Aligning with one's integrity

tinoo thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#1
I have read a lot of posts here that there is no point if Jagya would have told the truth, because nobody would have believed him... and same with anandi. Even if anandi would have told the truth, nobody would have believed her.
However, I think that one has to align with one's own integrity and tell the truth for the sake of telling the truth.
There was a case in the U.S. recently, where a young man named Ravi Dharun secretly taped his gay roommate Tyler clementii having sex with another man and then put the tapes out on the internet. His roommate was so horrified that he committed suicide.
Ravi Dharun was eventually prosecuted, and after several months of court room drama, several lawyers, witnesses, friends, family all giving testimonies, the judge one day turned to Ravi Dharun and said
"Young man, you know, I have heard from over hundreds of lawyers, friends, acquaintances, family, college administrators, etc. but I have never ever heard you apologize even once. Why is that exactly?"
So Ravi said to the judge "I haven't apologized because it wont make any difference. Tyler is already dead, and he wont come back. And I cant change anyone's mind about me, they all think I am a murderer"
So the judge said, "Young man, an apology is not offered with the intention of changing people's mind about you, nor is it offered with the intention of reversing what has already happened, an apology is offered because YOU have genuine remorse about the situation, and YOU take responsibility for it."
Personally, I really liked this a lot. And I am applying this to Jagya and anandi too.
One has to tell the truth because one has to tell the truth.
One does not tell the truth in order to make others believe them.
One does not avoid telling the truth, because, oh what's the point, nobody will believe them.
Jagya should have gone home and told Bhairon and dadisa the truth, regardless of whether they believed him or not.
He should have gone and told them and given them a chance to get out of the relationship with saanchi diplomatically.
And he should have been clear that if they didn't do something, THEN he will break it off himself.
But the chance should have been given.
Same with anandi, sitting on a bed of lies, one layer piling up after another layer of lies.
These things never work.
We HAVE to do our part, in unpleasant situations, even when we feel nobody else will believe us.
That is called aligning with our integrity. Our integrity should not be dependent on whether others will believe us or not.

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geetmann thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#2
Excellent post. I am 200 % with you on this .Both Jagya and Anandi should have done what is right no matter what is output of the situation. They both acted like coward.
ironwitch thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#3
Agree with each and every word you have written

In this issue I personally think that Jagya's actions were correct and that he and Ganga are definitely NOT manipulative lying blah blah blah's .I support their relationship too

But what you said here , about Jagya going back and telling the truth, about aligning with his integrity , I agree completely. He should have thought this over, gone to Bhairon and STUCK to his guns when Sumi would have made her drama- then proceeded with breaking off the engagement. His one impulsive act, though carried out with good intentions, has now made a lot of people upset

On Anandi I will remain quiet. I don't see any vestiges of the older, brave, heroic Anandi in her. Marriage seems to have changed her completely

I would also like to applaud you for bringing out such a logical, unbiased topic😊
tinoo thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#4
Isnt that the takeaway the new redeemed jagya should have had from his first round of infedility.
?
That time too he told bapusa "main aapko bolta toh bhi aap samajhte nahi"...
But the thing is he should have done his part then too, by telling Bhairon that he is in love with gauri, AND THEN if bapusa didn't listen, he needs to then take a stand for his own love for gauri or whatever else he felt he needed to do.
He repeated the same mistake again which means that he did not learn his lesson, and he is not new or redeemed, just old wine in a new bottle.
GoodDoc_2105 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#5
Tinoo - Nice to see you back here.😊
Aligining with your own integrity is important agreed.

Both Jagya and Anandi are at fault here.

But it is also important that one causes least amount of damage while standing up for truth and what they believe in.

Jagya decided to stand up for what he believed in and acted in a hasty manner which resulted in breaking up of so many relationships all around him.
He saw the truth and he should have taken time to proove that truth to all the people concerned before acting on that.

Anandi too saw it with her own eyes and heard it with her own ears instead of believing it as truth she spent too much time contemplating on it because she was only thinking of all the damage that would cause if it came out.She should have found a way to bring out the truth in front of everybody instead of pondering over it.

Now it all blew up on their faces and the damage is too big.And everybody is trying to deal with damages it has caused instead of dealing with the truth that came up in front of them.

Standing up for what you believe in and speaking out truth are important but while doing so the implications of bringing out the truth also have to be kept in mind.

Ultimately you have to live with your fellow human beings and their feelings also have to be kept in mind.
If Jagya acted in haste Anandi was tardy both are equally responsible for all this.Now only the damage is visble but the root cause of that damage is hidden because of the way the two handled the situation.
ironwitch thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#6

Originally posted by: tinoo

Isnt that the takeaway the new redeemed jagya should have had from his first round of infedility.

