Karuvaki: Kalinga's princess?

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Alyx

@mystic786

Dazzler

Posted: 9 years ago

I know that everyone is used to historical inaccuracies being depicted in this show one after the other, but am I the only one who is bothered by the fact that the CVs are repeating the same mistake which was made by Santosh Sivan in the 2001 film, Asoka? There was much anger and debate about Karuvaki's status as a princess among the historians but it seems like the CVs have learned nothing from it.

I'm amazed at how they think that they can still portray Karuvaki as Kalinga's princess and get away with it.. I mean if they're depicting her as Kalinga's princess, who then was her father, the King of Kalinga? I don't remember reading anywhere that Kalinga was being ruled by a king or queen at the time of Ashoka's invasion. Even if it was being ruled by a king, Karuvaki was NOT that king's daughter, that much is confirmed.The CVs can't play around with something as important as Kalinga's history. The Maurya-Kalinga war was the only major war that Ashoka fought and it's significance cannot be over-emphasized.

After watching the current Taxila track, I'm really starting to believe that CAS is based more on the movie Asoka because Sid is being depicted more as SRK than Ashoka the Great and Karuvaki is being depicted as Kareena (the heroine of the movie) rather than Queen Karuvaki.

I'd expressed my disappointment regarding this matter in another thread as well.. what's wrong with showing Karuvaki as a fisherman's daughter, which she actually was? She was a commoner, you can't change that fact or change history for that matter. The viewers would not have disliked her or hated her just because she was a commoner and not a princess.

For eg - Ashoka's own mother, Dharma, was a commoner, and she is portrayed as such but no one hates her or dislikes her because of this.

The only plausible explanation of all this is is that the CVs are building up to an epic fake love-story: Ashoka, the greatest of the Mauryan emperors, falls madly in love with Karuvaki, the princess of Kalinga (his worst enemy). And I'm not liking it all, I could've watched the movie again if I wanted to see this.

PS: I have absolutely nothing against Karuvaki. I just think that the CVs should not wrongly portray her as a princess. Also, the CVs can show Ashoka and Karuvaki's love story all they want because she was an important part of Ashoka's life, but they should at least do it in a mature way. I absolutely despise these stupid "hate turns to love" or "hero falls in love with his enemy's daughter" love stories.

For me, the only real love story of Ashoka's life was with Asandhimitra. It is quite clear that they shared a great relationship with each other and that Ashoka valued her companionship above all. Hence, she was his chief consort for 30 years, until her death.

Edited by mystic786 - 9 years ago

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babur1527

@babur1527

Voyager

Posted: 9 years ago

I wholeheartedly agree with the post. Hated the Asoka movie. I am probably one of the very few in the forum here.

The story between Ashok and Asandhimitra would have been so unique.

Asandhimitra herself would have been a unique heroine. I was expecting that she would be like a more positive Helena. Sharp witted, knowledgeable and deals with everything with a touch of class. She doesn't need a sword to deal with her enemies.

And her companionship with Ashok is something that audiences(historical audiences that actually care) would have enjoyed.

I don't know about anyone else, but I for one am sick and tired of warrior princesses. Cliched, over-hyped and over done.

KVK should have been portrayed as a commoner. And a religious one who sees the light in then Chandaal Ashok's dark heart. It is not only loyal to history but it also makes sense as to why Chandaal Ashok becomes Dharma Ashok after Kaurwaki walks into his life.

Edited by babur1527 - 9 years ago

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keerthi1234

@keerthi1234

Explorer

Posted: 9 years ago

count me in too... even I am dissapointed wid these fake representations. assandhimitra is the only wife of ashok who is a royal and she is his chief consort. she is the only wife of him who didn't bore any children and still a chief queen until her death, this shows how imp. she is in his political affairs... don't know what explanation does cvs give for making assandhi as a chief queen but not karuwaki who is his 'true love' acc to dem

I have nothing against d queen karuwaki, she along wid devi are also imp. people in ashok's life

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Nirmita srivastava

@nirmita

Navigator

Posted: 9 years ago

count me too the Cv have done the biggest blunder of thier show hope they don't do it their life. 😡

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Shailaja

@shailusri1983

Dazzler

+ 3

Posted: 9 years ago

I second your views on tampering with history. But I think the CVs didn't find it interesting to have a commner as one of Ashok's favorite wives, Karuwaki. They actually needed a princess here to suit their artistic sensibilities.

