Confused about Ravan's curse??!! - Page 2

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desichica thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#11

Originally posted by: Chandraketu

Deichica

I for one love questions such as yours, and if you think you're annoying, I think I'm anal 😆😆 Anyway, there are 2 versions of this in the dwapar yuga - one has Jaya/Vijaya reborn as Kamsa and Shishupala, and the other has them reborn as Shishupal & Dantavakra.

Honestly, I had never heard about Dantavakra. I'll read him up in the link above and elsewhere, and hopefully learn more.

Vishnu's 10th avatar will be Kalki. As far as Kali goes, I too am often confused between Kali - the manifestation of Devi Parvati, and Kali as in Kal-yug. I'll find out more and post more about Kali later.

Hehe...thanx Chandraketu....i guess i think i'm annoying cuz i'm very talkative and inquisitive..lol😆😆😆!!!!!! And hey there is nothing wrong in being anal!!!!!
Wutever information you do get please let me know....i mean i asked for only one question but Vibhishna and Ananya gave me more answers...and if u know and find out more....i'll be glad to hear it!!!!😃
sitakshii thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#12

Originally posted by: Vibhishna

There were two gate keepers Jay and Vijay. Here is the story I have read. There may be different versions of this story too.

Long long ago, at the very beginning of time, Lord Brahma created four boys and blessed them to live as eternal boy - saints. These four saints were named Sanaka, Sanandana, Sanatana and Sanathkumara. The four boys had miraculous powers. Once, they decided to visit Lord Vishnu. After getting the permission and blessings from their father Lord Brahma, the four saints set out for the abode of Lord Vishnu, Vaikundha.
Vaikundha has seven gates (or doors). The four saints crossed six gates but were stopped at the seventh gate by Jay and Vijay. The two of them did not let them enter this last gate. Being saints they wore only their loincloths. Jay and Vijay insulted them saying that they were not even properly dressed. The four of them reminded Jay and Vijay that they were sons of Brahma. But Jay and Vijay did not listen. They accused the four boys of creating a scene and threatened that they will be thrown out of Vaikundha. This insult was too much. The four boys got so angry that they cursed Jay and Vijay to be born as demons on the earth as they were too arrogant to be in such a sacred place. The whole Vaikundha trembled due to their rage.
As usual, Jay and Vijay realised their mistake too late and begged the saints for mercy and to remove their curse. At this moment Lord Vishnu appeared along with Goddes Lakshmi. The four boys felt very happy to have got the darshan of the Lord. Jay and Vijay pleaded to Lord Vishnu to remove the curse. Lord Vishnu told them that their behavior was unpardonable. Never before had the four saints cursed anybody. Hence, their curse must take effect. Feeling pity for the gate keeprs, the sages requested Lord Vishnu, "Let there be happiness before their curse ends."
Lord Vishnu gave them a choice - to be born a hundred times as his devotees or be born thrice as his enemies. Jay and Vijay chose to be born thrice as Lord Vishnu's enemies so that they can return sooner. They also requested that they should not forget him (Lord Vishnu) throughout their lives and that Lord Vishnu himself must kill them.
And so they were born as Hiranya and Hiranyakaship and were killed by Varaha and Narasimha respectively in thier first birth. Next they were born as Ravan and Kumbhkaran and were killed by Ram. Thirdly, they were born as Sishupala and Dantavaktra (or Dantavakra). (Dantavkra, I am actually confused who he is. Some say he was Krishna's nephew as Sishupaal was and some say that he was Sishupal's brother, some say he was an ally of Jarasandh and was a close friend of Sishupaal, Rukmi and Shalv.) Krishna killed him in a duel (with the mace or the gada). Some versions say that Dantavaktra was killed by Bheem. I don't know which of these is true.
Another diversion of this story is that Jay and Vijay in their third life are Kans and Sishupaal - in this case both of them were killed by Krishna.
After completing the three births as demons on the earth, Jay and Vijay resumed their posts as gatekeepers of Vaikundha and continued their work with great humility.

