Why apathy towards love?

myviewprem thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#1
I am wondering - many people on social networking sites(not necessarily india forums) oppose Salim for loving a dancer.
In 21st century we modern young people do not like parents interfering in our choice of groom/bride or boy friends and girl friends or profession etc. Whether in city or small towns and villages commonly young people revolt against family, society to asset their rights to love person of their choice or marry irrespective of what profession, caste, religion, class etc
So its a surprise to me that even in 21st century people are having such thoughts. Indeed if Salim had really loved a dancer and want to marry her and give her respect and status in society how is it so wrong? especially for people of 21st century. This is an age where princes are marrying commoners, film stars, dancers, singers etc. So why do we viewers who are usually commoners having such a big objection to a crown prince marrying a dancer in 21st century.
Every past generation has issues and clash of values with their next generation. Its obvious that parents and grandparents have different values and way of thinking. Indeed the past generation or one behind had a different way of looking at house maids etc now in this generation atleast few people treat them with some amount of respect. Just because the past generations thought that playing with maids kids is wrong or treating maids with respect is not a given it does not mean next generation thinks like that.
Now look at film stars and dancers in dance shows they are all treated with respect is it not by society? But 50 years back they were not treated so it was a very bad profession. Today if your family member is a film star or dancer its matter of pride and status. Now anarkali's profession is similar to film stars to entertain her audience the emperor and his guests by dancing. Till now she was never shown being exploited by any man so we can assume she just only dances to entertain. In this century when people can accept film stars and treat them with respect, why not respect anarkali an dancer?
From this angle I would like to view the love of salim for anarkali. His father-mother family may think a dancer is lower than them in strata and society, but Salim may not think like that. He may consider a dancer, a commoner, a soldier as equal to him and deserving of similar respect and love. That is the basic premises of this love story. When a person breaks the barriers of society, family, caste, religion, class, creed and profession and steps forward to accept a girl why not support that change? Especially modern society viewers who come from educated background are supporting Akbar is a bit shocking?
Akbar and his before generations kept dancers to entertain them in palaces, some may have fallen in love with these dancers too but never dared to publicly acknowledge their love, they just lived as cocubbines and rakasha all life.
Salim wants to acknowledge so what is the issue? Some generation has to break the past rules and move forward, so why not appreciate and support? Is it not nobel to accept your love public and give your lover a position by marrying her rather than keep her as cocubbine or secondary wife without any value in society or respect in society.
Akbar himself wanted wife status for all his wives and cucubbines and secondary wives and ulema objected. So how can he oppose Salim love?
I think anarkali must get a chance to come up in life from the mess that life has pushed her into. In those days marriage was only way out for girls to come up usually especially the commoners and in this case marrying a royal would definitely be good for her. I do not care if Salim gets his love he has a privilege life already and I do not care for Akbar's prestige talks he also had a privileged life being born to an emperor and having backing of Bk etc. All we can expect is that she gets a fair chance to come up in life.
Edited by myviewprem - 10 years ago

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Vtui thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#2
Hi prem nice post, about why? Why anar not accepted by viewers as cud be a right love approach for salim ?i wonder , do the love know any boundaries
I just have a doubt , about the difference of a royal dancer and concubine , as I watched in some Korean serial, the concubines or king's ladies, all of those who used to part of Harem, but were not allowed to be an entertainment source for anyone else other than king, as those were kings prestige , does not matter king ever looked at them or not , but those cud only his or no-one else. And maybe royal dancers were not a part of Harem. Can u clear my doubt, if u have any idea about it. I don't have any history knowledge, sorry.
atoshi.chanda06 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#3
actually in a way u r right bt salim was crown Prince. so he will be a king. and kings first wife will be a rakasa cant be thought at that time. and i dnt understand 1 thing why all of this happened. i mean it was n is obvious he will have many wives because of many reason so he can have anarkali after his marriage to anyone. and its also obvious at that time kings used to have many women in their life.some of them favourite to king coz of love, coz of giving heir, coz of beauty, intelligence n many more.
and we should not think abt it more coz anar was a myth. true is nurjahan n Akbar didn't want salim to marry her bt salim married her aft akbars death. so salims love won and he ruled successfully.
Vtui thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#4

