Toxic movie - spoiler filled thread....- Page 4

What I think about Nadia vs Ganga for Raya is that, Ganga has ambitions, she wants him to rule and Raya was doing everything for Ganga, he didn't have any ambitions

Nadia was someone who was not a part of his world, he liked the version of himself with her who could be away from all the blood, gore and mind games

The issue for him was after Nadia killed Ganga, going back to Nadia would mean that he didn't love Ganga enough so he lost that chance to normalcy

What I didn't understand was, did Ganga ask Nadia to kill her only to save Raya or to make sure he wouldn't be distracted by Nadia?

Also I realize, how little I care for everyone after interval block, Raya grew up but people around him are new, I don't care about them

Everyone I liked is gone

This movie needed focus and editing Also good music and BGM, they should have started with old Raya and his world then interval block should have been entry of young Raya and his backstory

It is not a good movie by any stretch of imagination, dialogues are atrocious (watched in Hindi)

But I just feel bad because I wanted a good story for Raya

Also Raya being womanizer didn't make any sense considering his sister was SAed and he loved her

I understood they wanted to show he had sex with women he didn't care about and with Nadia, he didn't do anything till she made him hate her by speaking against Ganga and then they do it in car and both are unimpressed by each other (awkward 😭)

Things changed for him as he asked if she thought he was a bad guy, she said no, he was toxic and "Tabahi" started

Originally posted by: asmitamohanty

... Some movies you know are flawed. You see where the execution falters, where the editing or certain choices don't quite work.I can completely see why some of them could be a deal-breaker for people. The execution isn't perfect, and that's valid criticism.

But sometimes, the core of a film touches something so deeply within you that all of that suddenly feels secondary,sometimes the heart of a film reaches somewhere in you that technique simply cannot.

That is Toxic for me.

It stopped feeling like I was merely watching a movie and started feeling like a conversation between me and the film- about guilt, trauma, love, loss and the things we carry when closure never comes.

It made me think about Raya, Ganga, Nadia, Ticket long after the screen went dark..And sometimes, when a film manages to stay with you like that, somehow... the flaws just don't matter that much anymore atleast to me...❤️

Bold: I can relate to that... completely... one finds an inherent logic - in the characters and their behaviour, in the story - which others may not see.

Thanks for explaining your view so well and passionately

Originally posted by: MsWhiskerson

What I think about Nadia vs Ganga for Raya is that, Ganga has ambitions, she wants him to rule and Raya was doing everything for Ganga, he didn't have any ambitions

Nadia was someone who was not a part of his world, he liked the version of himself with her who could be away from all the blood, gore and mind games

The issue for him was after Nadia killed Ganga, going back to Nadia would mean that he didn't love Ganga enough so he lost that chance to normalcy

What I didn't understand was, did Ganga ask Nadia to kill her only to save Raya or to make sure he wouldn't be distracted by Nadia?

Well I can only tell you the way I saw it....

Initially, Ganga absolutely was sceptical. She saw Nadia as someone who could make Raya lose focus, lose control and move away from the world they have built together. After everything they've survived, Ganga had a very specific idea of what Raya's life should look like.As you said Ganga had an ambition for Raya that Raya himself didn't seem to possess. He wasn't necessarily chasing the throne because he personally wanted to rule. He was exceptionally good at it, and Ganga saw in him the ability to conquer the world, so his rise became intertwined with her vision for him. In that sense, Raya's empire was partly an extension of his devotion to Ganga.

But then she watched him.

She saw how different he is around Nadia. And when Nadia had asked Ganga that question "Does he feel lust for me, or does he love me?"Ganga didn't give her answer but Ganga 's silence did.

And that's why I find Ganga's final words so important.

She's kneeling in front of the bullets. She knew she's not walking out alive. And she also knew that if Nadia refused to kill her, Nadia and the unborn child would be killed too.

So Ganga made the choice for both of them.

She told Nadia to kill her.

But before she died, she finally gave Nadia the answer she couldn't give her earlier:

"Yes. My brother loves you a lot."

That isn't just information.It's almost a handover. She said so much in that one line and expression

"Raya loves you.He is only yours from now on.Look after him..."

And that makes the scene so much more painful because Ganga wasn't dying to separate Raya and Nadia.

She's dying so that both of them can live.

She has spent her entire life being Raya's protector, making decisions for him, guiding his path, worrying about his future.And in her final moments, she finally accepted that she could not remain the centre of his life forever.

So she gave him back to the woman he loved.

And the cruel irony is that Raya never got to experience that gift.

