Samuel Colt & HELLgates

Ephemera thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#1
[guys i know i could have discussed this in the AT..but i needed wider participation..and may be my confusion gets clear..so created a topic]


In Season 2 Episode 22 "All Hell Breaks Loose" Part 2 we saw Bobby Dean Sam and Ellen discuss about the the hell gates

"

BOBBY Ellen, you mentioned a safe.

ELLEN A hidden safe we keep in the basement.

BOBBY Demons get what was in it?

ELLEN No (She pulls out a map from her pocket, unfolding it and setting it down on the table. It has several black lines and X's on it.)

DEAN Wyoming. What does that mean? (Pointing to the lines)


CUT TO:

BOBBY is reading from a large book

BOBBY I don't believe it. (He sets the book on a table)

SAM What? You got something?

BOBBY A lot more than that. Each of these X's (He points to the marks on the map) Is an abandoned frontier church-- all mid 19th century. And all of them built by Samuel Colt.

DEAN Samuel Colt--the demon-killing, gunmaking Samuel Colt?

BOBBY Yep. And there's more. He built private railway lines (He points to the black lines on the map) connecting church to church. It just happens to lay out like this. (He connects the points on the map until the shape of a star is made.)

DEAN Tell me that's not what I think it is.

SAM It's a Devil's Trap. A 100-square mile Devil's Trap.

DEAN That's brilliant. Iron lines demons can't cross.

ELLEN I've never heard of anything that massive.

BOBBY No one has.

DEAN And after all these years none of the lines are broken? I mean, it still works?

SAM Definitely

DEAN How do you know?

SAM All those omens Bobby found. I mean the demons, they must be circling and they can't get in.

BOBBY Yeah, well...they're trying.

ELLEN Why? What's inside?

DEAN That's what I've been looking for. And, uh, there's nothing except an old cowboy cemetery right in the middle.

SAM Well what's so important about a cemetery or...what's Colt trying to protect?

DEAN Well, unless...

BOBBY Unless what?

DEAN What if Colt wasn't trying to keep the demons out? What if he was trying to keep something in?

ELLEN Well that's a comforting thought.

DEAN Yeah, you think?

SAM Could they do it, Bobby? Could they get inside?

BOBBY This thing's so powerful, you'd practically need an A-bomb to destroy it. No way a full-blood demon gets across.

SAM No. (Pause) But I know who could."

my doubts here is

1] Did Samuel Colt actually Built the gates/doors?? or just protected it from being opened by vested interests??

2] If Samuel Really built the portal and gates..How did he do that?? i mean Did he too undergo these trials which sam is going through??

3] can't they time travel or something and discuss this with Colt himself??

4] Jake killing Sam was just an competition and winning thing?? an order from azazeal or was it a condition/rule to pay a price for closing the gate??

5] then again Ellen and bobby closed the door right?? ellen almost got killed in that fire...but she escaped it..so was sam who came back from dead...dean was doomed to die..all these can be an omen..or the price to close the hell gates?? if Yes then what bobby had to pay as a price..

6] when already the good side has closed the gate once why is it difficult now??

Edited by lakshmi_3004 - 12 years ago

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flutterby thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#2
i will do my best to answer ur questis... but they can be answered only by the experts... 😉

1. i feel that samuel has done both... built the gates and protected it from being opened by vested interests... this particular snippet that u have given in ur post is just a doorway to hell... i dont think its the actual gates of hell... coz in the end... they manage to close it.. as well..

2. this the cvs have to answer... how samuel built them.. or maybe god built them?? just like god imprisoned lucifer in his cage?? and samuel was just a vessel for god to implement his plans or creation into action..

3. well, time travel has been used by the creatives to their whim and fancy... maybe they can time travel... and meet samuel ..u really r providing some stuff for the cvs to work on L... 😉

4. actually, this was an elimination thing... jake, ava and the others along with sam were 'chosen' to be lucifer's vessel... apart from this, their having something to do with the gates wasnt shown.. i believe even the creatives havent thought as deeply as you did... L 😆

5. bobby... hmm... at that time.. of this closing of gates... with his life.. nothing... but he was unhappy in life... wasnt he? wife dead... no children... a drinker... trust me.. thats death as well

6. maybe the good side didnt see a loophole which the bad side did... and took advantage of..