totally agree wid u ,
as this story was shown in the show VISHNU PURAN (BR. CHOPRA'S) which used to come on zee tv ,
exactly the same story was shown !!!!
in BADRINATH pilgrimage(BADRINATH is the abode of LORD VISHNU in HIMALAYAS !!!!)
at HIMALAYAS ,there r 2 mountains which r named as jay-vijay & it is said that there 2 mountains wud coverup the whole BADRINATH temple soon in KALYUGA ,then no one wud b able to reach the BADRINATH pilgrimage !!!
3 yrs back i visited BADRINATH pilgrimage wid my parents inHIMALAYAS & i saw these 2 mountains ,
one of the priest showed us these 2 jay-vijay mountains ,which r valley shaped & situated side by side !!!
it is said tht these jay-vijay mountains out of their avenge for LORD VISHNU ,wud cover up the BADRINATH pilgrimage !!!
desichica thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#13

Originally posted by: sita11

totally agree wid u ,
as this story was shown in the show VISHNU PURAN (BR. CHOPRA'S) which used to come on zee tv ,
exactly the same story was shown !!!!
in BADRINATH pilgrimage(BADRINATH is the abode of LORD VISHNU in HIMALAYAS !!!!)
at HIMALAYAS ,there r 2 mountains which r named as jay-vijay & it is said that there 2 mountains wud coverup the whole BADRINATH temple soon in KALYUGA ,then no one wud b able to reach the BADRINATH pilgrimage !!!
3 yrs back i visited BADRINATH pilgrimage wid my parents inHIMALAYAS & i saw these 2 mountains ,
one of the priest showed us these 2 jay-vijay mountains ,which r valley shaped & situated side by side !!!
it is said tht these jay-vijay mountains out of their avenge for LORD VISHNU ,wud cover up the BADRINATH pilgrimage !!!

Wow that's wicked information sita!!!!!! 2 mountains wud unite and cover up the Badrinath temple just to avenge Lord Vishnu.....It's still a lil hard for me to digest that info..that those 2 mountains are going to cover up the temple!!!!! But that was also interesting info that I didn't know even existed!!!! Thanx so much sita dear for sharing that info!!!!
Vibhishna thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#14
totally agree wid u ,
as this story was shown in the show VISHNU PURAN (BR. CHOPRA'S) which used to come on zee tv ,
exactly the same story was shown !!!!
in BADRINATH pilgrimage(BADRINATH is the abode of LORD VISHNU in HIMALAYAS !!!!)
at HIMALAYAS ,there r 2 mountains which r named as jay-vijay & it is said that there 2 mountains wud coverup the whole BADRINATH temple soon in KALYUGA ,then no one wud b able to reach the BADRINATH pilgrimage !!!
3 yrs back i visited BADRINATH pilgrimage wid my parents inHIMALAYAS & i saw these 2 mountains ,
one of the priest showed us these 2 jay-vijay mountains ,which r valley shaped & situated side by side !!!
it is said tht these jay-vijay mountains out of their avenge for LORD VISHNU ,wud cover up the BADRINATH pilgrimage !!!
Wow that's wicked information sita!!!!!! 2 mountains wud unite and cover up the Badrinath temple just to avenge Lord Vishnu.....It's still a lil hard for me to digest that info..that those 2 mountains are going to cover up the temple!!!!! But that was also interesting info that I didn't know even existed!!!! Thanx so much sita dear for sharing that info!!!!
I didn't watch Vishnu Puraan fully - I must have missed it. I read this story from books.
I heard a different story some time before. I may be totally wrong, but the two mountains are called Nar and Narayan peaks, isn't it? Nar and Narayan were twin sages who were aspects of Lord Vishnu manifested on earth for the good of mankind. They were performed severe austerities in Badrinaath. Lord Indra who did not want them to attain divine powers through this worship, sent many apsaras to disturb them. On seeing this, Narayan struch his thigh. From his thigh came an apsara damsel so beautiful and graceful that she put the other apsaras sent by Indra to shame. She excelled all others in beauty, grace, singing and dancing. Since she was born from the thigh (Ur, I think, is the sanskrit word for thigh) she was named Urvashi. Indra acknowledged his defeat and begged forgiveness from Nar and Narayan. After the completion of the austerities, the sages gifted Urvashi to Indra. This story is from the Mahabharatha, and according to the Mahabharath, Nar and Narayan were reincarnated as Krishn and Arjun in the Dwapara Yug. I don't know whether the sages themselves reside in the two mountains or the mountains were named after the two of them, I heard that the hills were named Nar and Narayan. And it is in the valley between these two hills we can find the Badrinaath Temple.
But the story of Jay and Vijay hills was interesting too. I've never heard this one before. Thank you for sharing it Sita ji.
If I'm wrong about the two mountains that cradlethe Badrinaath temple, please correct me.
Vibhishna thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#15

