Why can't Indians win Oscars? Is it cuz our movies hv songs? - Page 6

Originally posted by: Mahisa_22

Agree except for the Ray part. His movies were as native from a native gaze as it gets. Not just movies like Apu Trilogy or Ashanti Sanket which deals with village life, but his urban movies deal with very uniquely Bengali and Indian problems and settings. Nowhere can you say that the characters could be from London and Paris, except for maybe a few.

I not saying he was inauthentic, but bengalis in that age were very influenced by the british, they studied their, the convesrations, the inclination to art, literature, refinement, is very much driven by european culture, the reinssance. satyajit ray belonged to this class and depicted them through this lens (even rural). they could easily fit into the culture and the soirees of Paris as in Kolkata. You can see this class depicted in Vikram seth's suitable boy too, paying the piano, dancing in the evening etc.

https://fountainink.in/essay/finding-the-bhadralok

Lots of articles on the bhadralok, satyajit ray is called the last reinssance man

"Independent film maker Judhajit Sarkar, himself from the same class, says bhadralok are not babus as a stereotype. “They resembled the British ‘gentle folk’ and were the first generation of [western] educated Indians. They imitated the manners of the Brits and flowered in the arts and education.

“Rather laid back, they were mostly comfortable in softer jobs. Riddled with contradictions, often termed hypocritical, they were in general good, honest people.” Now, though, they are “practically extinct, or worse still, resemble the other end—the rough, coarse people termed ‘chhoto lok’ (subaltern) by the same segment of folks once known as bhadralok.”

Pehle ek movie yaha toh chalne do oscar baad main.. 😆

There is no originality in story, acting is sub par, screenplay is also not great in most movies and many more reasons why no BW movies get a nomination for Oscars. Even Oscars is loosing what they use to be before.

Don't let me start on what disney is doing to once great franchises like Star Wars, MCU universe with their woke s**t.

Originally posted by: sunflower52

There is no originality in story, acting is sub par, screenplay is also not great in most movies and many more reasons why no BW movies get a nomination for Oscars. Even Oscars is loosing what they use to be before.

Don't let me start on what disney is doing to once great franchises like Star Wars, MCU universe with their woke s**t.

I hate Woke shit 😆

Oscars stopped being fun in 2004/2005

Originally posted by: Maroonporsche

I hate Woke shit 😆

Oscars stopped being fun in 2004/2005

So do I, the way they are representing females and POC's are atrocious. Especially females superhero's, they have no proper origin story, made them to perfect. The only reason I liked male superhero's was because they were flawed individuals and it took them time to become a proper hero, unlike the female one's. This is what Disney/MCU are getting we do not want perfect, flawless females superhero but one who overcomes her flaws to become one.

I have seen that same thing in Indian or Pakistani tv as well, where main females are written as perfect and innocent (stupidity level).

Originally posted by: vcs17

I not saying he was inauthentic, but bengalis in that age were very influenced by the british, they studied their, the convesrations, the inclination to art, literature, refinement, is very much driven by european culture, the reinssance. satyajit ray belonged to this class and depicted them through this lens (even rural). they could easily fit into the culture and the soirees of Paris as in Kolkata. You can see this class depicted in Vikram seth's suitable boy too, paying the piano, dancing in the evening etc.

https://fountainink.in/essay/finding-the-bhadralok

Lots of articles on the bhadralok, satyajit ray is called the last reinssance man

"Independent film maker Judhajit Sarkar, himself from the same class, says bhadralok are not babus as a stereotype. “They resembled the British ‘gentle folk’ and were the first generation of [western] educated Indians. They imitated the manners of the Brits and flowered in the arts and education.

“Rather laid back, they were mostly comfortable in softer jobs. Riddled with contradictions, often termed hypocritical, they were in general good, honest people.” Now, though, they are “practically extinct, or worse still, resemble the other end—the rough, coarse people termed ‘chhoto lok’ (subaltern) by the same segment of folks once known as bhadralok.”

Yes, he was a Renaissance man. But his characters in movies were far from it. His style of filmmaking was inspired by European sensibilities no doubt, but his touch and approach were entirely native. This is because of his empathetic take on the characters' feelings and situations.

His urban movies features very middle-class characters with middle-class values and struggles. None of them were educated elites per se, but rather mundane people, like the average person in every metro who are not from 'posh' areas.

I suggest you watch the Calcutta Trilogy. It'll help to gain a good insight into his treatment of characters.

Originally posted by: Mahisa_22

Yes, he was a Renaissance man. But his characters in movies were far from it. His style of filmmaking was inspired by European sensibilities no doubt, but his touch and approach were entirely native. This is because of his empathetic take on the characters' feelings and situations.

His urban movies features very middle-class characters with middle-class values and struggles. None of them were educated elites per se, but rather mundane people, like the average person in every metro who are not from 'posh' areas.

I suggest you watch the Calcutta Trilogy. It'll help to gain a good insight into his treatment of characters.

My point is this, that there is an european influence in sensibility and style and this is so even when the characters are not posh and this was influenced by his personality and his background

just because his style was that doesnt mean he didnt have empathy or sensitivity, nor am I saying that he did not show mundane people and just the elite

and also his characters were varied from middle class to jalsaghar and shatranj ke khiladi was about about decandent royalty

in kanchenjunga the father is an industrialist and its a wealthy family

i have watched all his movies down the years including calcutta trilogy and his take on corporate culture in those movies is a different discussion altogether

Because western world will award films which show India in poverty and poor light generally

Inspiring films will not be awarded by them

It's okay, impact of an Oscar is not much

There are so many films which won Oscar's but I have no clue what they are

This category is always filled with well made, original and artistic films because of the selection process. It is not willy-nilly name recognition (at least much less than the other categories). The foreign language category is only voted on by people who have seen all the films. There is a preliminary committee that votes after watching every submission (all votes are secret ballot) that produces a short list and then another committee watches every film on the short list and votes and that vote produces the nominees. Then only members who have watched all the nominees are allowed to vote for the final award.

India has this really weird tendency to send films guaranteed to not be nominated. I’m still bitter over the lunch box (which had a great shot) “losing” to a film with so many homages (AKA plagiarisms) that the film didn’t even technically meet the qualifications to be considered for official entry. WTH???

India does produce films that could get nominated (which in money terms is a huge deal) if they selected their entries with the goal of being nominated (or even winning). It must be original. It must be Indian enough to feel foreign but universal enough in some way (and that way can vary) to resonate with non Indians. It must be well-made. It must not be anti-HW sentiment unless extraordinary in every other way. If you don’t care about winning (and apparently the Indian selection committee doesn’t) then they should carry on sending things without a chance - but really why bother sending anything at all in that case?

As for the people asking why Lagaan, Salaam Bombay and Mother India didn’t win, I don’t know but I wouldn’t even try to say they should have without watching the films they lost to (which I haven’t). Who is to say they didn’t win because they weren’t the best film nominated - although the story goes that Mother India lost by only one vote💔

Originally posted by: vcs17

My point is this, that there is an european influence in sensibility and style and this is so even when the characters are not posh and this was influenced by his personality and his background

just because his style was that doesnt mean he didnt have empathy or sensitivity, nor am I saying that he did not show mundane people and just the elite

and also his characters were varied from middle class to jalsaghar and shatranj ke khiladi was about about decandent royalty

in kanchenjunga the father is an industrialist and its a wealthy family

i have watched all his movies down the years including calcutta trilogy and his take on corporate culture in those movies is a different discussion altogether

But none of those characters were "posh people who could be sitting in cafes on Paris". This was my point.