke. "In many ways, Aurangzeb conformed to the general expectations of Mughal sovereignty. He kept the empire united, put down rebellions without mercy, expanded borders, and supported state patronage of various sorts, she says.

Much of the historical opinion about Aurangzeb hangs on how far he was responsible for the splintering and decline of the Mughal empire. In Truschke's view, there isn't enough research to make that judgement yet.

But is it possible ever to reach a middle ground where Aurangzeb isn't reviled and Dara not overrated? "I certainly hope so. I also hope that the middle ground is not merely lukewarm feelings about both Dara Shukoh and Aurangzeb but rather substantive historical information about each one, says Truschke.



Dara isnt able i agree but Aurangazeb is a bad one who not just tortured his family but people which is the most imp. thing. I believe Dara might not be great at wars which i dont agree acc to the sources i read and belive it is just tht he prioritized his feelings over the unnecessary wars. He was a good hearted and kind person from what little i read about him and felt, that is more imp. a good heart kind king like Rama wud have been the better king to the people who look after them like his children compared to a bad greedy evil king. You need to dig even more deeper to know him. Strategies are needed but only during war mostly. He wud have implemented them when needed for people's benefit. He is not dumb. He is idealist and intuitive.
mystic786 thumbnail
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Posted: 6 years ago
#10
Lol what??? 😆😆 Just because you hate Aurangzeb doesn't mean you can change history.

Also, you know more than these reputed historians? 😆 Whatever I've said is backed by facts, it's not my imagination lol.

Originally posted by: TeenRose1


Dara isnt able i agree but Aurangazeb is a bad one who not just tortured his family but people which is the most imp. thing. I believe Dara might not be great at wars which i dont agree acc to the sources i read and belive it is just tht he prioritized his feelings over the unnecessary wars. He was a good hearted and kind person from what little i read about him and felt, that is more imp. a good heart kind king like Rama wud have been the better king to the people who look after them like his children compared to a bad greedy evil king. You need to dig even more deeper to know him. Strategies are needed but only during war mostly. He wud have implemented them when needed for people's benefit. He is not dumb. He is idealist and intuitive.

Edited by mystic786 - 6 years ago

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