Originally posted by: ananyacool

Well Kali is a demon which personifies the Kali Yuga, its portrayed as an ugly demon with dog-like protruding mouth wearing a red loin cloth and gold jewellery; The most famous incarnation of Kali is duryodhana, as per Bhagvat

Also when King Parikshit-grandson of Arjun ascends the throne of Hastinapur, he witnesses a strange incident one day while he goes hunting. He sees a very ugly man beating a cow and an Ox and brutally wounds the Ox breaking its three legs and is about to break the remaining one, when Parikshit intervenes , he stops that man and makes him helpless, that man is no ordinary person but kaliyuga; Kali begs him of mercy saying that since one cannot stop 'TIME' , kali should stay on. Cow was earth personified and Ox was Dharma and its three brken legs represent 'penence' 'cleanliness' and mercy and the fourth one which kali coudn't break is 'Truth'.
kali yuga asks him of four places to dwell and Parikshit hesitantly grants him places such as in gold, brothels, gambling dens and slaughter houses but he doesn't realise that he (parikshit )was wearing gold too hence Kali influences his mind and he ends up insulting sage shameeka only to be cursed from sages son that the snake which Parikshit winds around the sage as an insult, that snake would come to life and kill parikshit when bitten.
Kali also influences Nala the king of Nishadas and tempts him to gamble and lose all his possession , separate from his wife Damayanti and hiis children, this tale is narrated to Yudhisthira by some sages when he too meets the same state.
Kalki the tenth avatar of Vishnu will bring an end to Kali at the end of Kali yuga , under the training of Parushurama he will become invincible and will establish righteousness - Kalki Puran
Hope this helps, desichica
(sorry i don't know ur name)

Thanks for the information.
My knowledge of Kali Yug still remains woefully incomplete. I haven't completed reading and understanding it. 😭😭😭 I tried but its pretty complex and I need time to understand and contemplate it before I tell anyone else about it.
About Parikshit, it was said that the day he ascended the throne was the beginning of Kali Yuga. Here is the story I have read.
One day, Parikshit went hunting and he felt very thirsty. On the way, he saw an ashram. He entered it and bowed down to the sage and asked for some water. The sage Shameekha who was absorbed in meditation was totally unaware of the presence ofthe king. Agonised by his thirst, Parikshit thought that the sage was ignoring him wantedly. He found a dead snake nearby and put it around the sage's neck and went away.
Sage Shameekha's son, Shringi came to the ashram and was aghast to see the insult done to his father. In a fit of rage, he cursed that the one who did this will be bitten by the king of snakes Takshak within a week and die. When sage Shameek rose from his meditation, he came to know of Shringi's curse and told him to at least inform the king of this. He said that Parikshit did this as a result of a misunderstanding, the Lord of the Universe, Sri Krishna himself protected Parikshit when he was in his mother's womb and it would do well atlest to inform him of his fate. Parikshit was informed of this and he felt very bad for having misunderstood the sage. He spent the 7 remaining days of the life listening to the glories of Lord Krishna.
Every day Parikshit would listen to the story of Krishna Leela and the Mahabharatha from the parrot faced rishi Sukha surrounded by many brahmins. On the seventh day, Takshak, proceeded to kill him disguised as a brahmin. On the way, he met another brahmin and he started a conversation with him. The other brahmin said that he was going to save Parikshit. If he does so, the king will reward him well and his poverty will disappear. Takshak (disguised as a brahmin) asked him how he could do that. To this he replied, that by the grace of his guru, he can even cure even a person poisoned by Adhisesha.
Takshak assumed his real form and told the brahmin that he will bite the nearby banyan tree. If the brahmin can bring it back to life, he (Takshak) will be convinced of his powers. Takshak bit the tree. The tree was reduced to ashes. The brahmin sprinkled some water from his kamandal (his water jug) and the tree came back to life as it was before. Takshak was amazed. He offered the brahmin a lot of gold coins and told him, "This is more than any king in theworld can offer. Please accept this and go back. Allow fate to take its course." The brahmin agreed and accepted Takshak's offer. (Another version says that the brahmin refused Takshak and was threatened by Takshak that he (the brahmin) will be bitten before he can reach the king and who will save him, then. And so the brahmin accepted.)
At the end of the seventh day, Takshak who was seated among the brahmins, transformed into a snake and bit Parikshit. Pariksiht, having heard the glorious storis of the Lord durign his last days, attained liberation from furture births.
One doubt though . . .
Who was that brahmin? Some say that he was Sage Kashyap - of this I'm not convinced. I'm guessing that it was a desciple of Maharishi Kashyap. Besides, Takshak would have reacognised Maharishi Kashyap easily.
Vibhishna thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#16

