Chandra: Under the influence

Shah67 thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#1

After watching today's episode I have come to the conclusion that Chandra is under the influence of two of the most obsessive, vicious and petty though intelligent people, i.e. Chanakya and Helena.

For what would one call the killing of all of Nand's sons in one stroke in front of the father by the adarsh shishya? Was is it Dharma? Was is it honorable?

That last sequence was one of the most brutal, ruthless and dishonorable act.

Reason for the killing of the sons in front of the father? To avenge the insult that Chanakya suffered in Naapit Nand's court.

Bharatvarsh did not show up in the reason that Chanakya gave for the order to kill the sons in front of the father.

No justification of that heinous crime is acceptable, for crime it is.

The sons did not insult Chanakya, the sons did not kill Suryagupta, and the sons did not imprison Moora.

The sons did what sons all over do; they respected their father and King and followed his wishes.

As far as the crimes against Bharatvarsh and her praja...a straightforward death penalty without the unnecessary cruelty at least as far as the sons is concerned would've sufficed.

And then on the other hand we have Helena, the Greek princess.

Any person who can let their beloved pet die in front of her eyes without lifting so much as a finger nor allowing anybody else to do the same just because of some imaginary transgression on the part of the animal has to be psychotic to say the least.

And what would one call a daughter who literally sold her own country and father to the enemy because her lover insulted and jilted her? She is the true personification of the saying "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned".

Chandra had better watch out.

I hope Chandra grows a pair soon and starts using his own brain for a change instead of just following orders from his guru and his obsessive first wife.

I am so happy he has Durdhara at least. Someone he can just chill and be himself. That saubhagya raat had to be the sweetest saubhagya raat ever.

But Durdhara comes across as someone who will not involve herself in anything political or try to influence Chandra in any way. That's a shame because I do feel she might actually be a balanced and fair advisor.

Edited by devkidmd - 8 years ago

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myviewprem thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#2

Originally posted by: devkidmd

After watching today's episode I have come to the conclusion that Chandra is under the influence of two of the most obsessive, vicious and petty though intelligent people, i.e. Chanakya and Helena.

I did not understand why you call chankya and helena petty - they are just street smart not innocent like a dhuradhara or like chandras dad was because of which he got killed. You require few intelligent and obsessive people in family and friends to rule or to live otherwise in kalyug you will be dead in seconds by kapat. Chandra is a bit soft he cannot undertsand tricks so Helena and chankya will guide him in future so he does not get defeated or killed by enemies


For what would one call the killing of all of Nand's sons in one stroke in front of the father by the adarsh shishya? Was is it Dharma? Was is it honorable?


No war is honorable. What abut poor soldiers on both side what personal enemity they have with nand or chandra? Why so many lakhs were killedon field? Like that if evryone starts asking no one will gaurd our nations borders. Nands sons were killed not because they are bad but to prevent future revolts in india. Will chandra only do wars or administer indian subcontinent. So they decided to kill nands sons. Its not honourable but its required at that time.


That last sequence was one of the most brutal, ruthless and dishonorable act.

Reason for the killing of the sons in front of the father? To avenge the insult that Chanakya suffered in Naapit Nand's court.

Bharatvarsh did not show up in the reason that Chanakya gave for the order to kill the sons in front of the father.

No justification of that heinous crime is acceptable, for crime it is.

The sons did not insult Chanakya, the sons did not kill Suryagupta, and the sons did not imprison Moora.

The sons did what sons all over do; they respected their father and King and followed his wishes.

As far as the crimes against Bharatvarsh and her praja...a straightforward death penalty without the unnecessary cruelty at least as far as the sons is concerned would've sufficed.

Ok to explain this I will tell you one story that i read a few years back, one day an old lady got complaint to jehangir that his commander had taken her grand daughter forcibly after war defeat. But jehangir did not believe he said i have told all mughal commanders not to touch any woman of opponent after defeat. but she insisted so he got searched that girl everywhere and she was found in commanders camp. Jehangir got very angry and had the commander flayed alive with all soldiers watching. That made soldiers so scared that they avoided lifting girls of defeated kingdom atleast for few years. Now will you say flaying someone alive is very cruel or will we think so many young girls were safe in future because of that one cruel punishment. Killing of nand sons is warning to future enemies to be careful not dare behave cruelly with citizens of india or his family become nirvamsha like nands. That is why chankya and chandra killed those sons.


