Kollywood discussion - part 2 - Page 12

Don't try to be smart with me, Caryn.. 😛
When describing Jyothika you say color, we all exactly know what color you are talking about. It's definitely not black 😛 😉

Well.. I would say you enquired a very small section of the core audience when you asked your brothers about Jyothika's then barrel hips. B'cos for most audience that was a no-no and that's why Jyothika ended up acting in movies such as "Little John" and didn't have many offers for a while. It was when she started losing some barrel 😛 she got her film chances back. It was the hit Dhool and Kakka Kakka that put her back in the top list. As Ditty or some one mentioned before, you could see a slimmed down version of her in Kakka. She worked at it knowing that's how she'll get back on track.

You often keep referring to common people with the actresses and the way certain overweight people dress very daringly in public. But why is this reference made at all? I do see such kind day in and day out and it does not bother me at all, especially living in a country with the most obese and carefree people. They dress as they wish, just like anybody else..so what's the big deal? Tamil movie audience are not paying to watch them dance in those clothes.. are they?

My point was only in the movies, these days actresses don't look appealing in any way to the general audience if they don't have a body to reveal. Exceptions are the likes of Namitha and you know why - and Namitha is not a A-list heroine any way. I will say it now and always - Jyothika definitely does not have a midriff to flaunt.

If men of today are willing to accept just acting talents, then what happened to the beautiful Sneha, Sada? Why are we seeing more of Shriya/Trisha with the top heroes? Not a lot of people actually think that Asin can act as well. Asin who I thought wasn't the exposing kind, mildly shocked me with the disgusting opening scene in Pokkiri. She might as well have shown some cleavage - Shriya's exposure pales in comparison. 😆

You must live in a La-La world to say today's men expect to "see actresses for their acting abilities and not what they can show off". You can get a sense of what today's male audience wants if you had watched Sun Tv's kanavu kanni program. How many men do you think voted for Shriya/Nayantara for their exposure as opposed to Sneha/Sada/Bhavna for their acting? If you read tamil mags(I know you don't), you can see what the general tamil audience wants to see in a heroine. Do you think the Directors are crazy to bring in and deal with those who can't act? Won't their job be simpler if they cast those who can actually act? Why.. have you ever thought? B'cos they want to make money and they know the audience pulse, when they pay big money to cast Shriya/Trisha. BTW, Trisha is the highest paid actress in the industry at 65 lakhs.. with Shriya in close heels. The others are a good 20 lakhs behind. Won't it make much more sense to the producers to cast those who can act and also demand less money?

And who said Radhika hasn't exposed? She's a good actress but she also has done her exposing bit in a lot of movies starting with her very first one - going way over the boundaries set for exposure in those days.

And now.. this is news to tamil movie audience, when you said Shriya was decently dressed in ATM songs? Are you sure you watched all the songs? 😛 😛

Jenim,

if you mean that crappy show from suntv, Kannavu kanni, then its just
some college boys who was after one thing..lol and them are just
audience from A centers but if u ask people from B and C centers, I am
sure you will get some other answers 😉 Remember, ATM was a big flop
cause it couldnt steal the hearts of B and B centers audience, that is
where Vel scored a lot and become hit.

Right today, I read it was Nayantara who is the highest paid actress in the
whole South, with 1 crores.

Last thing Shriya was in ATM songs was decent🤢 she will come in
traditional outfits and yuke..it will show her u all know mean what I mean
but compared to Sivaji, she was a little bit covered😆

Talking about brothers, no one at my house likes Shriya aswell, they
prefer Asin and Trisha 😡 and yeah, they likes Jo and Simran aswell 😉

It was Jothika who was the highest paid actress in Tamil cinema ina particular yr,beating Trisha , I don't remember which one. And it was after her retirement that Nayan tara and many others raised their fees. 😊And on the 'barrel' subject, I prefer to stay away from this, for I've had enough arguing in the JDJ forum.They have all warned me that if I argue once more, my warning levels will be raised. 😕

But it was a very fat Jo whom we saw in Chandramukhi, Mayaavi and Mozhi.How do you explain the reason why those movies became hits?

