A small point in defence of Jalal!

skanda12 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#1
Friends, after being one of the people on this Forum roundly and soundly cursing Ekta, her storyline, the behaviour of Jalal, the behaviour (or lack of it) of Jodha, and the dragging out of this whole miscarriage saga for close on ten days ...
... I wanted to express something that has struck me since last night!
In all our judgements of Jalal's behaviour and his extreme prejudice against Jodha and her family (for their prejudice against him!), have we perhaps forgotten the stark truth of Jalal's age?!
* Do you all think that perhaps we should not merely judge Jalal for his role as husband, and as King, but also as a young man of just twenty two, who is barely out of his adolescence, so to speak, with very under-developed emotional maturity?
* Should we perhaps make allowances for the fact that his extremes of behaviour may stem from the fact that he has still not achieved any reasonable self-control over his swinging emotional states that his age creates?
* Could his behaviour be explained by the fact that he may want desperately to be a father, but he is as yet very underdone to really be one because he is unable as yet to handle the highs of happiness and the lows of depression with any measure of emotional equanimity?
Sometimes, people learn early to handle their growth years with some measure of maturity because they get the benefit of some institutionalised education or some form of formal learning system - from teachers or parents - that allows them to discuss and work through their issues. They learn to rub shoulders with others their age - their peers - and to interact with these others in a more civilised way, even if their hormones are raging or teenage or adolescent emotional mood swing or turbulence is high.
We know that Jalal had none of that opportunity. In fact he has always been a young boy on the run from captors and war-oriented, and made to feel that he was just a young boy, in the midst of wily old heads such as Bairam Khan and Mahamanga, who never taught him how to handle emotions. They instead fed him on the easy myth that he has no heart and thus conveniently (conveniently to themselves!) taught him not to acknowledge that emotions exist and that there can be pleasure and pain that can at times be very intense and one has to have the skills to cope with it all. They gave him no coping skills, perhaps because they wanted him to lean on them for these skills and thus stay within their clutches.
The only friend or peer Jalal has ever had has been Ruqaiya, who is even younger than him, and from what we see, rather emotionally immature in her behaviour herself. Her intelligent mind cannot be mistaken for emotional maturity, nor can her ambition be mistaken for emotional control. In fact in the hands of one who is emotionally immature, ambition and intelligence can also go awry. Ruqaiya, if anything, is perhaps absolutely the wrong person, I feel, to be in the vicinity of Jalal at this stage, simply because he should be learning at this time about the skills to manage his emotions rather than be egged on further to ignore his emotions because they seem inconvenient to acknowledge. Ruqaiya shares his yearnings for a child but between them both how much emotional maturity is there to handle the responsibility?
I am not trying to make excuses for Jalal's behaviour here nor am I in a mood to forgive Ekta for extending this torture on viewers, but it was just a passing thought I had that we are looking at Jalal through only two dimensions - the roles he plays as husband and as King. We are all perhaps not giving enough attention to his age and his emotional growth even for this age is inadequate.
A normal twenty two year old in our times is very mature these days, but if we look at him as a product of his times, twenty two was barely an age to be a good husband and a good King. He would have needed much more wisdom than he had to be even that good husband and good King he was expected to be, and the fact that he wanted also to be a good father to a child was probably more than he could handle given his emotional resources at the time. And without formal education and interaction with his age group, and with no one to show him what growth pains are about and how to handle them, he must have found himself all at sea.
The whole thing gets even more complicated for an emotionally under-ready fellow when his new wife comes to his home with much greater emotional maturity than he has, but with her emotions blinded by prejudice. At a time when he needs validation at every emotionally mature step he takes, Jodha may be actually demotivating him or leading him back to unbridled and inexplicable anger by her reactions and prejudices against him.
If this is the case, I can find a corner of sympathy in my heart for him, for being so "naive" when everyone was expecting him to be "wise". And I can understand if Ekta's creative weredeliberately portraying him as a man of "ungrown emotions" and therefore so out of whack in times of trouble.
But his position as both husband and King of a really vast estate, as also his ambitions to be a father as soon as possible, also give him very little time to grow. He has to double up, so to speak, to even run in the same place. So I hope his learning curve from this whole miscarriage episode will be very steep for his own sake.
How many of you agree or disagree with me?
Edited by skanda12 - 12 years ago

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munni_rajatfan thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#2
gud point. & besides we all know MM. she had always poisoned jalal's mind. jalal's upbringing had been very poor. jodha always had a peaceful child hood, but jalal's child hood had been horrible. & salima had been talking about BK. but we shouldnt forget how BK blinded zaheer & killed takhatmal out of rage. jalal had been brought up by these people. we have to agree upbringing plays a huge role in human behavior.