And then on the other hand we have Helena, the Greek princess.

Any person who can let their beloved pet die in front of her eyes without lifting so much as a finger nor allowing anybody else to do the same just because of some imaginary transgression on the part of the animal has to be psychotic to say the least.

And what would one call a daughter who literally sold her own country and father to the enemy because her lover insulted and jilted her? She is the true personification of the saying "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned".

Chandra had better watch out.

OK helena is a unique person, all her life she had no mother or siblings, dad never bothered or loved her much always busy in war. She was very lonely and so she loved her pet very much. But she thinks he left her and went to a hare, that rabbit did not care her love and searched for love in other companion so she killed. ha ha think of all wives in modern terms they are obsessive of husbands, majority do not like if husband is close to his parents, siblings etc or talk to other ladies. Think of obsessive male lovers who kill their love on roads brutally. It is same psychology helena has. Its a bit dangerous if she sets out to kill her soutens but i do not think if chandra gives her enough care and love she will do anything, yes if chandra ignores her completely yes she will try and hurt him or her soutens.

I think in future she may take maley help to punish her souten or husband too

I read helena had a child from chandra and even bindu was close to her family members anfd her, lets see if she will get someone who loves her completely like a bindu or her own baby. If she is alone she may get obsessive of chandra

I hope Chandra grows a pair soon and starts using his own brain for a change instead of just following orders from his guru and his obsessive first wife.

I do not understand why they are showing chandra as yes boss types, real chandra went to many wars without chankya. Here chankya showing flags to him to teach war tactic not good chandra should fight independent.


I am so happy he has Durdhara at least. Someone he can just chill and be himself. That saubhagya raat had to be the sweetest saubhagya raat ever.

But Durdhara comes across as someone who will not involve herself in anything political or try to influence Chandra in any way. That's a shame because I do feel she might actually be a balanced and fair advisor.

Dhurudhara is good advisor in administration not about war and politics as she does not understand kapata. She can advice on internal policies of state but war etc helena or chankya only are capable


Edited by myviewprem - 8 years ago
Shah67 thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#3
Sandhya.A thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#4
_Payalj_ thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#5
The show is placed in 300 BC . So morals and values of that era only would be applicable. Might and power ruled and softness had no place. Even today war is cruel. How do you think prisoners of war are treated?
Leaving Nands sons alive would have been harakiri for chandra. And yes they had to be made an example so that no one would dare stand up again against chandra. barbaric yes, but then those times were barbaric.

Regarding killing brothers and father in front of daughter - Nandini deserved it. She is a stupid brat who thinks too high of herself. If she wanted to be treated like a woman, then she shouldn't have entered the battlefield.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. Also did she ever show mercy to moora who is chained like a dog. Papa says she is bad so she must be punished.

Regarding chanakya, it wasn't a matter of only his insult. If you read many accounts nanda kept on insulting him and chanakya still begged him to protect India. For chanakya it was a matter of revenge for the humiliation, pillage, murder and loot India suffered because nanda was too cheap and selfish to do his duty.

Regarding Helena I agree. She is unstable and dangerous. A girl who did not blink once before betraying her father because he didn't fulfil her wishes, didn't think twice before letting her innocent pet die will also not think twice before harming chandra or his other wives if she doesn't have her way.

She might be intelligent but a two edged sword which can cut its yeilders throat in a snap.


Shah67 thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#6


Of course killing and slaughter of family and relatives happens when one wants to overturn the current rule. Not disputing that at all. My view is that for someone who is supposed to be the beacon of Dharma, i.e. Chanakya, it would've been more fitting that the sons were disposed off in a less barbaric manner. But I guess that was part of his plan. Because no punishment can be more brutal or horrifying than watching your own kids get slaughtered in front of your own eyes. Is any crime worthy of such a punishment?