Because Nadia is forced to kill the woman who was Raya's entire world.And Raya, despite knowing somewhere inside that Nadia wasn't responsible, could not emotionally separate Nadia from Ganga's death.

So Ganga's final sacrifice achieved the exact opposite of what she intended.

She wanted Nadia to live.She wanted her unborn child to live.She wanted Raya to have the woman he loved and the family he deserved .

None of it happened....

Instead, her death becomes the wall that Raya could never cross.

Neither woman actually wins.

Ganga didn't get to see Raya's future...Nadia didn't get to live that future with him.

And Raya lost both.

Ganga had finally accepted Nadia when their circumstances made that acceptance almost meaningless...

That's what made it even sadder for me...

Originally posted by: asmitamohanty

Well I can only tell you the way I saw it....

Initially, Ganga absolutely was sceptical. She saw Nadia as someone who could make Raya lose focus, lose control and move away from the world they have built together. After everything they've survived, Ganga had a very specific idea of what Raya's life should look like.As you said Ganga had an ambition for Raya that Raya himself didn't seem to possess. He wasn't necessarily chasing the throne because he personally wanted to rule. He was exceptionally good at it, and Ganga saw in him the ability to conquer the world, so his rise became intertwined with her vision for him. In that sense, Raya's empire was partly an extension of his devotion to Ganga.

But then she watched him.

She saw how different he is around Nadia. And when Nadia had asked Ganga that question "Does he feel lust for me, or does he love me?"Ganga didn't give her answer but Ganga 's silence did.

And that's why I find Ganga's final words so important.

She's kneeling in front of the bullets. She knew she's not walking out alive. And she also knew that if Nadia refused to kill her, Nadia and the unborn child would be killed too.

So Ganga made the choice for both of them.

She told Nadia to kill her.

But before she died, she finally gave Nadia the answer she couldn't give her earlier:

"Yes. My brother loves you a lot."

That isn't just information.It's almost a handover. She said so much in that one line and expression

"Raya loves you.He is only yours from now on.Look after him..."

And that makes the scene so much more painful because Ganga wasn't dying to separate Raya and Nadia.

She's dying so that both of them can live.

She has spent her entire life being Raya's protector, making decisions for him, guiding his path, worrying about his future.And in her final moments, she finally accepted that she could not remain the centre of his life forever.

So she gave him back to the woman he loved.

And the cruel irony is that Raya never got to experience that gift.

Because Nadia is forced to kill the woman who was Raya's entire world.And Raya, despite knowing somewhere inside that Nadia wasn't responsible, could not emotionally separate Nadia from Ganga's death.

So Ganga's final sacrifice achieved the exact opposite of what she intended.

She wanted Nadia to live.She wanted her unborn child to live.She wanted Raya to have the woman he loved and the family he deserved .

None of it happened....

Instead, her death becomes the wall that Raya could never cross.

Neither woman actually wins.

Ganga didn't get to see Raya's future...Nadia didn't get to live that future with him.

And Raya lost both.

Ganga had finally accepted Nadia when their circumstances made that acceptance almost meaningless...

That's what made it even sadder for me...

wow.. this way of seeing things.. its just touches the emotional core of my heart.. Ganga is the shield and ultimate mother figure for raya.. thats why he couldnt cross the barrier or accept the fact that nadia killed her sister 💔

Originally posted by: mahiwayyy

wow.. this way of seeing things.. its just touches the emotional core of my heart.. Ganga is the shield and ultimate mother figure for raya.. thats why he couldnt cross the barrier or accept the fact that nadia killed her sister 💔

You know now when I think of it circus works beautifully as a metaphorical layer.

The circus is a world of performance..and Everyone in Raya's world is performing some version of themselves.

Raya performed the ruthless gangster.He has to look invincible even when internally he is terrified of losing people.He performed for the world to see him as powerful, dangerous, untouchable.

Elizabeth performs loyalty.

Tony performs power.

Rebecca occupies the role expected of her.

Even Raya's empire is, in a sense, an elaborate performance of control only like a circus..

And then Nadia comes from an actual circus.

That's fascinating because the woman who lives inside a world of illusion is one of the few people who sees through Raya's performance.

She isn't impressed by the gangster performance..She doesn't respond to his power.She slaps him.She spits on him.She challenges him.She asks him to touch her with love, not power

In other words, she sees the man behind the act..

If Raya's criminal world represents power and control, Nadia's circus represents performance, illusion, vulnerability and the possibility of seeing beyond appearances.

And perhaps that's why Nadia is the perfect woman for Raya.

