Dearth of Music Directors, not Singers - Page 2

Originally posted by: Jaadoogar

I have few questions:

If they were not STARS then what were they?

If they were nothing why do we remember them and why should some people put them at par with devi-devta?

Who do make a singer/MD star or Legend?

Why did not Rafi saheb keep getting songs in Kishore Kumar era, even if Rafi Saab was more versatile and technically sound?

To me everything starts and ends with public, When public liked Rafi Saab he was star in that era, when public started liking KK, KK was star, when public was liking Naushaaad saab composition he was star, when public started liking RD Burman, RDB became star. It is public choice which dictates the thing. If public of this era like Sonu then Sonu is the Star of this era, if public like ARR 's composition then ARR is star... Time will never remain same, Clock will keep ticking, one star will go and other will come.....

.jaadoo ji..although the time will change and it might be true that public dictates who will be star .you urself have said why we remember rafi sahib ,so there has to be something in them that todays singers/MD might not have..

If you look at it honestly , the music in films has been changing in response to what sells. It is almost possible to listen to songs and approximately determine the time when this kind of tunes sold.

I believe that even present composers are capable of composing songs of any standard and they have demonstrated as well but constrained by what sells. As simple as demand creates supply.

the other thing is..for eg. in todays music talent shows ..they focus only on the vocal aspect of the singer. The background music and song compositions are ignored for the voice of the participant. However pure music is the synthesis of the voice and the background beats...and then we have music composers with ordinary skills in music, how acn be they a be a good judge???

Its almost like if the teacher is ordinery how cana student will prosper

Good point Jaadoo bhai. Even I didn't quite get what Punjini ji meant by old-timers not being stars. What is the criteria for being a 'star'?

Is it public adulation? Well, then no one has received as much adulation as the legends you mentioned.

Is it snobbish/egotistical behavior? Well, some of the people you mentioned have had some of the biggest egos in the music industry.

Is it financial status? Well, some of the old-timers have raked in money like nothing else (based on standards of the time). And wasn't it Asha ji who said that lakshmi follows saraswati? So people who are great singers/musicians should, by implication, be rich, and hence 'stars'.

Originally posted by: Jaadoogar

I have few questions:

If they were not STARS then what were they?

If they were nothing why do we remember them and why should some people put them at par with devi-devta?

Who do make a singer/MD star or Legend?

Why did not Rafi saheb keep getting songs in Kishore Kumar era, even if Rafi Saab was more versatile and technically sound?

To me everything starts and ends with public, When public liked Rafi Saab he was star in that era, when public started liking KK, KK was star, when public was liking Naushaaad saab composition he was star, when public started liking RD Burman, RDB became star. It is public choice which dictates the thing. If public of this era like Sonu then Sonu is the Star of this era, if public like ARR 's composition then ARR is star... Time will never remain same, Clock will keep ticking, one star will go and other will come.....

They were respected music directors and singers. They were artists who were well grounded and followed the principle that Ashaji enunciated - try to seek knowledge (Sarasvati) first and foremost and wealth (Lakshmi) will follow. No MD said "main isko star bana doonga" or "main is se HIT song gawaaunga".

The word 'star" smacks of publicity and limelight. Today, there is absolutely no desire to seek learning. The aim is to somehow get rich overnight. No wonder there is no depth in music. The core values are missing.

Thanks for a thought provoking thread..

Things seems to have changed..there is completely new culture..

the films are being financed by the underworld
the technology has completely changed
we are now talking about 1000 tunes in the stock
the situations in the films are different, villian is the hero..
Good music directors are without work..Ismail recently said he may completely change his music for the sake of roti..
it is a buisness and not a sadhna..
MD's seems to be thinking of roti at present and not immortality of their music..

Just my pov..

Originally posted by: Sur_Sangam

Thanks for a thought provoking thread..

Things seems to have changed..there is completely new culture..

the films are being financed by the underworld
the technology has completely changed
we are now talking about 1000 tunes in the stock
the situations in the films are different, villian is the hero..
Good music directors are without work..Ismail recently said he may completely change his music for the sake of roti..
it is a buisness and not a sadhna..
MD's seems to be thinking of roti at present and not immortality of their music..

Just my pov..

🤣 some are seeking roti and some are eating gold 🤣

okk.... Saregamapa show has the biggest hand in keeping the old gems in mind of people.... or may be at home u listened to music since childhood.... if u ask me...

I did nt know many old singers, whom u call as legend until i came to IF..... because at our home we never listened to music whether old or new.... I remembered the songs with whom on they are picturised than who sang it or who was MD....

The future generation does nt and will not remember the golden era music... they will listen to whatever they like.... may be pritam... everyone needs change and so is music....

But i agree with one point of situations.... but if the director of the film wants all the songs in dreams in skimppy clothes what can a music director do😆...... Also there are many MDs... who have tunes ready... then fix it to lyrics then fix it to situations or dreams.... the emphasis is more on getting enjoyable music than getting it tuned with movie script....

Its like a kiss put inside and said script needed it😆.... the actress says.... what no kiss in the movie.... how can the movie run on the theatre.... i hope a nice example for todays music😆

What primarily distinguishes the music directors, singers and artists of yore from today is this. MDs back then composed music, because they were deeply committed to it. They lived and breathed music. Nowhere, did they think, 'Ok, what will people have to say about this song of mine? Let me cater to what people want. I want my song to sell.' No wonder, most of the music by SD, Roshan, Salil Chowdhury, Jaidev and others were so very inspiring! You heard it once and it was unlikely you would ever, ever forget it again.

Same goes for singers back then. They didn't start off by wanting to be stars. They naturally became one with the quality of their work...their voice. Even MDs complemented what the singers brought to the music. It was all reciprocal. The fine creations of MDs brought out the best in singers too.

The moment one starts playing to the gallery, the magic is gone. Like Satyajit Ray would often say about his movies. They weren't for just anyone and everyone. They were for an intelligent and thinking audience. And anyway, he said that he didn't make movies based on what people wanted. He made movies, for the love of it and because he felt there was such and such an issue, which he felt should be highlighted. It's precisely because of this that his movies are so special and people still want to see it again and again. Same goes for music that also came straight from the heart back then.

Today, we have song writers who write songs just like making samosas (by tens of dozens) in minutes. 90% of songs have no meaning, to top it of why add english wording to it?
********** Then we have MD's such as mr. GOD the topiwalla, the best thing since sliced bread. Where all this will lead to?? Bad music. We have so many talented singers whom are not being used at all and I find it very strange that the big stars are not even asking for these good singers to sing their songs. It is as though no one gives a damn. Everyone is trying to make more & more money out of all this garbage.
I think as a public we should not listen, buy or support these half singers. that will fix it.

**Edited by moderator for using abusive words***

The word I was seeking was sadhana, which Sur Sangamji mentioned in his post. In the golden era, the MDs did sadhana and the singers did the same. It was music for the sake of music, not music for the sake of making "stars", giving "hits" and doing "shows".

No doubt there were egos even then, OPN is the biggest example of that - but they did not compromise on the quality of music. SD Burman's advice to his son was "forget a song as soon as you have recorded it. Don't hear it again" and that's how SD went on to compose songs each better than before, and even the last song he made from "Mili" before he breathed his last, has us breathless.

Music was a kind of striving towards perfection, and also a way of reaching out to the divine in the era gone by. Money came last in the reckoning. That is why the music sounds so fresh even after it has been played a thousand times.