Originally posted by: atoshi.chanda06

actually in a way u r right bt salim was crown Prince. so he will be a king. and kings first wife will be a rakasa cant be thought at that time. and i dnt understand 1 thing why all of this happened. i mean it was n is obvious he will have many wives because of many reason so he can have anarkali after his marriage to anyone. and its also obvious at that time kings used to have many women in their life.some of them favourite to king coz of love, coz of giving heir, coz of beauty, intelligence n many more.
and we should not think abt it more coz anar was a myth. true is nurjahan n Akbar didn't want salim to marry her bt salim married her aft akbars death. so salims love won and he ruled successfully.


Hi I do have a doubt here, atoshi, Anar existed or not , a big doubt . But not existed with 100 % surety , can't be said , the simple reason was , the writers were faithful to king so anything going against king wud have been omitted easily I mean just hided was not a big thank ? Regarding ur doubt about why anar was not approved as salim ' s in whatever relation ( he cud have her as concubine) but cud not , simple because she was his fathers lady( king's lady) only legitimate reason , provided she had existed
myviewprem thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#5

Originally posted by: Vtui

Hi prem nice post, about why? Why anar not accepted by viewers as cud be a right love approach for salim ?i wonder , do the love know any boundaries
I just have a doubt , about the difference of a royal dancer and concubine , as I watched in some Korean serial, the concubines or king's ladies, all of those who used to part of Harem, but were not allowed to be an entertainment source for anyone else other than king, as those were kings prestige , does not matter king ever looked at them or not , but those cud only his or no-one else. And maybe royal dancers were not a part of Harem. Can u clear my doubt, if u have any idea about it. I don't have any history knowledge, sorry.

I have no idea dear other than cocubbine is like second wife concept in modern times who has no legal rights or society/law does not recognize them. But for all other purpose they were like wives who even gave birth to emperors kids too etc. Indeed many kings had consorts who were commoners and dancers in Mughals only. Ex: Udaipuri mahal a slave girl was consort of Aurangzeb and even had kids, Shah jahan was tended to in confinement by consorts who were commoners, akbar himself had kids from them.
Edited by myviewprem - 10 years ago
myviewprem thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#6

Originally posted by: atoshi.chanda06

actually in a way u r right bt salim was crown Prince. so he will be a king. and kings first wife will be a rakasa cant be thought at that time. and i dnt understand 1 thing why all of this happened. i mean it was n is obvious he will have many wives because of many reason so he can have anarkali after his marriage to anyone. and its also obvious at that time kings used to have many women in their life.some of them favourite to king coz of love, coz of giving heir, coz of beauty, intelligence n many more.
and we should not think abt it more coz anar was a myth. true is nurjahan n Akbar didn't want salim to marry her bt salim married her aft akbars death. so salims love won and he ruled successfully.

my major objection is Akbar himself had commoners, divorcee, widows as wives so why object to an arnarkali as a secondary wife atleast if not chief wife to salim? Same goes to nur jahan case too. Then may be nur jahan would not have such a strangehold on salim in later life.
And here Akbar himself in serial spoke so highly of love saying if you cannot defend you love what sort of love is it, if you allow others to raise ques on your love and let them scott free etc during shah I shah track. But here his talk does not match actions. So should viewer that was just a political speech made for his son and not real thoughts of Akbar.
Edited by myviewprem - 10 years ago
myviewprem thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#7

Originally posted by: Vtui


Hi I do have a doubt here, atoshi, Anar existed or not , a big doubt . But not existed with 100 % surety , can't be said , the simple reason was , the writers were faithful to king so anything going against king wud have been omitted easily I mean just hided was not a big thank ? Regarding ur doubt about why anar was not approved as salim ' s in whatever relation ( he cud have her as concubine) but cud not , simple because she was his fathers lady( king's lady) only legitimate reason , provided she had existed