?
That time too he told bapusa "main aapko bolta toh bhi aap samajhte nahi"...
But the thing is he should have done his part then too, by telling Bhairon that he is in love with gauri, AND THEN if bapusa didn't listen, he needs to then take a stand for his own love for gauri or whatever else he felt he needed to do.
He repeated the same mistake again which means that he did not learn his lesson, and he is not new or redeemed, just old wine in a new bottle.



I think it's because a person's character doesn't change with circumstances , his outlook does, his perspective does.
Jagya always acts impulsively. It is a part of his nature. But comparing the two situations you have given
Then his outlook and perspective was limited to himself. it was his life, his happiness. Today it extends to encompass a sense of right or wrong. He knows what is right or wrong and he stands up for what he believes is right now, not what he believes is right for himself . Therein lies the difference
So I cannot agree with your statement that he is "old wine in a new bottle". rather I would put it as " new wine in an old bottle". His outlook , thoughts, thinking process has changed but aspects of his nature like impulsiveness hasn't

That being said, I wish he had acted in the way I mentioned above after knowing Sanchi is a twit
tinoo thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#7

Originally posted by: aparnauma

Ultimately you have to live with your fellow human beings and their feelings also have to be kept in mind.

Aparnauma,
I am sure we all tell lies to not hurt feelings, but I think at Anandi's age and at Jagya's age, they must have a sense of discernment as to how serious the matters really are... and if this is something that can stand the test of time. I mean is it a one-shot lie or a long term implications type of lie.
Definitely, if someone is wearing a horrible outfit and asks me how does it look? I will say "great" not to hurt her feelings. But I don't believe that this is a lie of great magnitude. Once again, if the person is going to the shopping center in that hideous outfit, I will not tell the truth. However, if she is going to a job interview which might have implications, I will tell her the truth about the outfit.
We all say lies to avoid conflict, gain approval, not hurt people's feelings... but in the matters anandi and jagya were going through, their staying quiet was not correct.
Thanks for the welcome and good to see you too! 😃
GoodDoc_2105 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#8

Originally posted by: tinoo

Aparnauma,

I am sure we all tell lies to not hurt feelings, but I think at Anandi's age and at Jagya's age, they must have a sense of discernment as to how serious the matters really are... and if this is something that can stand the test of time. I mean is it a one-shot lie or a long term implications type of lie.
Definitely, if someone is wearing a horrible outfit and asks me how does it look? I will say "great" not to hurt her feelings. But I don't believe that this is a lie of great magnitude. Once again, if the person is going to the shopping center in that hideous outfit, I will not tell the truth. However, if she is going to a job interview which might have implications, I will tell her the truth about the outfit.
We all say lies to avoid conflict, gain approval, not hurt people's feelings... but in the matters anandi and jagya were going through, their staying quiet was not correct.
Thanks for the welcome and good to see you too! 😃

They did see how serious the matters are and they knew what the truth was and they knew that they should act on it and ultimately they did speak up.
Jagya acted in a very impulsive manner and it resulted in destruction.
Anandi spoke up only after the damage was done.
So the issue not just about speaking the truth and standing up for it for the sake of one's integrity but also about doing it in such a way that there is least amount of destruction all around.

If Jagya and Anandi sat and planned on how to bring the truth out into open things would have been much better.Everybody would have seen what they saw and they wouldn't be isolated the way they are now.
And people would have been tackling the truth that was presented to them instead of doing damage control.
Anandi and Jagya are like tortoise and hare if they had worked as a team they would have gotten better results.
Standing up for truth is important and how you bring it out is also equally important.
BeyondTheSky thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#9
Great post @tinoo 👍🏼
completely agree with you, even i have read about this case 😊 .

truth has to be told...and at the right time...as soon one realizes that things going wrong...well jagya to a certain extent did that, but he didn't think it was required to take his family into confidence...whats the rush to get married to ganga...& that where i have a big problem with him.

anandii's confusion is always an excuse given for her not telling the truth ..or that she is not responsible for sanchi or jagya...but the fact is she is only one who knows the truth...so her integrity also gets questioned time & again...it is very important that the facts are told at the right time & complete & not half cooked truth told is the TRUTH...only then one can safeguard one's integrity.
Edited by BeyondTheSky - 12 years ago
tinoo thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#10

Originally posted by: BeyondTheSky


anandii's confusion is always an excuse given for her not telling the truth ..or that she is not responsible for sanchi or jagya...but the fact is she is only one who knows the truth...so her integrity also gets questioned time & again...it is very important that the facts are told at the right time & complete & not half cooked truth told is the TRUTH...only then one can safeguard one's integrity.

I believe anandi herself is responsible for the shekhars not believing her. This habit of bringing up half cooked truths after the fact when it does nobody any good and then to say "main aapko batane waali hi thi lekin baat adhuri reh gayi" cannot work time and again and time and again and time and again. once, twice okay. But again and again, naturally it sets up a pattern where shekhars will begin to distrust her.

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