Originally posted by: desichica

Hehe...thanx Chandraketu....i guess i think i'm annoying cuz i'm very talkative and inquisitive..lol😆😆😆!!!!!! And hey there is nothing wrong in being anal!!!!!
Wutever information you do get please let me know....i mean i asked for only one question but Vibhishna and Ananya gave me more answers...and if u know and find out more....i'll be glad to hear it!!!!😃

There is nothing wrong in being inquisitive. The first step to learning is to ask questions. I like the questions that come up in this (Ramayan) forum and I have many questions myself. I was dismissed many times before for asking too many questions. My questions never seemed to end. So, most of the time, I had to find otu stuff the hard way. Reading more and more, searching voraciously for asnwers, thinking, pondering, contemplating and breaking my head before I arrive at a conclusion I'm satisfied with. Yet, I haven't read so much as to answer all the questions that may come up. My knowledge is still a shell in the ocean (though I admit its a big shell). 😆😆😆
I will share any information I know and will obtain in the future. I'm glad that I found friends who are willing to share information and who are interested in our scriptures. Being so inquisitive myself, I would be interested in any question asked from the scriptures.
Someday, I hope to read all the scriptual literatures available (first from India and then proceed to the other countries).
sitakshii thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#17
@ vibhishan ,nar & narayan mountains r there where exactly the temple of BADRINATH is situated ,nar-naranyan were the manly form of LORD VISHNU !!!
but these 2 mountains JAY & VIJAY r a bit far from the temple ,it is said that jay & vijay mountains r gonna block the way to badrinath out of their avenge & then no one wud b able to go for the darshan of badrinath god !!! & then the main IDOLS which r kept at the BADRINATH temple wud b brought down at a place called JOSHIMATH ,there another badrinath temple wud b made & the idols of the badrinath temple wud b kept there ,
still much time is left ,as the RAWALJI (the main priest who can only touch the idol of lord vishnu & cud only perform poooj at the temple after naradji ,as naradji do the pooja for the 6 months during winter season & the next 6 months only RAWALJI is allowed to touch the idols at the temple !!!!) SAYS tht still much time is left in tht !!1
u can ask anypriest there abt the jay & vijay parvats ,they will show u those 2 brown colored mountains !!!
there 2 mountains cud b very well seen !!!
Edited by sita11 - 16 years ago
Vr15h thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#18

Originally posted by: Vibhishna

Thanks for the information.
One day, Parikshit went hunting and he felt very thirsty. On the way, he saw an ashram. He entered it and bowed down to the sage and asked for some water. The sage Shameekha who was absorbed in meditation was totally unaware of the presence ofthe king. Agonised by his thirst, Parikshit thought that the sage was ignoring him wantedly. He found a dead snake nearby and put it around the sage's neck and went away.
At the end of the seventh day, Takshak who was seated among the brahmins, transformed into a snake and bit Parikshit. Pariksiht, having heard the glorious storis of the Lord durign his last days, attained liberation from furture births.