Meli -

I was just explaining in reference to why the Directors go after slim beauties, as opposed to those who can act. It was said in the context of what most male audience in general prefer to see on screen. The Kanavu kanni was just an example.. don't take it to heart 😆 But such *wonderful* feedback from audience, does give the directors enough to ponder on how they can make the slim beauties shed even more..😆

So Nayan gets a big 1 aa? Ammaadi..
See what shedding clothes got her! Brilliant! 😆
I also heard that even though they offered big bucks to her, she refused to go glam for YNM. Paavam Dhanush 😉

Ditty -

I had to come back to revise/refine my comments..

Yes, Jyo was the highest paid actress if you can split her era in two - i.e. the pre-barrel and the post-barrel era. The time she was filming movies like 12B, Little John etc., she had no offers and was deperately trying to get back to the top spot. Where she was doing 5 or 6 films a year, before she gained her barrel, she hardly had 2 films per year when her barrel got bigger.

First of all, if you got your news right, it was Simran who was booked and paid an advance to, for the role of ChandraMukhi - as recommended by Rajini. When they started shooting some scenes, Sirman made the Producers aware that she had become pregnant and voluntarily returned her advance for the movie and recommended Jyothika. This was a very well known fact. Simran gave interviews at that time saying it was a tough decision to let an offer go where she could work with Rajini, since that had been her wish for a very long time. But she said at that time, her priority was to raise a family!
Jyothika after the success of Chandramukhi said in an interview that she is thankful to Simran for letting her have the chance to play a role of a lifetime.

Besides, ChandraMukhi was not a hit b'cos of just Jyothika. I can't imagine this movie becoming a super duper hit as it is, without the SUPER STAR in it. Even though we had Ramya Krishnan and Jyothika playing pivotal roles in some of Rajini's movies, can any one deny that these movies would have been hits that they were (in the Tamil film industry), if there was no Super star? Rajini himself very carefully molded the story line wtih Vasu, after his BABA failure to make sure that this was going to be a super duper hit. Any good actress would have fit the bill, for the role of ChandraMukhi.

Second of all, I understand you are a fan of both Surya & Jyothika. But Mayavi was not a hit AFAIK!

Thirdly, Jyothika did not do any revealing numbers exposing her barrel in Mozhi. All we saw was her acting talents - only. I don't deny that she did a good job there, but it was mainly Radha Mohan's success and also PrakashRaj's good marketing skills that made Mozhi, a big hit. It was a director's movie and he made sure that the entire cast gave their best. So, to term it as Jyothika's hit - I would have to take it with a grain of salt. Radhamohan's Azhagiya Theeye was a very big hit as well and with a cast that was hardly known. These are all Director's movies - the cast becomes secondary. I'm pretty sure Abhiyum.. is going to be a huge hit as well. PrakashRaj seems to have mastered the act of marketing.. that I can say for sure!

I remember how all of this started, when responding to a barrel comment that Suram posted, I said Jyothika had barrel hips in 12B. I still would say that! I can't believe in the process, we are discussing her acting talents, her hits, misses, that she can even deliver a baby etc.. Wow..

People fail to keep this discussion within the realms of Kollywood and take it personally one on one. While responding to personal comments, I can't believe that I even had to say that I'm coming to terms with my own weight and that I'm not prejudiced against over weight people in general. Unawares, I was led intto saying some personal things as well.

When all I said / and wanted to say was this is how I would like to see my heroines - slim and not barrel-ly. If any of you like your heroines' barrel, please feel free to enjoy the beauty of the barrel. Do not force down the throat of people who don't like the barrel and question them "Why can't you accept the barrel?". I would have to say that this is getting old on me 😉 For, I don't want to be obsessed discussing Jyothika's barrel anyway.. I've had enough of it the last few days 😆

Jenim,

No one is taking this personally. 😛 😛 😛 Well not me anyway. I am defending them. 😊 I used common examples, to show that actress are ordinary people first. Just like you said "do not force down the throat..." it should apply to you as well. 😉 You should not force your views that a barrell is a no no to actress.