Just think about all the kids watching the serial and imagining that this was how the mighty Ashoka the Great used to be. You just cannot explain to them the fact that this is not true history or that it comes with a disclaimer that there are many fictious additions, omissions and distortions from the actual history. All this happens on national television with impunity.

Even this fascination for the one true love of an emperor who belonged to the past ages is nothing but the attempt to impose our modern sensibilities on an ancient set up. Kings married a number of times. Several of the wives were his favorites or important in his life in their own peculiar way. Pologamy was a truth of those times. There were cultures where polyandry was common. Does this mean that there is one true love among all these marriages and the rest are irrelevant? Show things as they were.

So great is the impact of these Natakiya Rupanthars that despite all my above views, I found it very difficult to write my own FF without incorporating many of them and taking several creative liberties with actual history.

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capricornrcks

@capricornrcks

Voyager

Posted: 9 years ago

Originally posted by: babur1527
I wholeheartedly agree with the post. Hated the Asoka movie. I am probably one of the very few in the forum here.

At the time the movie was released, I was so darned grateful to see a 'genuine historical bollywood' movie. When was the last time they did anything historical before that? Amrapaali? The movie got a lot of things wrong, but it got a lot of things right too (Sushok rivalry, how Sushim's mom influenced the emperor etc).

Originally posted by: babur1527
I don't know about anyone else, but I for one am sick and tired of warrior princesses. Cliched, over-hyped and over done.

Oh yes me too.Hollywood is chock full of kick ass women.We can put the blame squarely there. But CAS had shown us so many different kinds of women. IIRC Noor is the only woman who had martial arts training.So it is likely that they'll depict each of Ashok's wives differently.

Originally posted by: babur1527
KVK should have been portrayed as a commoner.

As far as the general population is concerned (including CAS CVs) if it is shown in a Bollywood movie, it is written in stone.

Originally posted by: shailusri1983
Even this fascination for the one true love of an emperor who belonged to the past ages is nothing but the attempt to impose our modern sensibilities on an ancient set up. Kings married a number of times. Several of the wives were his favorites or important in his life in their own peculiar way. Pologamy was a truth of those times. There were cultures where polyandry was common. Does this mean that there is one true love among all these marriages and the rest are irrelevant? Show things as they were..

Again the movie is partly to blame for that.Devi was not given much importance in the movie.From this people inferred that Kaurwaki was Ashok's one and only love.The CAS show is following suit.As you say, we impose our modern sensibilities on people who lived in another era.Ashok must have loved each of the women at a certain time and then moved on to another one who caught his interest.Even though we admire him for his many esteemed values it doesn't take away the fact that he was an ancient Casinova.

Edited by capricornrcks - 9 years ago

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priya routray

@staryypriya

Beginner

+ 2

Posted: 9 years ago

i think she was kalinga's princess...coz i have read in some book that one of the reason of kalinga war was kalinga's princess..but she never wanted to get married ...bt i m nt sure if her name was karuvaki or not

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Alyx

@mystic786

Dazzler

Posted: 9 years ago

@bold And I agree with yours 😆👍🏼 Anyways about the movie, I think it's production value, sets, costumes, actors, soundtrack (omg it was mesmerizing) were absolutely brilliant but the downfall of the movie was obviously the historical inaccuracies and the over emphasis on Ashoka's love story. 🤢🤢

I agree, Ashoka and Asandhimitra's story would've been a delight to watch. I feel like their relationship was much similar to what Ashoka and Ahankara had shared with each other, like Ahankara had said, "Ashok aur mera ek ankaha sa rishta hai" and "hum dono ek doosre ke liye bane hain". There was this level of maturity and understanding that they shared with each other (that too, at such a young age) which was absolutely endearing to watch. That is why I was so disappointed when Ahankara did not turn out to be Asandhimitra.

