Mumbai Under Attack - Page 4

Originally posted by: mini2390

Alright..then what about the samjhota express blasts and malegon blasts? Who did you guys blame - Pakistan..and what happened in the end? I assume thats what India "might" be doing again.

How about this now? : -

When a series of blasts is being carried out by some Islamic extremist group ain't it natural that they'll be the first one who'll be suspected for other blasts at the same time. What you should see is the fact that the investigators suspected them in the beginning and yet continued their probe and came out with the current suspects. Ain't that more important.

Earlier, Indian navy spokesman Capt. Manohar Nambiar said navy officers had boarded a cargo vessel it suspected of ties to the attacks that had come to Mumbai from Karachi, Pakistan. He later said the ship was not linked in any way to the strikes.

Yes they're now suspecting that a trawler from Porbander was hijacked by the terrorists to reach Mumbai. Obviously there'll be suspects and it might turn out to be true or otherwise. But just because one of their theory turned out to be false doesn't mean that all the suspicions and allegations are also unfounded.

Many analysts said Wednesday's attacks were more likely to have been carried out by indigenous, Indian extremist groups blamed for a series of bombings this year than Pakistani-linked ones.

They also noted that India's government stood to benefit politically for hinting at the involvement of its old rival ' rather than admitting some of its own 145 million Muslims had become radicalized.

"It will always want to label this militancy as foreign rather than to accept it has its own problem," said Shaun Gregory, an expert on South Asian terrorism at the University of Bradford in Britain. "That sells much more easily to the Indian public than admitting serious grievances within its Muslims."

Who're these analysts? Are they in India? Are they facing the attacks or coming under pressure to analyse and prevent such attacks from taking place in future?

Rohan Gunaratna, a terrorism expert at the International Center for Political Violence and Terrorism Research in Singapore, said he believed the terrorists were from India.

"The earlier generation of terrorist groups in India were mostly linked to Pakistan," he said. "But today we are seeing a dramatic change. They are almost all homegrown groups."

Who's he?? Any reason that we should believe him more than what evidences are being currently produced??

Originally posted by: return_to_hades

@Souro - Do keep us posted on the Mumbai perspective. It is always a matter of grave interest for me when something hits so close to home.

Originally posted by: chal_phek_mat

Politics already on...soon references to mumbaikers' resilient spirit will start....I just hope the loss of all the brave police and armed forces men is not in vain...hopefully this incident can be a watershed event in the anti terrorsim fight of India

Originally posted by: mini2390

And, how come all Indian sources and the Indian media is blaming it on India..how come most of the world..even news channels such as CNN and BBC have stated how Pak cant be blamed for this act for now??..no phone or anything of that sort provides any solid evidence that its Pak..how come the rest of the world is somewhat more level headed right now?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=563utXbPTUk


See this video..and what the colonel has stated...Like the Colonel stated - "India's default answer..Pakistan" 😊

Attributes of India attacks suggest outside help

Analyst: 'This is a new, horrific milestone in the global jihad'

Slide show

Attacks in Mumbai Click to view scenes from the multiple terrorist attacks in Mumbai, India. more photos

Video

Terrorism in the global perspective Nov. 27: NBC News military analyst Jack Jacobs places the Mumbai terror attacks in the larger picture of global terrorism and the groups that employ terror as a tactic. Nightly News

The Washington Post

Indian Commandos Battle Assailants Putin's Intentions Debated After He Changes Course and Supports Extending Presidential Term from 4 Years to 6 Characteristics of Plot Suggest Attackers Were Trained Outside India, Analysts Say Suicide Bomber Targets U.S. Convoy in Kabul; At Least 4 Killed Execution of Confessed Spy in China May Be Delayed Several Days

By Craig Whitlock and Karen DeYoung

updated 7:04 a.m. ET, Fri., Nov. 28, 2008

BERLIN - Counterterrorism officials and experts said the scale, sophistication and targets involved in the Mumbai attacks were markedly different from previous terrorist plots in India and suggested the gunmen had received training from outside the country. But they cautioned it was too soon to tell who may have masterminded the operation, despite an assertion from a previously unknown Islamist radical group.

Officials in India, Europe and the United States said likely culprits included Islamist networks based in Pakistan that have received support in the past from Pakistan's intelligence agencies.

Analysts said this week's attacks surpassed previous plots carried out by domestic groups in terms of complexity, the number of people involved and their success in achieving their primary goal: namely, to spread fear.

"This is a new, horrific milestone in the global jihad," said Bruce Riedel, a former South Asia analyst for the CIA and National Security Council and author of the book "The Search for Al Qaeda." "No indigenous Indian group has this level of capability. The goal is to damage the symbol of India's economic renaissance, undermine investor confidence and provoke an India-Pakistani crisis."

Several analysts and officials said the attacks bore the hallmarks of Lashkar-i-Taiba and Jaish-i-Muhammad, two networks of Muslim extremists from Pakistan that have targeted India before. Jaish-i-Muhammad was blamed for an attack on the Indian Parliament in 2001.

'Army of the Pious'
Both groups have carried out a long campaign of violence in the disputed territory of Kashmir, which India and Pakistan have fought over for six decades. The roots of the long-running conflict are religious: A majority of India's population is Hindu, while most Pakistanis are Muslim.