Where you come from - land of carefree - don't you all accept actress like Rosanne, Oprah, etc? Showing their clevage etc. You do accept Ellen who is a gay.

Why can't you all accept barrelled Kollywood actress? yes, I am big fan of Jo, and I am not in favour of Simran, but if you had commented the about Simran in terms of barrelled, I wld have come to Simran's defence. Sorry that is in me. 😃 😃

Cinemagoers pays a pittance. If they want to see a slim and sulty actress dancer then they should pay more, if they want to oogle.

Cinemagoers are not the owners of the actresses. They pay to watch the whole movie and not the barrell or the actress. If the barreled actress was given the right costume to wear, she has to wear. When an actress is given credit, you say no, it is everybody's esp the Director. But when an actress is exposing her barrel, it is her fault and not the Directors is it? When the film failed, it is because of the barreled actress not the Director? Chandramukhi was success because of credit to Rajni, but not to others? You are contradicting your ownself aren't you my friend? 😆 (btw, it is not easy to learn sign language in short period, but Jyo has done it very well, with fast movement of her fingers, as compared to all other 3 actors 😉

Whether to expose or not, it is all up to the directors and the crew. If the actress is ready to do it, then she is. If you want, watch it, if you don't want, close your eyes, and just listen to the music. 😉 In Malaysia, when the songs appear, that is the time men and women will visit the toilet or go for a smoke. You could do the same.

If any audience form India/Asia commented about the barrel, I would not have argued this much with them. I would have said in me, something like "okay, this is your mentality" and left to that. But when you said that, I was surprised since you come from the land of free. You of all the people should not have made comments like this. It is like you advocating this is right and this is wrong. Maybe it is for you, but not for some of us. No offence, but this is how it came across to me from you.

Actresses are human too. Let's criticise on their acting, on their performance, on their presentation, on their clothes. Let's leave the barrels, cellulite, stretch marks, pimples, all alone. We all have them sooner or later. (yes, this is personal)

I still think Sherya's clothing is more decent than Sivaji's. So there.......... 😛 😛 😛

Originally posted by: Caryn

Jenim,

No one is taking this personally. Well not me anyway. I am defending them. I used common examples, to show that actress are ordinary people first. Just like you said "do not force down the throat..." it should apply to you as well. You should not force your views that a barrell is a no no to actress.

Where you come from - land of carefree - don't you all accept actress like Rosanne, Oprah, etc? Showing their clevage etc. You do accept Ellen who is a gay.

Why can't you all accept barrelled Kollywood actress? yes, I am big fan of Jo, and I am not in favour of Simran, but if you had commented the about Simran in terms of barrelled, I wld have come to Simran's defence. Sorry that is in me.

Cinemagoers pays a pittance. If they want to see a slim and sulty actress dancer then they should pay more, if they want to oogle.

Cinemagoers are not the owners of the actresses. They pay to watch the whole movie and not the barrell or the actress. If the barreled actress was given the right costume to wear, she has to wear. Whether to expose or not, it is all up to the directors and the crew. If the actress is ready to do it, then she is. If you want, watch it, if you don't want, close your eyes, and just listen to the music. In Malaysia, when the songs appear, that is the time men and women will visit the toilet or go for a smoke. You could do the same.

If any audience form India/Asia commented about the barrel, I would not have argued this much with them. I would have said in me, something like "okay, this is your mentality". But when you said that, I was surprised since you come from the land of free. You of all the people should not have made comments like this. It is like you advocating this is right and this is wrong. Maybe it is for you, but not for some of us. No offence, but this is how it came across to me from you.

Actresses are human too. Let's criticise on their acting, on their performance, on their presentation, on their clothes. Let's leave the barrels, cellulite, stretch marks, pimples, all alone. We all have them sooner or later. (yes, this is personal)

I still think Sherya's clothing is more decent than Sivaji's. So there....... 😛 😛 😛

Caryn -

I did not want to take this any further.. but you make me to, by certain accusations 😛

First off, you started the discussion calling me a stereotype, when I said I couldn't take stocky heroines. And then I had to explain, that it's my preference and not to categorize me under any stereotype. I did not ever tell any one here what's right and what's wrong - Or that they should agree with my views on Jyothika. Weren't I just discussing the fat/slim trend in Kollywood vis-a-vis Jyothika's film career?

