Give Isha Salman a break - Page 2

Originally posted by: angake

@Chandramukhi, agree with everything you said except for the bold. I don't think that would have happened. Isha established herself as a phenomenal dancer in the first few episodes of the show. While she did not have a large voting bank I don't think she would have ever been voted off prior to the likes of Sanath, Talat, Jayati, Ravi, Pratyusha and so on. Yes there are people who vote for contestants purely based on their popularity but there are also people who vote for the dance too. So while she may not have been able to compete with few as far as voting bank is concerned I think she absolutely would have been safe compared to most of the other contestants. She did have the liberty to experiment more earlier on but I think they as a pair just didn't feel comfortable to do that. What was more important was making sure they came out on the top week after week which is fine but then towards the end of the competition viewers start viewing the performances as monotonous which is sad.

The bold part I have used is for their current status. Thus I also said right after that they should have done something different in their earlier acts. So yes I completely agree with you about them trying in the initial stage. So I am right on it with you 😃But I don't know if it will be feasible for them step out now at this level of competition, but it will still be great to see them in a different avatar !!!

My biggest problem with all the Isha-Salman criticism on the forum is that members here always feel the need to undermine the complexity of their performances. It's fine to not like Isha and Salman's performances for whatever reason, be it Isha's expressions, lack of versatility, or Salman's "limited" choreography for Isha (these seem to be the major complaints anyway), but at least you should respect their dancing. Salman and Isha's performances have been the most complex and difficult dances on Jhalak this season!

What Isha does is impossible for most people and most of the contestants on the show. Sure, it may be easier for her to do it than some of the other contestants, but that doesn't mean that Salman and Isha don't put in hard work or effort into their performances. If this was an international competition, I'm sure Salman-Isha would get a lot of praise for doing what they do. What makes me laugh most is when people "criticize" Isha's performances and then back up their argument with how contestants like Karan Wahi and Gurmeet are better performers. HAH.

Edit: I am also rooting for Isha and Salman to do an awesome hip-hop or classical number just to prove themselves to all their critics. I don't think they're stupid, I'm sure they realize their fans are waiting to see that. And I'm also sure the creatives have put such a performance on hold just to get closer to the finale.

Originally posted by: MrManagement

I absolutely agree. Also, everyone keeps on criticizing salman-isha because the judges give them 30s, how is that they there fault? There are that damn good. Isha-Salman have done so many forms of dance form Ariel to Bollywood to European. All of Isha-Salman performance are at calibre with the international dancers. Even today on JDJ, the international choreographers were stunned by their performance. Another thing that makes me mad is that if there is already a topic that is criticizing isha-salman why don't people just post on that, is it always necessary to open a new topic to talk about the same thing😕. Earlier today, page 1-3 were filled with the same cliche posts about salman isha.

On a side note, I think this forum should be named Isha-Salman instead of JDJ forum because almost every topic is about them😆.

Agree, like so much.

I'm sick of seeing the same hating posts against Isha and Salman. If its not dance then it's some other thing. The fact that emerges is, people realize and very well know that Isha could win this competition fair and square because as much as ALOT of people will disagree, they deserve it without any doubts! Not that no one else does but they have been there from the start, along with Gurmeet/Shampa. It is obvious to see who out of the two is more deserving and in essence, more deserving of the whole lot.

I don't really support any couple in particular, I don't even enjoy Isha's performances all the time but truth be told she has given some really amazing performances. My favourite is still the horror one and I've never seen something like that - before or after. A lot of people said it was copied off Sushant and Shampa's from last season so I went back to see it but I saw nothing similar. Oh wait except the back walk - umm so what? It's a known fact ghosts walk backwards.

At that time I thought people probably couldn't take the brilliant performance so the hate was understood. Then Isha fell, everyone rejoiced and now she's climbed back up and the hate starts all over again. How true is your title, give them a break.

People need to give credit where it's due. I'll be honest, I didn't enjoy any of the performances on Saturday but they were not all mediocre. I still sat through the whole thing. I however didn't like Isha's expressions at all and neither were Rashmis any better - if there were any.

And it's absolutely right that choreographers should use the artists plus points at this stage in the competition. If Salman sticks to the theme whilst exploiting Ishas abilities, why can't people just watch and enjoy rather than pinpointing how it's acrobats or whatever. Who cares? At the end of the day, no matter how much we blame the judges, they have no contribution to who stays or who goes, if they did I'm sure Shibani or Darsheel would've stayed.

Originally posted by: *Woh Ajnabee*

My biggest problem with all the Isha-Salman criticism on the forum is that members here always feel the need to undermine the complexity of their performances. It's fine to not like Isha and Salman's performances for whatever reason, be it Isha's expressions, lack of versatility, or Salman's "limited" choreography for Isha (these seem to be the major complaints anyway), but at least you should respect their dancing. Salman and Isha's performances have been the most complex and difficult dances on Jhalak this season!