hope i have done justice... 😳

Ephemera thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#3

Originally posted by: flutterby

i will do my best to answer ur questis... but they can be answered only by the experts... 😉
thats true lol
1. i feel that samuel has done both... built the gates and protected it from being opened by vested interests... this particular snippet that u have given in ur post is just a doorway to hell... i dont think its the actual gates of hell... coz in the end... they manage to close it.. as well..
done both?? built?? how can somebody Build a gate to hell?? i thought it was pre existing...i mean can a mortal build it??😕
2. this the cvs have to answer... how samuel built them.. or maybe god built them?? just like god imprisoned lucifer in his cage?? and samuel was just a vessel for god to implement his plans or creation into action..
CVs...how to get hold of one?? *thinks* lol ...yeah...that's an idea...but can mere mortal be vessel to God himself??😕
3. well, time travel has been used by the creatives to their whim and fancy... maybe they can time travel... and meet samuel ..u really r providing some stuff for the cvs to work on L... 😉
exactly dear..that's y i got the idea...instead of going through so many obstacles..can't they go and ask samuel already??🤔...😃 hope some CV stumbles upon this 😆
4. actually, this was an elimination thing... jake, ava and the others along with sam were 'chosen' to be lucifer's vessel... apart from this, their having something to do with the gates wasnt shown.. i believe even the creatives havent thought as deeply as you did... L 😆
thank you thank you...still ...haven't all have to pay something or other?? and to me it looked more like destiny rather than some demon's mind game😕
5. bobby... hmm... at that time.. of this closing of gates... with his life.. nothing... but he was unhappy in life... wasnt he? wife dead... no children... a drinker... trust me.. thats death as well
yeah...but that was even before he went on the path of closing the gate right??
6. maybe the good side didnt see a loophole which the bad side did... and took advantage of..

what kind of loophole??😕

hope i have done justice... 😳 you did awesome hon..loved discussing it

flutterby thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#4
what i meant was... maybe the actual gates of hell... arent built by anybody..they are pre existing... but the portals to hell... the paticular one that we r talking about was built by samuel... who obviously couldnt have done it himself.. he maybe had help from heaven or god.. 😕

aaahhh... i dont think the spn creatives will actually show god... again cant say whether a mortal can be a vessel to god... its up to the spn creatives to decide that... maybe they might show.. or not.. 😳

yeah agree with u on the destiny- demon mind game thing.. 👍🏼
see... if it were as easy as time travelling and asking samuel... the guys would have done it... but cvs have shown it to be very difficult... last time... cass wanted certain rare materials and lost some of his energy in transporting sam and dean.. there.. ( when they went to stop ana killing john and mary)

bobby... yes, maybe that time... he didnt pay anything and now he's dead... not to mention his soul was tortured in hell

what kind of loophole... no idea.. 🤔 . or maybe lucifer during his freerun opened the gates of hell.. he did all sorts of evil things... awoke death.. by killing demons.. reapers.. maybe he found a way toopen the gates of hell as well

Ephemera thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#5

Originally posted by: flutterby

what i meant was... maybe the actual gates of hell... arent built by anybody..they are pre existing... but the portals to hell... the paticular one that we r talking about was built by samuel... who obviously couldnt have done it himself.. he maybe had help from heaven or god.. 😕
ok ...pre existing is fine by me...but portals/gates are one and the same?? even in the taxi driver episode ajay had bought the boys to the "backyard" of hell..which goes through purgatory..so you need "portals " for purgatory ...and not hell😕...as its guarded by gates???😕

aaahhh... i dont think the spn creatives will actually show god... again cant say whether a mortal can be a vessel to god... its up to the spn creatives to decide that... maybe they might show.. or not.. 😳
ok fine let them not "show " god..but atleast "hint" it that he is near somewhere like in the end of Swan song when chuck dissappeared..[in that way Samulet will be back😃😈] cos...see in that episode were cas turns jimmy again for a few moments...he SAYS that it takes a lot of energy and maintenance to even host an angel ...then THINK about GOD ..who will be energy in its purest state...even when lucifer was a fallen angel..sam had to drink GALLONS of DB to host him...think about the creator of these angels fallen/otherwise...yeah in the end its upto the CVs
yeah agree with u on the destiny- demon mind game thing.. 👍🏼
see... if it were as easy as time travelling and asking samuel... the guys would have done it... but cvs have shown it to be very difficult... last time... cass wanted certain rare materials and lost some of his energy in transporting sam and dean.. there.. ( when they went to stop ana killing john and mary)
yeah i said easy in the sense...easier than the present trial thing...at least..i mean look at sam's mental/physical status?? and Cas has his own battle...Dean..pushed to the brink...if it could all be solved by "angel Zapping" ofc with a comparatively small price to play...things would be easier right??
bobby... yes, maybe that time... he didnt pay anything and now he's dead... not to mention his soul was tortured in hell
well NOW he is dead...may be are you saying that he payed the price by being in Hell for more than 1 year??😕
what kind of loophole... no idea.. 🤔 . or maybe lucifer during his freerun opened the gates of hell.. he did all sorts of evil things... awoke death.. by killing demons.. reapers.. maybe he found a way toopen the gates of hell as well