I did not force down any body's throat my views, in fact if any one did it, it could've been you. If you had observed, you would notice whatever I expressed were just my preferences - what I'd like to see in a heroine, not what you or Ditty or whoever else has to see, on screen. My arguments were based on what happened to certain actress' Kollywood career when they were on the heavy side. And what's happening in the current trend - that stocky seems to be out and slim is in. These are Kollywood facts and the discussion should've been more on the lines of proving or disproving those facts. More like the discussion that Ditty and I have been having here, based on facts. I reiterate that my views were based on just my own interests and preferences. And mostly what I observed during Jyothika's film career post-barrel

But your discussion was in the lines of why couldn't I personally accept a fat person as a heroine. When such personal questions come around, then that's where forcing down the throat begins. . I didn't go around telling you why should or shouldn't you personally like or dislike Jyothika for her physical attributes.. Did I?

Whereas your discussion was more on personal lines - am I like some Chinese that you know in Asia who never admit they are slim. Just why are you asking me these questions? If you like your actresses fat, then so be it. Why do you come around asking me, why don't I accept the same?

For argument sake, if you had said Simran was slim and that's a big No-No to you, I wouldn't come around saying... "Oh Caryn.. people come in all diff shapes and sizes, so you have to accept them for what they are.. an actress is an actress .. And you should see actresses only for their acting talents..blah blah". That's b'cos you are entitled to your opinion on any public figure. If their acting alone is what draws you to the movies, then fine. You can't tell me that's what I should be looking for in an actress too. If you want, you can discuss the trend that's in Kollywood, not what I should be looking for in a actress or advocating what I should be doing, if I don't want to watch barrel-like hips. I know exactly what I should or should not be doing when those songs come around. I don't need a teacher around me.

And if you don't want to discuss physical features of an actress, then stop there. You just can't come around telling people what they can or cannot discuss about an actress. I don't think the forum states that you cannot discuss barrel hips or cellulite or pimple on actresses. Not that I'm aware of!

If it's not the audience who decides which actor or actress is in, then who else decides it?

Why would my place of residence have any bearing on my likes/dislikes in Kollywood? And what's the Indian/ Asian mentality here? And what's your generalization aka stereo-typing of the Indian mentality here? Did I ever tell you that I'm reflecting the views of Americans here on this board and specifically on Jyothika? Why would you tell me that I should not have made those comments on Jyothika? Last I heard this is a free forum and aptly titled "Kollywood Discussion".

I see that you've edited your comments since I last quoted it and went on a break, before finishing my last comment. 😉

I did not say it is the actress' fault to expose her midriff - whether barrel like or not. Please don't quote me wrong! In my personal view as I said already, it is a torture to watch when the exposure is of a certain barrel like figure.

You have been misquoting me all the time. When did I say when a film fails, it is b'cos of a certain barrel-like actress?

I said Mozhi is not a hit b'cos of Jyothika alone and ditto to Chandramukhi, in response to Ditty's comments. Where was I contradicting myself - in fact, I've been consistently saying that the two movies have been hits due to the Directors' and other actors contribution as well, besides Jyothika's. These movies would have been hits anyway, b'cos one is a Director's movie and the other SuperStar's. I admit Jyothika's performance in these two were good, but that's not the only reason the movies were hits b'cos of the aforementioned reasons.

I just want to make one comment.

Chandramukhi was a hit because of Jyothika, not because of Rajni. It was her performance that outshone all of them. To say that any good actress would have done a similar job is grossly underestimating the talents of Jyo. Ditto Mozhi. It could be director's movie or Rajni's movie - that was what was expected by the public - but that Jyo carried it off with aplomb to the extent of overshadowing Rajni is due to her talents, barrel-hips notwithstanding.