Vibs

The version I read - granted it was from ACK - was different. There, reason Pariskshit went to the Ashram was to ask for directions. The sage, due to his vrath of silence, said nothing, and hence Parikshit decided to slight him and put that snake around his neck.

Also, Parikshit, when he heard of this, did try to shield himself by having a tower palace built, and having everything that went inside thoroughly inspected. Despite that, Takshak, in the form of a worm, made his way into a bowl of fruit, and transformed into a snake and bit Parikshit. He could not have liberated Parikshit from future births, since only death at the hands of Vishnu or Shiva does that.

Parikshit's son Janamejaya, when he came of age, decided to avenge his father's death and performed a massive yagna that involved the sacrifice of snakes. This was at Kurukshetra, and it was here that a deciple of Vyasa first narrated the Mahabharat to him (the main Mahabharat story is encapsulated in the story of Janamejaya). At the end of it all, when the yagna was about to claim Takshak, a voice from the skies assured Janamejaya that Takshak, who had taken refuge with Indra, would not do any more damage to the Pandava kul, and that's how Takshak was saved. (Akhl posted about Takshak a few weeks back, and how Indra saved him during the burning of the Khandavprastha forest)

Exit question of my own: why did Indra prefer to save Takshak, rather then punish him for the wanton killing of his own great-grandson Parikshit?
RamKiSeeta thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#19

Originally posted by: Chandraketu

Vibs

The version I read - granted it was from ACK - was different. There, reason Pariskshit went to the Ashram was to ask for directions. The sage, due to his vrath of silence, said nothing, and hence Parikshit decided to slight him and put that snake around his neck.

Also, Parikshit, when he heard of this, did try to shield himself by having a tower palace built, and having everything that went inside thoroughly inspected. Despite that, Takshak, in the form of a worm, made his way into a bowl of fruit, and transformed into a snake and bit Parikshit. He could not have liberated Parikshit from future births, since only death at the hands of Vishnu or Shiva does that.

Parikshit's son Janamejaya, when he came of age, decided to avenge his father's death and performed a massive yagna that involved the sacrifice of snakes. This was at Kurukshetra, and it was here that a deciple of Vyasa first narrated the Mahabharat to him (the main Mahabharat story is encapsulated in the story of Janamejaya). At the end of it all, when the yagna was about to claim Takshak, a voice from the skies assured Janamejaya that Takshak, who had taken refuge with Indra, would not do any more damage to the Pandava kul, and that's how Takshak was saved. (Akhl posted about Takshak a few weeks back, and how Indra saved him during the burning of the Khandavprastha forest)

Exit question of my own: why did Indra prefer to save Takshak, rather then punish him for the wanton killing of his own great-grandson Parikshit?

In the Bhagavata Purana, it says that in Janmejay's yagna, all snakes except Takshak were killed, so Takshak went to Indra Dev and asked him refuge, insisting that if he too died, the snake race would disappear. Indra Dev gave Takshak refuge, so that the snake race would not disappear.
And I think Parikshit attained liberation, because it says in our scriptures that listening or narrating the lord's leela gives one liberation, because not everyone has the boon of dying at the hands of Lord Vishnu or Lord Ishavara.
Vr15h thumbnail
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Posted: 16 years ago
#20

Originally posted by: godisone

In the Bhagavata Purana, it says that in Janmejay's yagna, all snakes except Takshak were killed, so Takshak went to Indra Dev and asked him refuge, insisting that if he too died, the snake race would disappear. Indra Dev gave Takshak refuge, so that the snake race would not disappear.

But Janamejaya was targetting only Takshak, not all the Nagas. If Indra had sacrificed Takshak upfront, no innocent Nagas would have had to die.

Originally posted by: godisone

And I think Parikshit attained liberation, because it says in our scriptures that listening or narrating the lord's leela gives one liberation, because not everyone has the boon of dying at the hands of Lord Vishnu or Lord Ishavara.

I disagree with this one on common sense alone. This means what - if I happen to be listening to a narration of the Ramayan or Mahabharat or the Puranas when I'm close to dying, I get out of the rebirth cycles? Only those whom the gods - namely Vishnu or Shiva - chose to destroy, were so liberated: everyone else stays in.
Edited by Chandraketu - 16 years ago

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