A U.S. counterterrorism official, speaking on the condition of anonymity, said Lashkar-i-Taiba, which means "Army of the Pious," and Jaish-i-Muhammad, or "Soldiers of Muhammad," are "the thing people are starting to look at. But I can't caution enough to treat it as a theory, a working assumption. It's still too early for hard and fast" conclusions.

"What the Indians have in their favor," the official added, "is that they've got some of these guys. It seems logical that they can expect to work their way back reasonably quickly." Indian officials said several gunmen were captured.

In its Friday editions, the newspaper the Hindu reported that at least three of the suspects held by police were members of Lashkar-i-Taiba and that the assailants had arrived in Mumbai on a ship from Karachi, Pakistan.

Originally posted by: doggiedawg

Again, some of what you had was premised on the belief that the rest of the world can help us or that it would pay to suck up to them. That is too naive i feel. They can no more help anyone on any front than they can help themselves. They have been reduced to taking pot-shots at taliban targets in NWFP Pakistan, and to making trips to the middle east for barclays PLC type of dole-outs. They know what the deal is, but they are pretty helpless, not much to be gained there. We need to develop indigineous solutions without assuming we can rely on them.

I agree however that we should do a better PR job- starting with beautiful desi girls doing the spin on TV😉, instead of fat guys who look like they've just been chewing tambaku. 😆But let's face it. The Chinese dont look very pretty on tv and they've managed to do quite nicely. What we need is a massive change in mind-set and a real problem-solving attitude. No apologies for what we feel we need to do to fix our problems.

It takes just a few extremists to take the rest of us down, and no amount of good-will can change the deranged mind of these murderous fanatics. They are beyond reason. Given that, the solution is to build walls, put up blockades everywhere leading to cities, stop the free-flowing exchanges. The US did that- no one can get close to the white house, it takes a while to be get into NYC buildings, 1 hour lines to get into the transit lounge in london, and all that when they are virtually separated by waters from the rest of the world and have nice neighbors. These measures might make people angry, but not enough to drive them to terror i feel, and it would actually help foil attacks from others who are so inclined even when we've been so tolerant. The carefree attitude has to go, the attitude that allows people to walk into any place with ease. It's either that or it's periodic bouts with terrorism. What we need is a 0%-defect product, and unfortunately for that, you do need tight processes and strict control. It's not what i'd like, but i cant think of how you get to 0% otherwise. The bogey of better intelligence might sound good, but intelligence gathering is by definition a lagging game, not a leading one.

Thanks nehow for the debate!😊

Originally posted by: chal_phek_mat

what we have today is the attention of the world to India's problem of terrorism on its shore.We for years have been saying this is the handowork of some in Pakistan. We can fight this battle on our own, if we have the requisite political will and the backing of our fellow countrymen. We all know we are lacking on both the counts. So that leaves these sort of attacks to continue unabated.

Our objective is the state that the problems we face are the problems faced by the world community and we are at the forefront of it . The world media is watching the events unfold. What we need is someone to get onto the world TV such as CNN, BBC. Explain how these connections work, how they are everyone's common problem. Instead In absense of this people who have hardly any knowledge of the situation get onto TV b'cos they have Indian names or some connection to India and talk about the problems. Now someone else is defining your problem. Some of them speak with their own agenda.

How difficult is it to explain to Americans, hey these guys used AK-47, grenades, etc, look around you how abundant they are. Imagine how much this is possible in your case. With the opinion polling this gives impact to the newly minted president, who is still deciding how to frame his policy towards India/Pak. If we dont do it, the Pakistani Ambassador does it and then we keep crying oh they only do it for their benefit.

To back this up, they are sending their own intelligence folks to India considering their own citizens are involved. They need to show to their public they care for their citizens, give them enough information to look good. In turn they will give us something, get leverage on their govt's to put pressure on Zardari to act on his promises

If we dont do this and act as usual all of this party people will return to their usual chores with a blip on their memory that something like this happened. Back to the usual blame game with zero results.

Come on Mr. Pak. defense minister? Please do not tell us the attacks were not co-ordinated. Will Hindu's have attacked a Jewish place of worship? To kill 325 people are there any Inidans who hate other Indians so much? Do common Indian public possess grenades and other high military weapons?

If it was the aim to drag India into their problems of terrorism problems of Iraq and Afghanistan or African waters, One hopes our foreign ministry won't aim any more to police the world. Lets get our house in order first.

Originally posted by: souro

By the way, one thing you should bear in mind is that if someone says that some evidences are indicating that the terrorists might be from Karachi, doesn't mean that the Govt. of Pakistan is being accused. Yes there are Indians who've become extremists also, but most of the time they gain training at some terrorist camp located in Pakistan or Bangladesh, and that's why these countries continue to be linked to such activities. And yes there are proofs of terrorist training camps in both these countries and not just India but other countries also have provided proof for that but still they continue to exist.

Don't take things personally here. Just because these terrorists are linked to Karachi doesn't mean anyone's going to say that all Pakistanis are responsible for this. In a nation there are people of various nature, and we all know that most people are peace loving and good hearted. But then if someone is from a particular country then obviously it'll be said that he's a citizen of so and so country and it's the responsibility of that country's govt. to prevent such people from carrying out such acts in the future.