Yes, Asandhimitra could definitely be a more positive version of Helena. I think that she should be portrayed as possessing all the qualities that you mentioned.

@bold I couldn't agree more. The CVs are obviously portraying Karuvaki as a warrior princess and I absolutely hate it. It's such a cliche that only warrior princesses can be independent, smart, witty and strong. Look at Helena, for example, she does not fight with swords etc. but she is one hell of a powerful woman and empress, mainly due to her intellect.

Originally posted by: babur1527

I wholeheartedly agree with the post. Hated the Asoka movie. I am probably one of the very few in the forum here.

The story between Ashok and Asandhimitra would have been so unique.

Asandhimitra herself would have been a unique heroine. I was expecting that she would be like a more positive Helena. Sharp witted, knowledgeable and deals with everything with a touch of class. She doesn't need a sword to deal with her enemies.

And her companionship with Ashok is something that audiences(historical audiences that actually care) would have enjoyed.

I don't know about anyone else, but I for one am sick and tired of warrior princesses. Cliched, over-hyped and over done.

KVK should have been portrayed as a commoner. And a religious one who sees the light in then Chandaal Ashok's dark heart. It is not only loyal to history but it also makes sense as to why Chandaal Ashok becomes Dharma Ashok after Kaurwaki walks into his life.

Edited by mystic786 - 9 years ago

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Alyx

@mystic786

Dazzler

Posted: 9 years ago

@bold

Yeah they did get some things right. They also depicted Dharma's position in Bindusara's life and in the palace correctly. I think that the CVs should've shown Susima's mother's influence in CAS also because I don't see any reason as to why Ashoka would become Chand Ashoka when his father pampers him so much and sings his praises all the time. In CAS, Ashoka has a great relationship with Bindusara, in fact, much better than the relationship that Susima has with him 😕😕

No, actually, in Hollywood, historical women are also portrayed as having great intellect and political shrewdness. And these women are positive characters NOT negative ones, but in Indian shows, every shrewd person is a villain. And the brainless idiots are the positive heroes/heroines.

Yeah, I agree that people generally believe that "what Bollywood movies depict is completely true and right."

The movie is definitely to be blamed for the false notion that "Karuvaki was Ashoka's one true love". I hate how they treated Devi in the movie 🤢 It has clearly been mentioned in sources that Ashoka did love Devi and that his "beloved and dear consort" was his chief queen, Asandhimitra. Here, is the evidence, that he did love two women. After he left Devi in Vedisa, he moved on in his life with Asandhimitra.

Originally posted by: capricornrcks

At the time the movie was released, I was so darned grateful to see a 'genuine historical bollywood' movie. When was the last time they did anything historical before that? Amrapaali? The movie got a lot of things wrong, but it got a lot of things right too (Sushok rivalry, how Sushim's mom influenced the emperor etc).

Oh yes me too.Hollywood is chock full of kick ass women.We can put the blame squarely there. But CAS had shown us so many different kinds of women. IIRC Noor is the only woman who had martial arts training.So it is likely that they'll depict each of Ashok's wives differently.

As far as the general population is concerned (including CAS CVs) if it is shown in a Bollywood movie, it is written in stone.

Again the movie is partly to blame for that.Devi was not given much importance in the movie.From this people inferred that Kaurwaki was Ashok's one and only love.The CAS show is following suit.As you say, we impose our modern sensibilities on people who lived in another era.Ashok must have loved each of the women at a certain time and then moved on to another one who caught his interest.Even though we admire him for his many esteemed values it doesn't take away the fact that he was an ancient Casinova.

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Alyx

@mystic786

Dazzler

Posted: 9 years ago

#10

No, that is just a story. It goes something like this, "Ashoka was enamoured with Karuvaki's beauty (who was the princess of Kalinga) and thus, attacked Kalinga, to win her over."

Originally posted by: staryypriya
i think she was kalinga's princess...coz i have read in some book that one of the reason of kalinga war was kalinga's princess..but she never wanted to get married ...bt i m nt sure if her name was karuvaki or not

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Karuvaki: Kalinga's princess?

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