you make lucifer sound as "tantrum throwing infant" just like death said once😆
well when the KING of HELL was out...free..why WOULD he need to OPEN the gates🤔?? all summoning thingys are lost??😆 when Crowley "the Demon Salesman" like some critic quoted once...can bring in demons..even Demon Mutts as and when he pleases...y would Luci need to open the gates??😕 and what about Purgatory?? its so hard to find the portal...yet..Ajay takes the hand of Sam and Zapp...he is inside purgatory?? when in previous seasons...Cas had to Turn Against his team.do the unmentionable crime...go a long way...destroying himself to open it?? and even "eve" was freely coming and going from purgatory's portal in that dragon episode of season 6x12...then y the brothers (and cas teh repercussions) has to face so much to close the gates??😕

flutterby thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#6
again... its left upto the spn writers in deciding this... there r many loopholes in the story... some that the writers want us to guess for ourselves... this portal and gates thing is one of them... lets see what the spn writers think of...

yeah, but then if god came and solved all the problems... what will be left for the winchesters to do?? chadar odkhe so jaana?? 😛 then we wudnt get to over them

things would be easy... no doubt about that... but.. then how would we get to see the winchesters and cass fight it out... despite the many shortcomings... where is the story.. the suspence.. the hardships that any spn viewer would love to see??

yes... thats what i feel about bobby... but then again... the spn cvs have to shed some light on this...

lucifer.. wanted to build an army didnt he?? he wanted to become all powerful again.. i dont know about the summoning things... again the cvs show them whenever they want to... 😕
ahhh... this again... hasnt been shown how come crowley is able to do many things that luci cant..
lucifer is an angel gone rogue... isnt he?? he isnt a demon.. maybe thats why... 😕
about purgatory... yes thats a logical question... u have to wait whether the cvs show anything...
maybe its easy for reapers to go in and out of purgatory... even abbadon..
u r forgetting... cass doesnt have all his powers with him... they were diminished to a certain extent by his being in purgatory.. being cut off from heaven
...
Ephemera thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#7

Originally posted by: flutterby

again... its left upto the spn writers in deciding this... there r many loopholes in the story... some that the writers want us to guess for ourselves... this portal and gates thing is one of them... lets see what the spn writers think of...

yeah, but then if god came and solved all the problems... what will be left for the winchesters to do?? chadar odkhe so jaana?? 😛 then we wudnt get to over them

things would be easy... no doubt about that... but.. then how would we get to see the winchesters and cass fight it out... despite the many shortcomings... where is the story.. the suspence.. the hardships that any spn viewer would love to see??

yes... thats what i feel about bobby... but then again... the spn cvs have to shed some light on this...

lucifer.. wanted to build an army didnt he?? he wanted to become all powerful again.. i dont know about the summoning things... again the cvs show them whenever they want to... 😕
ahhh... this again... hasnt been shown how come crowley is able to do many things that luci cant..
lucifer is an angel gone rogue... isnt he?? he isnt a demon.. maybe thats why... 😕
about purgatory... yes thats a logical question... u have to wait whether the cvs show anything...
maybe its easy for reapers to go in and out of purgatory... even abbadon..
u r forgetting... cass doesnt have all his powers with him... they were diminished to a certain extent by his being in purgatory.. being cut off from heaven
...

oh i forgot about the power diminishing thing of cas...
infact loopholes are staring at us in the past few eppies..
i so doubt about crowley...each passing eppie makes me more suspicious about him...
i guess its all cvs game
lol winchesters are cute even when chaddar udko sote hein..😛
flutterby thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#8
winchesters r cute when chaddar odkhe sote hai... 😈 but more so when they r in action... ☢️

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