She comes from a world where everyone knows that falling is part of the performance.

Raya comes from a world where he has convinced himself that he must never fall at all.

She could have taught him how to fall without losing himself.

But He just never stayed long enough to learn.💔

Also

The first circus encounter gives him Nadia.He entered the circus the first time surrounded by spectacle and violence, and walked out having found something real.

Years later, he returned to the same world hoping, perhaps unconsciously, to find something of that life again.

But Nadia was gone, she had made her final trick and disappeared forever...

I wanted to discuss about ticket character too, after nadia and ganga, i liked ticket more.. even though he is alter-ego of raya himself.. his antiques were funny for me.. he is chaotic, funny and highly entertaining.. you see that confrontation between raya and ticket in the snow.. raya was very serious but ticket was making funny faces.. i laughed at that scene.. and raya imagines him to be a clown may be because when nadia hands over ticket to him, he was clown faced with paintings on his face.. and when he saw the younger ticket on the streets, he imagines him to be himself in his young old days rugged boy wandering in street..

Originally posted by: mahiwayyy

I wanted to discuss about ticket character too, after nadia and ganga, i liked ticket more.. even though he is alter-ego of raya himself.. his antiques were funny for me.. he is chaotic, funny and highly entertaining.. you see that confrontation between raya and ticket in the snow.. raya was very serious but ticket was making funny faces.. i laughed at that scene.. and raya imagines him to be a clown may be because when nadia hands over ticket to him, he was clown faced with paintings on his face.. and when he saw the younger ticket on the streets, he imagines him to be himself in his young old days rugged boy wandering in street..

Clown part; Waah ... that's a really interesting way to think.👏👏..I agree with it ❤️❤️

Also ....I saw few posts and reviews where they have called Yash's portrayal as Ticket as overacting or hamming....but I don't agree with it at all...

Bcz judging Ticket by the standards of a conventional, psychologically realistic antagonist misses what the character is doing.

Ticket is deliberately strange.

He is exaggerated, theatrical, loud, unpredictable, almost cartoonish at times. He moves, speaks and reacts with a kind of childish excess that can feel completely disproportionate to the world around him.

And I don't think that's accidental.

Ticket isn't supposed to "make sense" in the ordinary way.

Because Ticket isn't an ordinary man.

He is Raya's fractured guilt, grief and unresolved trauma given a personality.

So why should he behave like a completely grounded human being?

The man-child quality actually makes sense thematically. There is something frozen about Ticket. He is essentially the child Raya lost, but filtered through the adult mind of a man who cannot accept that loss.

So you get this bizarre combination of a grown man's body + a wounded child's emotional language + Raya's own rage.

Of course it becomes exaggerated.Of course he is theatrical.Of course he can seem ridiculous one second and deeply disturbing the next.

That instability is the point.

In fact, I think making Ticket too restrained or conventionally "menacing" would have made the character less interesting. Then he'd simply be another mysterious revenge figure.

Instead, Yash made him uncanny.

You don't quite know how to read him.You don't know whether to laugh at him, fear him, or feel sorry for him.

And that discomfort is exactly what the character needs.

The "overacting" is part of the design.

Yash isn't playing Ticket as though he's unaware of how strange he is.

He's leaning into it.The expressions are bigger.The movements are exaggerated.The energy is erratic.The voice and mannerisms feel almost performative.

It's closer to a caricature of a damaged personality than a naturalistic performance.

And once you understand what Ticket actually represents, that choice becomes even more interesting.

And his character and characteristics made complete sense after the twist reveal...

He isn't a fully formed independent personality with a normal adult psychology.He is Raya's mind trying to give shape to something it cannot process.

A dead child becomes an adult enemy.

That contradiction is inherently absurd.

And Yash embraces that absurdity beautifully...Yash doesn't try to make Ticket cool or traditionally intimidating.He makes him unsettling.

The performance is not trying to make Ticket "realistic."It's trying to make Raya's broken mind visible.

And for that, I think Yash has absolutely nailed it.🔥🔥

And Melissa character entering into raya's life... another women who understand human layer of raya and fascinated by him..Is she a partner or wife they didn't show but who desperately tries to save him from his past. melissa tries to pull raya into the present by creating a safe home and focusing his attention on being a good father. However, her hopes are completely shattered when ticket, violently crashes their christmas party. she watches raya completely freeze and unravel makes melissa realize the truth no matter how much love she gives him, raya is mentally trapped by his old guilt and can never move forward... realizing his dangerous past will eventually destroy their son, she packs her bags and leaves him which makes raya more dangerous..