What Isha does is impossible for most people and most of the contestants on the show. Sure, it may be easier for her to do it than some of the other contestants, but that doesn't mean that Salman and Isha don't put in hard work or effort into their performances. If this was an international competition, I'm sure Salman-Isha would get a lot of praise for doing what they do. What makes me laugh most is when people "criticize" Isha's performances and then back up their argument with how contestants like Karan Wahi and Gurmeet are better performers. HAH.

Edit: I am also rooting for Isha and Salman to do an awesome hip-hop or classical number just to prove themselves to all their critics. I don't think they're stupid, I'm sure they realize their fans are waiting to see that. And I'm also sure the creatives have put such a performance on hold just to get closer to the finale.

Thanks for the bold part, it was definitely needed to be said that "everyone works hard". Also, there are so many ways to criticize a contestant, but when people keep on repeating the same, logical or not, simply because one doesn't like the contestant or his/her favorite couldn't score better, keeps baffling me every time

@blue, 😆😆 I am glad somebody other than me have noticed and read such lame statements. Anyone without the blinders can see the obvious, but people tend to have a blind eye when it comes to defending their favorites that they don't even realize what they have said in their posts 😲

Originally posted by: MrManagement

I absolutely agree. Also, everyone keeps on criticizing salman-isha because the judges give them 30s, how is that they there fault? There are that damn good. Isha-Salman have done so many forms of dance form Ariel to Bollywood to European. All of Isha-Salman performance are at calibre with the international dancers. Even today on JDJ, the international choreographers were stunned by their performance. Another thing that makes me mad is that if there is already a topic that is criticizing isha-salman why don't people just post on that, is it always necessary to open a new topic to talk about the same thing😕. Earlier today, page 1-3 were filled with the same cliche posts about salman isha.

On a side note, I think this forum should be named Isha-Salman instead of JDJ forum because almost every topic is about them😆.

@Underlined: I agree completely, even I was stunned to see the jaw-dropping expressions of DWTS choreographers. I think the channel purposely kept Isha and Rithvik's performance for the end for these choreographers to see the level of dancing and creativity on JDJ.

Okay, since it was dense reading, I'll break it down (for my sake) to what I think you're pointing out to us:

1. Today's epi was about showcasing your strength and Isha did that by showcasing her flexibility.

I agree with this because this is justified: Isha's the queen of twisting limbs like nobody can. This is serious tough business and the way she makes it look easy is just damn wow-worthy. I can't even make my little pinky do the wave so she has my respect in that.

2. You said, "it seems the same flexibility is her biggest weakness cuz people have started to pay attention only to that and ignore the rest,"

Now, in your own words, there is flexibility and something else. To me (and I only speak for myself), that something else was nothing else. The whole act looked like complicated contortionist yoga poses, not dancing. I'm just a simple person, with no dance background whatsoever, simply observing with my untrained eye. This might bring error to my judgment of her performance so I'm sorry for that. I just thought I'd state how I saw things (which would be different from people who study or do dance). To me, dance is a summation of definitive, rhythmic movements and body expressions. There were bodily expressions but no rhythmic movements in today's performance. I forgot what dance form they were doing…if you or someone can mention it, I can do a mini research and see how that dance form should be done and how much they justified it. Till then, this is all I can say.

3. There is nothing wrong with using flexibility (her strength) to hide her weaknesses.

I also agree with this. A person should come out to perform with all plus points to make a really impactful good performance. This is usually done by showcasing strengths and concealing weaknesses. In the beginning, Isha's crazy flexibility was a wow factor. I remember thinking that this girl was going to go far and I was going to like and root for her. But then the novelty wore off. Her flexibility was there for a large part of all her successive performances (and today's just took the cake by her flexibility being the only thing going on) with little variation in them (split, flip, some basic dance steps of the dance form, split, flip, split, flip, etc) and I got bored because the novelty was gone and my mind started wandering. A person can show off all their strengths all they want week after week, but we're humans…..we get desensitized when our brains catch on the repetition and it starts to tune the performance out. That's why her performances become unmemorable and barely an impact is left. When there's no impact, then it's not a wow performance…no matter how technically purrr-fect it is. The feeling of blandness negates the performance.

Now other contestants do bring around changes so they keep my brain on alert because there's novelty to it. Gurmeet always becomes a whole new character every week (vampire, lion, peacock, patriot, etc) so despite his rusty dancing at times, his acts have been more memorable than Isha's. Bharti's repetition is that she does comedy but the comedy is varied and even with that variation she has more variation between her acts: different dance forms, different moods, etc. She did an emotional contemporary act, a romantic rumba, an energetic lavnia, a superbly funny afro jazz, bits of hip-hop and bhangra (both of which were not well done, btw).