As for Chanakya's insult in court. He could've tortured Nand, hung drawn and quartered him.



4U2NV thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#7
you both can agrue back and forth on this episode. But reality of chandragupta story on wars, wives, etc is not what they protrait in this serial.
you are agruing over situation that is not realistic at all. to be honest with you.

chandragupta was great warrior and he was taught by chanayka but he was not influence and constantly followed whatever chanakya said. so that is wrong info.

also the way they protrait the wives and how he won the war against nand is not correct either.

read the history and you will know this serial is using those character and try to show similarity but not justification to the actual facts at all.

there is no nandini in history.

before you agru over it.. review your facts.!!!


Shah67 thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#8

Originally posted by: _Payalj_

The show is placed in 300 BC . So morals and values of that era only would be applicable. Might and power ruled and softness had no place. Even today war is cruel. How do you think prisoners of war are treated?

Leaving Nands sons alive would have been harakiri for chandra. And yes they had to be made an example so that no one would dare stand up again against chandra. barbaric yes, but then those times were barbaric.

Regarding killing brothers and father in front of daughter - Nandini deserved it. She is a stupid brat who thinks too high of herself. If she wanted to be treated like a woman, then she shouldn't have entered the battlefield.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. Also did she ever show mercy to moora who is chained like a dog. Papa says she is bad so she must be punished.

Regarding chanakya, it wasn't a matter of only his insult. If you read many accounts nanda kept on insulting him and chanakya still begged him to protect India. For chanakya it was a matter of revenge for the humiliation, pillage, murder and loot India suffered because nanda was too cheap and selfish to do his duty.

Regarding Helena I agree. She is unstable and dangerous. A girl who did not blink once before betraying her father because he didn't fulfil her wishes, didn't think twice before letting her innocent pet die will also not think twice before harming chandra or his other wives if she doesn't have her way.

She might be intelligent but a two edged sword which can cut its yeilders throat in a snap.



@ bold: So just because a person is a stupid brat she deserves to see her family being butchered in front of her? Strongly disagree.
I honestly do not get this hatred for Nandini on this forum.
As far as I can tell her only "crime" is that she is an over indulged pampered princess, One who was born after 9 sons and the only girl child who adores her father and is blind to his faults. I cannot understand what is so wrong in that! Can any one of us imagine our parents doing bad things? Don't we keep our parents on a pedestal and take offense when someone says something that may be even remotely insulting to them? Why is she any different than any princesses then or even now?

As far as the accounts go, does not matter to me what they say. I am just going by what they are showing in the serial. After all the winner writes history so who knows. The killing of Nand and sons is justified but the way it was done was more to do with Chanakya's personal revenge.
Shah67 thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#9

Originally posted by: 4U2NV

you both can agrue back and forth on this episode. But reality of chandragupta story on wars, wives, etc is not what they protrait in this serial.

you are agruing over situation that is not realistic at all. to be honest with you.

chandragupta was great warrior and he was taught by chanayka but he was not influence and constantly followed whatever chanakya said. so that is wrong info.

also the way they protrait the wives and how he won the war against nand is not correct either.

read the history and you will know this serial is using those character and try to show similarity but not justification to the actual facts at all.

there is no nandini in history.

before you agru over it.. review your facts.!!!



Unfortunately this serial is called Chandra Nandini. So regardless of what history says, Nandini is a reality in this serial and forum.
shailusri1983 thumbnail
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Posted: 8 years ago
#10
This is a 4th BC period story. Please do not impose your contemporary morals or codes of conduct on it. I am not going into history at this point at all. The original Chandragupt was very ruthless and clinical in his destruction of the Nandas. There he had no serious personal reasons to defend his conduct or reason away his extreme hatred for the ruling family.

It was true that the Nandas were highly unpopular as a ruling dynasty. They sucked the people dry and filled their own coffers. They were least bothered about national security and people's welfare. They ruled on the basis of fear. They executed anyone with or without the least possible justification.