P.S.:- i am not justifying jalal's actions, but one reason is also tht, he had started to feel for jodha, thts why he feels more betrayed. if he was not so bothered about her maybe he wouldnt be so blinded by emotions.
Edited by munnirony - 12 years ago
skanda12 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#3

Originally posted by: munnirony

gud point. & besides we all know MM. she had always poisoned jalal's mind. jalal's upbringing had been very poor. jodha always had a peaceful child hood, but jalal's child hood had been horrible. & salima had been talking about BK. but we shouldnt forget how BK blinded zaheer & killed takhatmal out for rage. jalal had been brought up by these people. we have to agree upbringing plays a huge role in human behavior.


P.S.:- i am not justifying jalal's actions, but one reason is also tht, he had started to feel for jodha, thts why he feels more betrayed. if he was not so bothered about her maybe he wouldnt be so blinded by emotions.

See, I am not sure if Ekta and her creative deliberately set out to make Jalal look like a overgrown but emotionally immature man, but if they did this deliberately then one can perhaps commend their "cleverness" a bit, though I still feel they dragged it all out a bit too much!
SonyaBlade thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#4
If we are to look at this drama filled week through the eyes of a 16th century inidividual then the argument that he is ONLY 22 years old doesn't hold water. At 22 years of age, these men had far greater responsiblities doled out to them through sheer circumstance as opposed to anything that we could call responsiblity in today's day and age.

In what way are 22 year olds more mature today than in the 16th century. By that age a man who is of royal blood would most likely have killed another man or many by now. He would have been involved in some sort of skirmish, battle or war and have had plenty of experience on the battle field. so for worldy experience and maturity I definitely give the 16th century man an upper hand in maturity as opposed to a video gaming, school going man of today's age...😆

He would have been trained from day one on the responsibilities and role that is required of him. We can not on one hand say that Jalal shows great wisdom and "siyasi" skills when holding court, dealing with Jodha pre-marriage, dealing with the entire marriage proposal situation infront of his court, etc,etc,,, and then say for this particular circumstance he is not old enough, not emotionally developed enough and not mature enough.

And how is it that he is able to make the decision about going to war with Rattan Singh and his father - which happens to be the right decision if we just take it at face value for what the CV's fed us, and yet he is so poor in his dealings with Jodha and her family?

No, I do not agree that Jalal is not mature enough or does not have his emotions developed, because it is exactly his maturity in development which is going to allow him to come out of this, once he realizes how deeply he has erred, and be able to rectify the situation with Jodha. It is only his maturity, and nothing else that can get him out of this grave he has dug for himself to be able to make Jodha understand and get her to forgive him. BUT for that to happen , Jodha has to be able to come out of this situation completely 100% INNOCENT, otherwise like Shyamala Aunty has written before I also believe that if she is only proven not guilty, Jalal will not be able to forgive her, as he will still think she had something to do with it.

Take care,

Sonya

PS: if Lashy or Shyamala Aunty read this, I think you should be proud of me, because I thnk I"ve written a fairly positive post on Jalal...Might be the first...I'm not 100% sure😆
Edited by SonyaBlade - 12 years ago
skanda12 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#5

Originally posted by: SonyaBlade

If we are to look at this drama filled week through the eyes of a 16th century inidividual then the argument that he is ONLY 22 years old doesn't hold water. At 22 years of age, these men had far greater responsiblities doled out to them through sheer circumstance as opposed to anything that we could call responsiblity in today's day and age.

In what way are 22 year olds more mature today than in the 16th century. By that age a man who is of royal blood would most likely have killed another man or many by now. He would have been involved in some sort of skirmish, battle or war and have had plenty of experience on the battle field. so for worldy experience and maturity and definitely give the 16th century man an upper and in maturity as opposed to a video gaming, school going man of today's age...😆

He would have been trained from day one on the responsibilities and role that is required of him. We can not on one hand say that Jalal shows great wisdom and "siyasi" skills when holding court, dealing with Jodha pre-marriage, dealing with the entire marriage proposal situation infront of his court, etc,etc,,, and then say for this particular circumstance he is not old enough, not emotionally developed enough and not mature enough.

And how is it that he is able to make the decision about going to war with Rattan Singh and his father - which happens to be the right decision if we just take it at face value for what the CV's fed us, and yet he is so poor in his dealings with Jodha and her family?

No, I do not agree that Jalal is not mature enough or does not have his emotions developed, because it is exactly his maturity in development which is going to allow him to come out of this, once he realizes how deeply he has erred, and be able to rectify the situation with Jodha. It is only his maturity, and nothing else that can get him out of this grave he has dug for himself to be able to make Jodha understand and get her to forgive him. BUT for that to happen , Jodha has to be able to come out of this situation completely 100% INNOCENT, otherwise like Shyamala Aunty has written before I also believe that if she is only proven not guilty, Jalal will not be able to forgive her, as he will still think she had something to do with it.