Oh, will you look at that? I managed to name the different acts of two weaker-than-Isha dancers and yet the only Isha acts I could remember was that scary-out-of-the bag one (and only because of the makeup and theatrics) and the three-people pole act (this one I genuinely liked). I couldn't even do this sort of stunt purposefully even if I tried. Her acts really bore me and I feel like pressing the fast-forward button because the novelty, the wow-factor isn't there. She might as well not have been technically perfect.

And while we're on the topic of being technically perfect, I feel the way judges grade her are not with the same standards used to grade others. Yesterday, Remo pointed out minor fumbles in Rithvick's lifts and gave a low result because of that but Isha's minor fumbles with 2 lifts were blatantly ignored and she got a full 30. Today, Rashmi received cuts for her marks for everything else being alright but just not sharp movements in two tiny spots….while the slide that Isha did around Salman's body at the end of her act was not flowing smoothly (her head banged against one of his legs and I felt she should've held onto his arm and let her lower body slide to the right position before letting go). Yet she received perfect score. Either Rashmi and Rithvick should get 30s too or Isha should get the same scores as them.

To sum up, I think the people who are saying Isha and Salman's acts are repetitive, or they don't do other dance forms, etc, etc, aren't really expressing themselves too well. It's the snide comments, politically incorrect statements, and/or devil-may-care, frivolous attitude with which they respond mask what they mean. It seems like they're not saying it's wrong for Isha to showcase her flexibility every week…but that damn, it bores us all to tears. So in laymen's terms we all groan, say, "Ugggh," and "OMG, for the love of sweet pie, why did she get a 30???"

Btw, the argument, "it works for judges so it should work for us" is just a….bad argument, sorry to say. It's like saying if it works for the anti-Isha or the sour grapes (as I guess I might be called), then it works for the rest of the people on the forum…..which isn't true because it obviously didn't work for you. You found justification in Isha and I didn't.

So there it is. 😆 I hope this post was un-offending as possible and it explains things.

Originally posted by: MadameX

Okay, since it was dense reading, I'll break it down (for my sake) to what I think you're pointing out to us:

1. Today's epi was about showcasing your strength and Isha did that by showcasing her flexibility.

I agree with this because this is justified: Isha's the queen of twisting limbs like nobody can. This is serious tough business and the way she makes it look easy is just damn wow-worthy. I can't even make my little pinky do the wave so she has my respect in that.

Thanks for agreeing in this aspect of her strength. That wave thing was simply awesome.

2. You said, "it seems the same flexibility is her biggest weakness cuz people have started to pay attention only to that and ignore the rest," This statement was made for all her performances, cuz people have issues not only with today's performance but others as well.

Now, in your own words, there is flexibility and something else. To me (and I only speak for myself), that something else was nothing else. The whole act looked like complicated contortionist yoga poses, not dancing. I'm just a simple person, with no dance background whatsoever, simply observing with my untrained eye. This might bring error to my judgment of her performance so I'm sorry for that. I just thought I'd state how I saw things (which would be different from people who study or do dance). To me, dance is a summation of definitive, rhythmic movements and body expressions. There were bodily expressions but no rhythmic movements in today's performance. I forgot what dance form they were doing'if you or someone can mention it, I can do a mini research and see how that dance form should be done and how much they justified it. Till then, this is all I can say.

Again I'll just agree to disagree since it is individual preference and everyone rates the dance differently depending on their background. I agree today act was completely emphasized on flexibility and no steps. But I thought some of fthe postures and body language went with the song. So I agree with you to an extend but not completely. I am not sure of the dance form, will google it out myself.

3. There is nothing wrong with using flexibility (her strength) to hide her weaknesses.

I also agree with this. A person should come out to perform with all plus points to make a really impactful good performance. This is usually done by showcasing strengths and concealing weaknesses. In the beginning, Isha's crazy flexibility was a wow factor. I remember thinking that this girl was going to go far and I was going to like and root for her. But then the novelty wore off. Her flexibility was there for a large part of all her successive performances (and today's just took the cake by her flexibility being the only thing going on) with little variation in them (split, flip, some basic dance steps of the dance form, split, flip, split, flip, etc) and I got bored because the novelty was gone and my mind started wandering. A person can show off all their strengths all they want week after week, but we're humans'..we get desensitized when our brains catch on the repetition and it starts to tune the performance out. That's why her performances become unmemorable and barely an impact is left. When there's no impact, then it's not a wow performance'no matter how technically purrr-fect it is. The feeling of blandness negates the performance.