Chandragupt, according to history, just wanted to weed them out just like a farmer extinguishes pests and poisonous and thorny plants from his crop to save the crop from being destroyed. Even if you leave one such plant or pest, it will spread and destroy the whole crop. So he destroyed the entire Nanda race.

That was how kings and winners established and stabilized their rule. At least here, Chandragupt seems to have a solid personal reason for his hatred and his behavior. In the period we are taking about the personal was always political. The powerful oppressed the weak and there was only one way of making a big line smaller; that was drawing a bigger line beside it first and then try erasing the previous line. That was how empires were made.

Nand, Chandragupt, or for that matter any other king did not/would not extend any charity or mercy to the former ruling king or ruling family. It would be too dangerous for them. You talk about Chandra's cruelty to Nand in killing his own sons before his eyes and Nandini's eyes.

What about Nand having an affair with his queen and killing his own king when the latter trusts himself in his hands under the assumption that his barber has come to shave his beard? What will you call his Peeping Tom behavior at a pregnant Moora; some sort of social service? What about Suryagupt's murder before Moora's eyes?

Leave all that! This Nand killed 39 new born kids the day Chandra was born thinking that one of them must be Suryagupt and Moora's son. Similarly Nand and his nine sons cooly walk about murdering poor old men in the open court just because they have the temerity to question his injustice. Being Nandini's dad or brothers does not exculpate or atone for every sin they have committed. Nemesis and Karma catches up with everyone. It did with Nand and his sons.

I agree that Nandini and the women on this side will suffer a lot. Every war results in a lot of collateral damage; the woman, children, the aged, the families of the soldiers, etc. Any king would be cruel and ruthless to his enemies, with the traitors or with the previous king, his family, relatives, and even his faithful ministers.

Chandragupt was a great warrior, general, just and noble king to his people, and the founder of a mighty empire. It is nowhere written that he was a great humanitarian, altruist and peace lover. Politics and power in the BC were not for the chicken hearted and Chandragupt Maurya was one of the greatest brave heart warrior Indian soil has ever known.

No warrior worth his salt in those days would have such qualms for spilling their enemy's blood or be put off by all this gore. In a way I felt, the CVs were not exaggerating things or making Chandra cruel. I would rather see it as doing justice to the character description.

You might still feel that Nand being evil is no justification for Chandra being equally evil. This could be your opinion. In that case, no doubt you would equally condemn somebody in the military services of any country like the army, airforce, or navy of being murderers because they actually kill whoever comes in the line of their duty?

Similarly would you condemn an executioner who enforces and carries out the death sentence issued by our Supreme Court as the worst human being on earth for having no pity on his fellow human being? Going by the kind of logic you adopt, he should be the most miserable man on this planet.

Similarly, if we are going to take such considerations into account, I suppose we have to get the Bhagavad Gita banned. We a wear to this day in courts of law to say that whatever we are stating is the absolute truth. I suppose you would have a problem with that too as it was spoken on a field of battle inciting a soldier and warrior who wanted to run away to do battle and kill his enemies. Should we stop worshipping Lord Krishna because he not only supported war but many times also resorted to dubious means to achieve his ends in the battle of Kurukshetra?

Truth and dharma are very relative. We do have courts or police to seek justice in this age. So we can afford to speak all these morals. What about a period like Chandragupt's where the king was law himself and a bad, tyrannical king was at the helm of affairs? Your only option to restore justice or Dharma would have been to overthrow that king. Chandragupt and Chanakya did the same thing.

It at times pains when I see people talking about truth, dharma, right action and conduct in such an arbitrary fashion and sit over judgement of characters, people or their motivations at such a superficial level without realizing the underlying or deeper significance in them.

How easy isn't it to call somebody of Chanakya or Chandragupta's stature as cruel, obsessive, vindictive, demean or lessen their greatness of character just because the other person at the receiving end happens to be the father or brother of the female lead? It is enough if they are good fathers, brothers or husbands. Should all their other crimes be forgiven or overlooked because of that? I think not!

I have been very busy and should not have been replying at all. But I could not help it. So even if you are replying to this post, I will not be continuing this discussion or argument. I hope you understand.

Edited by shailusri1983 - 8 years ago

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