Swara Bhaskar's insensitive remarks on Jauhar scene from Padmavat- Page 7

Originally posted by: Clochette

Nathu, you use a very common rhetorical tactic to defend historical practices: using a universally accepted tradition (the sanctity of cremation) to mask a specific systemic injustice (that only women were expected to burn alive).... You are shifting the goalposts. You want me to focus on how Hindus treat dead bodies, while I was correctly focusing on why living women and children were forced into those fires.

Maybe you ignore how social conditioning works. If a society conditions you from birth to believe that your only value is your purity and your husband, and that surviving him makes you a cursed outcast, you will "choose" the fire. ... Indoctrination is not the same as free will. The fact that victims are brainwashed into accepting their own destruction does not mean the system isn't oppressive.

In my opinion, in the case of Jauhar, the primary fear was not what enemies would do to dead bodies; the fear was that the enemy would capture, enslave, and rape living women. It is the patriarchal view that a woman is better off dead than "soiled" by another man. the fire is the 'logical' consequence of an accepted tradition relative to dead bodies.

While I respect the spiritual importance of cremation in Hindu tradition, equating the treatment of a corpse with the burning of living women and children is a false equivalence, imo. Framing Jauhar purely as protection against necrophilia seems like an excuse to me because this requirement was strictly reserved for women...

I'm not defending anything. I'm trying to explain why they did what they did. There's a difference between the two.

If you think you are correctly focusing on something then you are free to do so. I'm not here to force change your beliefs or viewpoints as some people of 21st century would like to change the beliefs and viewpoints of those from hundreds or thousands of years back.

Maybe you ignore how social acceptance of what is right or wrong, viewpoints, morals and social values change over time. If indoctrination of chastity or patriarchy or male mindset was only responsible for women to perform Jauhar then please explain why the women didn't perform jauhar when Hindu kings defeated other Hindu kings. Why this happened only with Muslim barbarians?

You have already stated your opinion and you are entitled to it. I'm sure i or any other on this forum would have more chances of finding life on Mars then changing your opinion about anything.... Absolutely ANYTHING!

Anyways, I'll tag you when i make that thread on Halala & Mutah. I'm sure everyone on this thread would love to read your views on those abusive practices against humanity.

Now about the worm that's writhing in pain.

Yes i have a UN lawden cos it comes from a famous meme or joke about modi. That doesn't mean my every argument is about p3nises or vaginas, unlike the worms who make everything about those things.

So what is sin in shastras is not a sin in puranas? 🤔

Then being such good knowledgeable hindus they also bring up stories to mock their own Hindu gods & beliefs. Waah - Hindu ho to aise 👏👏

Sati's self immolation may be bizzare for some modern 'progressive' Hindus but u cannot retrospectively impose kaliyugi morals in satyug, tretayug or dwaparyug. Tradition customs, beliefs and the way things generally work in a society are bound to change over time. Just like people of today are finding some things of past bizzare, people of past would have also found things of present bizzare in their times if someone did those things then. That's the beauty of time, it changes, unlike some people who are still stuck in the 7th century. Their beliefs never changed or evolved, rather people questioning those beliefs are called phobic, unlike the 'progressives' who question and mock Hinduism and it's beliefs.

P.s. repeatedly calling this forum dead yet not being able to prevent oneself from coming in here with different avatars. Are they really this oblivious to the irony 🤔

Clochette ji, please post your essay on Halala and mutah here. Will look forward to reading your expert opinion on this topic. I'm sure you won't disappoint.

https://www.indiaforums.com/forum/post/168038534

It is historically accurate that Jauhar was a specific response to the extreme threat of mass enslavement and sexual violence brought by foreign invasions, especially since internal conflicts between Hindu rulers generally followed localized rules of chivalry where defeated noblewomen were treated with respect and protected from such fates.

My goal here is not to revision or judge historical events through a modern lens, but rather to analyze them to see which underlying thought patterns have survived into the present day-and that is precisely the patriarchal mindset.

While the external danger in the past was undeniably real and horrific, the institutionalized method of dealing with that danger - mass self-immolation of women and children - reflects a societal framework where women were treated as symbols of a clan's honor rather than individuals with an independent right to survival. By recognizing that a woman's worth was so deeply tied to her physical purity and her family's lineage that death was treated as the only honorable path, we can better understand how these very same concepts of "honor" and control over female autonomy continue to influence modern social norms and prejudices today.

If you're gonna take digs at somebody for mentioning genitalia during a discussion about gender and gender based violence ,the least you can do is not have a username that means Penises Are Food.,meme or not. With that name ,no amount of forced condescension is gonna help you save face. You ve gotta stop eating d1cks ,man. Chi chi. Aur sari savitri pe nasihat de rahe ho 🤣

Originally posted by: Clochette

It is historically accurate that Jauhar was a specific response to the extreme threat of mass enslavement and sexual violence brought by foreign invasions, especially since internal conflicts between Hindu rulers generally followed localized rules of chivalry where defeated noblewomen were treated with respect and protected from such fates.

My goal here is not to revision or judge historical events through a modern lens, but rather to analyze them to see which underlying thought patterns have survived into the present day-and that is precisely the patriarchal mindset.

While the external danger in the past was undeniably real and horrific, the institutionalized method of dealing with that danger - mass self-immolation of women and children - reflects a societal framework where women were treated as symbols of a clan's honor rather than individuals with an independent right to survival. By recognizing that a woman's worth was so deeply tied to her physical purity and her family's lineage that death was treated as the only honorable path, we can better understand how these very same concepts of "honor" and control over female autonomy continue to influence modern social norms and prejudices today.

Why didn't they perform Jauhar during British invasion or rule then? Did British also honour 'localized rules of chivalry where defeated noblewomen were treated with respect and protected from such fates'? Or the only difference was that while British did r@pe they didn't indulge in necrophilia like Muslim barbarians?

What?

Again applying their dirty worm buddhi in interpreting meaning of things Always frolicking in kinky sensual stuff. Poori thinking Hi wahi se shuru aur wahi pe end ho jati hai.

Why don't they spend more time on p0rn forums than in this so called dead forum? 🤔

People with usernames about eating penises should move to p0rn forums asap instead of parking themselves here and going on and on about necrophilia. CREEPY !

Originally posted by: WormikaGrubby

People with usernames about eating penises should move to p0rn forums asap instead of parking themselves here and going on and on about necrophilia. CREEPY !

Who's username ?

Worms who interpret user names according to their own filthy imagination should consider that my user name is exactly for people like them. If they think lavden bhojyam means eat d!ck then please find one to eat. That's the message of my UN for those people

Also, someone expressing prefrence for necrophilia or cannibalism of their dead body should make formal arrangements for that desire to be fulfilled rather than wasting their time on this dead forum.