100% no one can say any history is correct because in those days history was written to show kings in great light. And akbarnama is a fan crazy guy Abul Fazl writing about his idol Akbar, so 50% of it will be fan fiction only. All sore points shall be hidden, Salim is almost missing after marriage to almost till last year of Akbar's life. So what happened can never be expected in an akbarnama or ain e akbari. Same goes to jehangirnama written after becoming king, past is completely hidden mostly.
Vtui thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#8

Originally posted by: myviewprem

I have no idea dear other than cocubbine is like second wife concept in modern times who has no legal rights or society/law does not recognize them. But for all other purpose they were like wives who even gave birth to emperors kids too etc. Indeed many kings had consorts who were commoners and dancers in Mughals only. Ex: Udaipuri mahal a slave girl was consort of Aurangzeb and even had kids, Shah jahan was tended to in confinement by consorts who were commoners, akbar himself had kids from them.

OK even if we go ur view, that many of their consorts used to be commoners, but they cud have children from them, then how wud a father allow Salim to wed/or even use Anar, as his concubine, if she was her concubine, commoner or not. , thats the only logic, that Anar cud have existed, but finding Salim fell inlove with her, was executed behind the wall, b4 coming talk of town. My View
Regarding, noor, there cud be a debate between them, as for approval from Akbar but definitely the case of Anar was very different from Noor...and as I read somehere, a son after defeating his father, after winning the throne, raped his(Father's} concubines just to show his powers over his father's , and that too in open,...I thought forgot the name of empror.
atoshi.chanda06 thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#9

Originally posted by: myviewprem



100% no one can say any history is correct because in those days history was written to show kings in great light. And akbarnama is a fan crazy guy Abul Fazl writing about his idol Akbar, so 50% of it will be fan fiction only. All sore points shall be hidden, Salim isalmost missing after marriage to almost till last year of Akbar's life. So what happened can never be expected in an akbarnama or ain e akbari. Same goes to jehangirnama written after becoming king, past is completely hidden mostly.



well,I just want to say every thing that r written cannot be believed as reliable source because jahangir nama has 3 parts n in every part information r different. how is this possible for a person to write abt himself differently. it indicates something fissy n either it can be that when it was translated information has been changed. same case for Akbarnama. fazl has written it n personally he had clash with salim. because he was one who told akbar that salim tried to poison akbar. n also wives n childrens mothers name were in disguise for protection. also hassan hussain death were indicated unnatural though reason nt disclosed. but we know they died from cholera. don't know what is truth n what is not. as many things cannt be disclosed which can tarnish reputation.only real historical characters can tell truth coming from their graves.
and abt serial leap itself was a blunder so what was shown aft it is all blunder. be it jalals dialogue about love to salim.
myviewprem thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
#10

Originally posted by: Vtui

OK even if we go ur view, that many of their consorts used to be commoners, but they cud have children from them, then how wud a father allow Salim to wed/or even use Anar, as his concubine, if she was her concubine, commoner or not. , thats the only logic, that Anar cud have existed, but finding Salim fell inlove with her, was executed behind the wall, b4 coming talk of town. My View
Regarding, noor, there cud be a debate between them, as for approval from Akbar but definitely the case of Anar was very different from Noor...and as I read somehere, a son after defeating his father, after winning the throne, raped his(Father's} concubines just to show his powers over his father's , and that too in open,...I thought forgot the name of empror.

see in history anarkali was not really present there is no proof so lets forget history
I am talking of serial - anarkali has no physical relation with Akbar so far or any man in serial. So why not allow her to be salim wife if not primary then secondary wife at least?
Who was this emperor who raped his fathers cocubbine in public? Was he Mughal? Can you give me link to read it?
As far as I know Salim was considerate to his mothers be it royals or cocubbines or secondary wives. When he became emperor he increased their allowances and he even would have periodic family dinners with them. Indeed one Mughal chronicle I read stated that when Jehangir was surprised by the large amount allocated as funds to his mothers as allowance after he announced hike in the accounts. Then he enquired that how come such large amount was given and decided to meet all his mothers(primary, secondary, cocubbines etc) as he had no idea he had so many moms and wanted to meet them personally.
Edited by myviewprem - 10 years ago

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