Take care,

Sonya

Sonya, I like your post, but I have to disagree on one point. You have based your argument on the fact that ...
"At 22 years of age, these men had far greater responsiblities doled out to them through sheer circumstance as opposed to anything that we could call responsiblity in today's day and age. "
But being shouldered with responsibility is not the same thing as having emotional maturity. In fact, it could well be that too much responsibility has actually stunted emotional maturity. Emotional maturity comes with being able to handle ones pendulum of emotions and is not about whether one is occupying a position of power, of responsibility or even decisions.
SonyaBlade thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#6
Yes Mansi, too much responsiblity can stunt emotional growth, but there are too many circumstances in this TV serial where Jalal has been shown to be wise, to not let his emotions rule his decision making skills, that this out of control Jalal, is purely that...an out of control, border line sadistic man right now who is out for blood...no amount of emotional maturity or lack there of will change the way he has reacted to what he considers to be the gravest sin that Jodha could do to him...

I don't buy your argument that Jalal is not emotionally mature, because I predict we will see quite a bit of emotional maturity in him once the truth is revealed...And hopefully at that time, along with Jodha, I will fall in love with him as well...
Exasperating thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#7

Originally posted by: skanda12

Sonya, I like your post, but I have to disagree on one point. You have based your argument on the fact that ...
"At 22 years of age, these men had far greater responsiblities doled out to them through sheer circumstance as opposed to anything that we could call responsiblity in today's day and age. "
But being shouldered with responsibility is not the same thing as having emotional maturity. In fact, it could well be that too much responsibility has actually stunted emotional maturity. Emotional maturity comes with being able to handle ones pendulum of emotions and is not about whether one is occupying a position of power, of responsibility or even decisions.


I agree with you Mansi. A certain times Jalal is acting as mature person. But in this situation he is angry due to his mindset about Jodha. He reacted very maturely when he came to know that MA killed Bairam Khan because he loves MA. But Jodha has always been like enemy to him who wanted his head. That's the only reason he is behaving like this to her. He doesn't trust Jodha at all and because of this he is not able to see her good points.
skanda12 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#8

Originally posted by: SonyaBlade

Yes Mansi, too much responsiblity can stunt emotional growth, but there are too many circumstances in this TV serial where Jalal has been shown to be wise, to not let his emotions rule his decision making skills, that this out of control Jalal, is purely that...an out of control, border line sadistic man right now who is out for blood...no amount of emotional maturity or lack there of will change the way he has reacted to what he considers to be the gravest sin that Jodha could do to him...

I don't buy your argument that Jalal is not emotionally mature, because I predict we will see quite a bit of emotional maturity in him once the truth is revealed...And hopefully at that time, along with Jodha, I will fall in love with him as well...

I agree with you that once the truth is revealed we will see more emotional maturity in him. Where we both disagree is this: you believe he is already emotionally mature and will show this after the truth comes out. I believe he lacks emotional maturity but this issue will force him to grow and to reveal more maturity when the truth hits him.
Either way, we both hope that after this issue is over, we will have a new more emotionally mature Jalal who will also challenge Jodha to reveal the full extent of her emotional maturity soon. We all like to see a love story where two people are going through "solid emotional bonding" which is not really possible if either one was stunted in this regard.
SonyaBlade thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#9

Originally posted by: skanda12

I agree with you that once the truth is revealed we will see more emotional maturity in him. Where we both disagree is this: you believe he is already emotionally mature and will show this after the truth comes out. I believe he lacks emotional maturity but this issue will force him to grow and to reveal more maturity when the truth hits him.
Either way, we both hope that after this issue is over, we will have a new more emotionally mature Jalal who will also challenge Jodha to reveal the full extent of her emotional maturity soon. We all like to see a love story where two people are going through "solid emotional bonding" which is not really possible if either one was stunted in this regard.



Just a quick question : does Jalal's hate for Jodha - pre marriage / during marraige / post marriage ..etc...do you think that shows emotional maturity on his part?

I actually think that he has more maturity than Jodha does for the pure reason that he has lived life a lot more than Jodha has ... Jodha is emotionally COMFORTABLE, which is very much different than emotionally mature.

Just something to throw out there...
skanda12 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#10

Originally posted by: njani123


I agree with you Mansi. A certain times Jalal is acting as mature person. But in this situation he is angry due to his mindset about Jodha. He reacted very maturely when he came to know that MA killed Bairam Khan because he loves MA. But Jodha has always been like enemy to him who wanted his head. That's the only reason he is behaving like this to her. He doesn't trust Jodha at all and because of this he is not able to see her good points.

Yes, you have agood point there ... that at times Jalal has shown maturity (eg. the Bairam Khan murder issue) but at times this emotional maturity is missing. See, in this particular miscarriage case it is like a double whammy for him, I think. One fact is he is unable to handle his longing for the child and the subsequent depression of the miscarriage. That is one highly emotive issue for him. The oother highly emotive issue for him is Jodha - he is conflicted due to his attraction for her as well as his loathing of her hatred of him.
The fact that he sometimes shows maturity and sometimes doesn''t itself shows that he is not "fully ready" perhaps? He is growing but not yet there, maybe?

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