Now other contestants do bring around changes so they keep my brain on alert because there's novelty to it. Gurmeet always becomes a whole new character every week (vampire, lion, peacock, patriot, etc) so despite his rusty dancing at times, his acts have been more memorable than Isha's. Bharti's repetition is that she does comedy but the comedy is varied and even with that variation she has more variation between her acts: different dance forms, different moods, etc. She did an emotional contemporary act, a romantic rumba, an energetic lavnia, a superbly funny afro jazz, bits of hip-hop and bhangra (both of which were not well done, btw).

From bold I am guessing, for you get up and act takes precedence over dancing. That's completely fine if you call that versatility. For me get up is more or less what GC brings to the stage than dancing and there are times even I have enjoyed the performance if I were to look beyond GC's stiffness and clumsy movements. Again fine with me. With Bharti, yes she has done different dance forms, no denying there, how likable they were for me, I'll leave that up to me. Since you are trying to look for versatility in Isha, I'll list some for you, Paso Dablo, bachata, afro jazz, tango, horror act, bollywood, puppet act, aerial act and many others. For me I can see the variety here, but if you can't and want to call it "the same", again fine with me.

Oh, will you look at that? I managed to name the different acts of two weaker-than-Isha dancers and yet the only Isha acts I could remember was that scary-out-of-the bag one (and only because of the makeup and theatrics) and the three-people pole act (this one I genuinely liked). I couldn't even do this sort of stunt purposefully even if I tried. Her acts really bore me and I feel like pressing the fast-forward button because the novelty, the wow-factor isn't there. She might as well not have been technically perfect.

Thanks for saying Isha is stronger than Bharti and GC in terms of dancing😃 I will definitely agree here. Rest your opinion. FYI: I like fast forwarding Bharti, Karan and sometimes GC's performances. It feels that you are desperately looking for versatility in Isha, but your definition doesn't seem to fit mine or others who think Isha brings more to the stage than her lifts and acrobats. Thus what I see can't be seen by you. Doesn't matter to me at all. It doesn't change my opinion about her dancing. I still get wowed by some of her steps and will do so until I think it isn't working for "me"

And while we're on the topic of being technically perfect, I feel the way judges grade her are not with the same standards used to grade others. Yesterday, Remo pointed out minor fumbles in Rithvick's lifts and gave a low result because of that but Isha's minor fumbles with 2 lifts were blatantly ignored and she got a full 30. Today, Rashmi received cuts for her marks for everything else being alright but just not sharp movements in two tiny spots'.while the slide that Isha did around Salman's body at the end of her act was not flowing smoothly (her head banged against one of his legs and I felt she should've held onto his arm and let her lower body slide to the right position before letting go). Yet she received perfect score. Either Rashmi and Rithvick should get 30s too or Isha should get the same scores as them.

I do not have technical knowledge, so I'll leave judging to the judges. Sure there are times when one might ponder over the disparity of the marks. But it is a done deal. You or I can't change that unfortunately.

To sum up, I think the people who are saying Isha and Salman's acts are repetitive, or they don't do other dance forms, etc, etc, aren't really expressing themselves too well. It's the snide comments, politically incorrect statements, and/or devil-may-care, frivolous attitude with which they respond mask what they mean. It seems like they're not saying it's wrong for Isha to showcase her flexibility every week'but that damn, it bores us all to tears. So in laymen's terms we all groan, say, "Ugggh," and "OMG, for the love of sweet pie, why did she get a 30???

Again not up to me whether you find something boring or not. Individual preference. And sure people can say what they want to say, but the problem I have is with people opening million threads on the same issue, can I do something about it, Nope, but I can definitely open a thread to explain my views. And that's what I did. There are people who don't enjoy Isha's dance, but there are also others who do.

About getting 30, it seems from the trend of the acts, that as long as dance looks almost flawless, they get 30, and here I am talking about what looks flawless to the judges. So I do not have any right to ask you not to be disappointed. Go right ahead. But for me, she does deserve that perfect score and not saying in any way that others don't.

Btw, the argument, "it works for judges so it should work for us" is just a'.bad argument, sorry to say. It's like saying if it works for the anti-Isha or the sour grapes (as I guess I might be called), then it works for the rest of the people on the forum'..which isn't true because it obviously didn't work for you. You found justification in Isha and I didn't.

I never said that if it works for judges, then it has to work for you."I don't speak for others". I only speak for myself, and that's the big difference. I guess most of the posts on JDJ forum are more of an imposing post for you to not see the difference. So you can re read my post. I had only pointed out that if their act works with judges, I got no complains. And that if judges are happy with it, why should they change their dancing style. You can definitely have your own judgement, I am not going to hang you to death for the difference 😆😆 But please do not read into something which isn't there.

So there it is. 😆 I hope this post was un-offending as possible and it explains things.

Again to reiterate, I only speak for myself and what works with me. I am not one of those fans who think their favorites has to be liked by others else they are mental.

P.S: Thanks for the dissection